Jesus came to save Israel only (Epistles, preach, disciples, Holy Spirit)
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As I understood it the Jews were to be first, but Jesus did talk with the Gentile centurion and missions among the Gentiles started right away.
Hello Thomas R,
It really depends on the context of what Gentiles is representing....at times, it is the nations apart from Israel, and most often, especially throughout Romans, it is diaspora Israelites representing the nations thereof. Blessings.
There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews...
And your covenant with death shall be disannulled, and your agreement with hell shall not stand; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, then ye shall be trodden down by it.
Christ came to disannul this covenant with death. That covenant was with Israel.
I admit, I don't totally understand the premise of the thread, so I'm not even sure I disagree with it. But, if Christ came to save Israel, and salvation for ALL people is OF Israel/the elect, and Christ is the head of Israel/the elect ... then doesn't that mean that Christ came to save ALL people?
I admit, I don't totally understand the premise of the thread, so I'm not even sure I disagree with it. But, if Christ came to save Israel, and salvation for ALL people is OF Israel/the elect, and Christ is the head of Israel/the elect ... then doesn't that mean that Christ came to save ALL people?
Hey Pleroo,
Romans 11:12 Now if the fall of them [be] the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?
This tells us that Israel's salvation, who are the elect, blesses the world.
It is because of Israel salvation in Christ, that the world is the beneficiary of that salvation. In turn, Christ came to save Israel, and because of His work in saving the remnant/elect in Israel, the world can benefit and be God's children.
Romans 11:12 Now if the fall of them [be] the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?
This tells us that Israel's salvation, who are the elect, blesses the world.
It is because of Israel salvation in Christ, that the world is the beneficiary of that salvation. In turn, Christ came to save Israel, and because of His work in saving the remnant/elect in Israel, the world can benefit and be God's children.
So ... yes? I'm honestly not trying to be obtuse, it just seems that although the thread title is that Christ came only to save Israel, you're really saying that Christ came to save all, in a roundabout way.
So ... yes? I'm honestly not trying to be obtuse, it just seems that although the thread title is that Christ came only to save Israel, you're really saying that Christ came to save all, in a roundabout way.
Don't worry friend, I don't believe you are being obtuse at all
What the scriptures spell out, at least have in my studies thus far, is that Christ saved Israel. That salvation that saved His remnant, benefited mankind. So in turn, yes, the result of His work in Israel dominoed to the rest of humanity, His divine purpose was so that Israel would be saved. Remember Isa 42, and the call Isaiah implored unto Israel, that is, the whole house of, to be a light to the Nations. They failed, Christ came to fixed the microcosmic theocracy, so that they, the nations, could come to know God and serve Him as He originally intended for Israel to do in the first place.
Why is everybody making this so complicated? Jesus Christ stated (in Matthew 15:24) the following: "I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel." In other words, his own ministry was specifically to the Israelites. Prior to His ascension, however, He commissioned His Apostles (in Matthew 28:19) to "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations." Clearly, the message of His gospel was for all mankind. What a lot of discussion over such a simple question.
John 10:14-16 "I am the good shephard, aand know my sheep, and am known of mine. As the father knoweth me, even so know I the father, and I lay down my life for the sheep. And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shephard."
Jesus is speaking here to the Pharisees. He is prophesizing about his upcoming crucifiction, and saying that he is doing so for the Jews. His sheep are the Jews. Then, he says he also has other sheep, not of this fold (other people who are not the Jews) who he is also there to bring with him. He is speaking of groups that are not the Jews, such as the Gentiles.
So he does tell us he came to save more than just the Jews.
His sheep are the Jews. Then, he says he also has other sheep, not of this fold (other people who are not the Jews) who he is also there to bring with him. He is speaking of groups that are not the Jews, such as the Gentiles.
So he does tell us he came to save more than just the Jews.
I agree that He came to save more than just the Jews, but I disagree as to whom the "other sheep, not of this fold" are. He said that His own personal mission was only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. The "other sheep" who were "not of this fold" but who would also "hear His voice" would have had to be Jews that were not part of the group to whom He was speaking. They wouldn't just hear His message or His gospel as taught by His Apostles. They would hear His voice; they would hear it through Him. His message was for all. His own ministry was to the Jews specifically and exclusively. He would have had to be referring to Jews when He said "other sheep not of this fold."
Why is everybody making this so complicated? Jesus Christ stated (in Matthew 15:24) the following: "I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel." In other words, his own ministry was specifically to the Israelites. Prior to His ascension, however, He commissioned His Apostles (in Matthew 28:19) to "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations." Clearly, the message of His gospel was for all mankind. What a lot of discussion over such a simple question.
Good point.
sciotamicks, Romans 11 continues on with this idea:
25 I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers and sisters, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in, 26 and in this way all Israel will be saved.
So it says all Israel will be saved, but not until the full number of Gentiles come in. Sounds like everyone.
And carrying on, we see how Israel was hardened, and indeed all people have been hardened, so that God can have mercy on all.
28 As far as the gospel is concerned, they are enemies for your sake; but as far as election is concerned, they are loved on account of the patriarchs,
29 for God’s gifts and his call are irrevocable.
30 Just as you who were at one time disobedient to God have now received mercy as a result of their disobedience,
31 so they too have now become disobedient in order that they too may now receive mercy as a result of God’s mercy to you.
32 For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.
Just let that sink in, especially the last sentence. God has bound everyone over to disobedience (hardening them) so that he may have mercy on them all.
Sounds like everybody: Jews & Gentiles.
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I'm honestly not trying to be obtuse, it just seems that although the thread title is that Christ came only to save Israel, you're really saying that Christ came to save all, in a roundabout way.
