Do You believe in ET, UR or annihilation (or other) (sinned, Creator)
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Tradition teaches a literal lake of fire even though Revelation is FULL of symbolism! In the next chapter, Rev. 21, it talks about the Lamb's wife, which no one takes literally! Why is it such a stretch for some people to believe that God, who is Love, won't ACTUALLY throw people into a fire pit? And why did they choose the FIRE to be literal? Why not choose the LAKE to be literal? At least that way a few people could swim for eternity instead of burn.
Rev. 21: 9 Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls filled with the seven last plagues came to me and talked with me, saying, “Come, I will show you the bride, the Lamb’s wife.”
I believe the fire is symbolic and that God will deal with each person justly. We are not told exactly what the symbolism is, but it's clear because God is not an evil monster, that He won't ACTUALLY be throwing (for example) sweet teenagers who died in a car wreck before they got around to praying the sinner's prayer into actual fire. We are told we reap what we sow. Who can possibly sow torturing someone for eternity?
What does the verse, "For God is a consuming fire" mean to you? Or the one about being baptized by fire? Why was God in the fiery furnance? Or the burning bush? There seems to be a pattern here.....
I will tell you what I certainly do believe fully on...... Jesus Christ,I believe he is the life that is the light to all men,when I see that life I see God,that same life is the image of the invisible God Col 1:15 .What I also know is Jesus Christ the life that is the light to all men is not a bible,so believing in a bible and believing on Jesus Christ are two completely different things.
I certainly do not believe your understanding of it. And right back at you because I do not believe you do,as much as you claim you do,and you cannot prove by scripture that we are told to believe in the bible as well as on Jesus Christ.We have an anointing within us that teaches us and leads us,called the spirit of truth, sadly fundamentalists believe the letter is the spirit of truth.
I believe the fire is symbolic and that God will deal with each person justly. We are not told exactly what the symbolism is, but it's clear because God is not an evil monster, that He won't ACTUALLY be throwing (for example) sweet teenagers who died in a car wreck before they got around to praying the sinner's prayer into actual fire. We are told we reap what we sow. Who can possibly sow torturing someone for eternity?
What does the verse, "For God is a consuming fire" mean to you? Or the one about being baptized by fire? Why was God in the fiery furnance? Or the burning bush? There seems to be a pattern here.....
The Bible says much about fire & burning for those who reject God. Regardless if it is real or symbolic, God's judgment is not something to be taken lightly.
I will tell you what I certainly do believe fully on...... Jesus Christ,I believe he is the life that is the light to all men,when I see that life I see God,that same life is the image of the invisible God Col 1:15 .What I also know is Jesus Christ the life that is the light to all men is not a bible,so believing in a bible and believing on Jesus Christ are two completely different things.
I certainly do not believe your understanding of it. And right back at you because I do not believe you do,as much as you claim you do,and you cannot prove by scripture that we are told to believe in the bible as well as on Jesus Christ.We have an anointing within us that teaches us and leads us,called the spirit of truth, sadly fundamentalists believe the letter is the spirit of truth.
No, we believe they are one & the same. You have chosen to disregard God's holiness & judgment because it is offensive to you. God is the Creator, & we are in no position to question Him on His methods or actions.
URs believe in the "holiness and judgement" of God
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmiej
No, we believe they are one & the same. You have chosen to disregard God's holiness & judgment because it is offensive to you. God is the Creator, & we are in no position to question Him on His methods or actions.
URs believe in the "holiness and judgement" of God too.
But here is where we differ from ETers.
Greek scholar William Barclay wrote concerning kolasis aionion (age-during corrective chastisement) in Matthew 25:46
"The Greek word for punishment is kolasis. There is no instance in Greek secular literature where kolasis does not mean remedial punishment. It is a simple fact that in Greek kolasis always means remedial punishment. God's punishment is always for man's cure."
See what other Greek scholars say about it too.
AN ANALYTICAL STUDY OF WORDS Chapter Eleven
Fifteen literally translated (not interpretively translated) Bibles that reveal what God will do with the sinners in Matthew 25:46
Concordant Literal, Young’s literal, Wilson’s Emphatic Diaglott, Rotherham’s Emphasized, Scarlett’s, J.W. Hanson’s New Covenant, Twentieth Century, Ferrar Fenton, The Western New Testament, Weymouth’s (unedited), Clementson’s, The New Testament of our Lord and Savior Jesus Anointed, The Restoration of Original Sacred Name Bible, Bullinger’s Companion Bible margins, Jonathan Mitchell’s translation (2010).
And regarding the meaning of aionios, many Greek scholars agree with John Wesley Hanson AIÓN – AIÓNIOS AIN -- AINIOS
The Bible says much about fire & burning for those who reject God. Regardless if it is real or symbolic, God's judgment is not something to be taken lightly.
I agree totally. However, I think it is VERY important to know the difference and not just say, "Regardless if it is real or symbolic." If you are a parent and your child told someone, "My dad (or mom) is going to KILL me." (Or worse, going to throw me in fire forever.) Don't you think it would be important to know if that child believed it was TRUE or just a figure of speech? Don't you think it would speech volumes of what that child thought about the character of the parent?
I agree totally. However, I think it is VERY important to know the difference and not just say, "Regardless if it is real or symbolic." If you are a parent and your child told someone, "My dad (or mom) is going to KILL me." (Or worse, going to throw me in fire forever.) Don't you think it would be important to know if that child believed it was TRUE or just a figure of speech? Don't you think it would speech volumes of what that child thought about the character of the parent?
Of course.
A scripture comes to my mind:
He who is holy will see that you are holy; but to the man whose way is not straight you will be a hard judge. - 2 Samuel 22:27 (Bible in Basic English)
He who is holy will see that you are holy; but to the man whose way is not straight you will be a hard judge. - 2 Samuel 22:27 (Bible in Basic English)
You should think about that verse. There are countless verses in the Bible which talk about how God will treat the wicked, and there are many examples of how he has treated them in the past. The flood, Sodom and Gomorrah are some examples among many.
2 Sam 22:27 To the pure you show yourself pure, but to the wicked you show yourself hostile.
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URs believe in the "holiness and judgement" of God
Of course. 