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Old 08-23-2012, 05:38 PM
 
Location: TX
6,486 posts, read 6,407,709 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby59 View Post
God did not think homosexuality was “politically correct” but a sin worthy of death. A Christian cannot accept it, cannot approve of it or any that dose take part in it.
Yet, they can perform weddings for people who have been married before with no questions asked.

Admit it. The anti-gay crowd is motivated by prejudice, not what "God" does or does not approve of

Christianity is just an excuse, one that only non-thinking people will ever buy.
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Old 08-23-2012, 08:19 PM
 
Location: Deepest Darkest NZ
717 posts, read 649,829 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby59 View Post
THE DESTRUCTION OF SODOM
AND GOMORRAH
Moses said, “Now the men of Sodom were wicked exceedingly and sinners against the Lord” (Genesis 13:13). What are we told about them? When two man were spending the night at the home of Lot, before they went to bed of the night, “The men of the city, the men of Sodom, surrounded the house, both young and old, all the people from every quarter; and they called to Lot and said to him, ‘Where are the men who came to your tonight: Bring them out that we may have relations with them” (Genesis 19:1-5 New American Standard Bible).
• ”Bring them out that we may have relations with them” New American Standard Bible
• “Bring them out to us so that we can have sex with them” New International Version
• “Bring them out to us so that we may have intercourse with them” revised English Bible
• “Bring them out to us so we can have sexual relations with them” New Century Version
• “Bring them out to us that we may have intimacies with them” The New American Bible
• “Bring them out so we can have sex with them” New Living Translation
• “Send them out, so we can have sex with them” Contemporary English Version
Under the Law God demanded the death penalty for homosexuality. “Is there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; THEY SHALL SURELY BE PUT TO DEATH” (Leviticus 20:13). “You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination” (Leviticus 18:22). “Defile not you yourselves in any of these things: for in all these the nations are defiled which I cast out from before you; and the land is defiled: therefore I do visit the iniquity thereof upon it, and the land vomits out her inhabitants” (Leviticus 18:24-25).
Genesis 19:1- 7: “Now the two angels came to Sodom in the evening as Lot was sitting in the gate of Sodom When Lot saw them, he rose to meet them and bowed down with his face to the ground. And he said, "Now behold, my lords, please turn aside into your servant's house, and spend the night, and wash your feet; then you may rise early and go on your way." They said however, "No, but we shall spend the night in the square." Yet he urged them strongly, so they turned aside to him and entered his house; and he prepared a feast for them, and baked unleavened bread, and they ate. Before they lay down, the men of the city, the men of Sodom, surrounded the house, both young and old, all the people from every quarter; and they called to Lot and said to him, ‘Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us that we may have relations with them.’ But Lot went out to them at the doorway, and shut the door behind him, and said, "Please, my brothers, do not act wickedly.” “Bring them out to us so that we can have sex with then, Lot went outside to meet them and shut the door behind him and said, ‘No, my friends. Don’t do this wicked thing’” [New International Version. There is no doubt that this man having relations (sex) with man is homosexuality and Job called it wicked. In Genesis 19 these cities were literally burnt up (Psalm 11:6; Isaiah 34:9), not still burning with the people walking around in torment. Their end was complete (total destruction) and is an example of the total destruction that is coming to the ungodly at the judgment.
SODOM AND GOMORRAH Jude 7 "Are set forth as an example, suffering the punishment of eternal fire" American Standard Version. God "condemned them to extinction and made them an example of what is coming to the ungodly" 2 Peter 2:6 New Revised Standard Version. These cities were literally burnt up, not still burning with the people walking around in torment. Their end (extinction) was complete (total destruction) and eternal; and is an example of the total destruction that is coming to the ungodly at the judgment. SODOM HAS CEASED TO EXIST. So thoroughly was it's destruction that it's location is not known. Some believe it was under what is now the Dead Sea, some that it was other places. The annihilation (end, destruction, extinction, death) of the ungodly will be total and eternal, just as it was of Sodom and Gomorrah. THEY WILL CEASE TO EXIST. This is the first use of "fire and brimstone" and the only time it was literally rained on anyone. It was the total destruction of the two cities, and is later used as a symbol of total and eternal destruction. (Psalm 11:6; Isaiah 34:9; Revelation 19:20; 20:10; 21:8). "By turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah to ashes he condemned them to extinction and made them an example of what is coming to the ungodly" New Revised Standard Version. That they were reduced to ashes and the fire went out is also a part of the example of what will happen to the ungodly. Where does any one find the revelation that changes this example of total destruction by a fire that went out when the destruction was complete into an example of destruction that will never be complete and the fire will never go out?
• "And if by turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah to ashes he condemned them too extinction and made them an example of what is coming to the ungodly" New Revised Standard Version.
• "And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes condemned them with a overthrow, having made them an example unto those that should live ungodly" American Standard Version.
• "He condemned the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah to destruction by reducing them to ashes, having made them an example to those who would live ungodly thereafter" New American Standard Version.
• "He condemned the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah by burning them to ashes, and made them an example of what is going to happen to the ungodly" New International Version.
• "And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes, condemned them to destruction, making them an example to those who afterward would live ungodly" New King James Version.
• "And God also destroyed the evil cities of Sodom and Gomorrah by burning them until they were ashes. He made these cities an example of what will happen to those who are against God" New Century Bible.
• "And He condemned to ruin and extinction the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah, reducing them to ashes (and thus) set them forth as an example to those who would be ungodly" The Amplified Bible.
• "God reduced the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah to ashes, condemning them to total ruin as an object lesson for the ungodly in future days" Revised English Bible.
If Sodom and Gomorrah are an example of what is going to happen to the ungodly, how could the ungodly have an eternal life of torment? They were reduced to ashes and when there was nothing more to burn, the fire went out. They are an example of total destruction, not of eternal torment.
What is Sodom an example of?
• "Condemned them too extinction" -- Sodom --- or an eternal life of torment?
• "Condemned them too extinction" -- ungodly -- or an eternal life of torment? Does anyone think Sodom is now being tormented in Hell today? If it is not, then how is it an example of being tormented in Hell?
Next to the flood the destruction of Sodom was the most devastating judgment by God in the Old Testament. Homosexuality is the sin that wrought the wrath of God and a judgment of total destruction (death) on all the inhabitants of these four cities and all the inhabitants around them.
“Probably the most devastating judgment of Jehovah since the universal flood in Noah’s day was the destruction of the cities of the Plan, Sodom, Gomorrah, Admah, and Zeboim, ‘Jehovah overthrew these cities in His anger, and in His wrath’ (Deut. 29:23). It was a judgment of total destruction upon the cities, the inhabitants of the land, and of all that grew upon the land. Although other sins were charged against Sodom: ‘Pride, fullness of bread, and prosperous ease…And they were haughty, and committed abomination before me’ (Ezek. 16:49050). Homosexuality (sodomy) was the abomination and chief sin charged against the city, and the immediate sin for which it was destroyed (Gen. 19:4-5, 12-13). When Lot, his wife, and two daughters left the city, ‘Jehovah rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from Jehovah out of heaven’ (Gen 19:24). Precisely how this was done we are not told; but it was clearly a judgment from Jehovah, an expression of His fierce wrath and hot anger against the cities and the sin of sodomy” Homer Hailey, “God’s Judgments and Punishments,” Page 98.
“As a nation, the United States has enjoyed a favorable position on earth. Located between tow great oceans, with friendly neighbor to the north and fairly friendly nation to the south, it has escaped the ravages of war. Except for the Civil War, it has had no war of any magnitude on its soil since the Revolutionary War with England. Like Moab, it has ‘settled on its lees,’ becoming very wicked in the last half century. It can easily become the target of God’s judgment. Our self-confidence, out attitude toward homosexuality…and our haughty spirit toward the God of heaven could be the prelude to a serious judgment from the Almighty. Nuclear weapons, guided missiles, and terrorist organizations made a destructive war possible.” Homer Hailey, “God’s Judgments and Punishments Of Individuals and Nations,” Page 101. Note: This was written before 9/11.
God did not think homosexuality was “politically correct” but a sin worthy of death. A Christian cannot accept it, cannot approve of it or any that dose take part in it. IT IS UNACCETABLE TO GOD. Is not the US heading in the same path that Sodom took?
Anyone must reject many plain statements of the Bible to believe man has an immortal soul that is deathless and will live forever without the blood of Christ. All through the Bible death is God’s punishment for homosexuality.
According to Ezekiel the reason for Sodom's destruction was inhospitality which is echoed by Jesus in the Gospels.
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Old 08-24-2012, 01:53 AM
 
23,655 posts, read 17,562,145 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kiwimac View Post
According to Ezekiel the reason for Sodom's destruction was inhospitality which is echoed by Jesus in the Gospels.
If the men only wanted hospitality it would have been given to them. NO they wanted to have sex with the new men in town. Now if you are saying not to let them do it was inhospitable then you are right but the sodomy part was the sin.
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Old 08-24-2012, 03:17 AM
 
Location: Deepest Darkest NZ
717 posts, read 649,829 times
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Not according to Ezekiel.
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Old 08-24-2012, 06:02 AM
 
Location: TX
6,486 posts, read 6,407,709 times
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It isn't just remarriage, either, that Christians do not oppose with the same zeal even though the bible (Jesus himself, no less) explicitly forbids it in many cases. Yes, the bible says to kill gays. But that doesn't make homosexuality special. Here are some other "sins" in the bible for which the penalty was supposed to be death:

Kill People Who Don't Listen to Priests or Judges Deuteronomy 17:12
Kill Fortunetellers Leviticus 20:27
Death for Hitting Dad or Mom Exodus 21:15
Death for Cursing Parents Leviticus 20:9
Death for Adultery Leviticus 20:10
Death for Prostitution Leviticus 21:9
Kill people who promote other religions, even if they're a family member or your wife Deuteronomy 13:1-10
Kill the Entire Town if One Person Worships Another God Deuteronomy 13:12-19
Kill Women Who Are Not Virgins On Their Wedding Night Deuteronomy 22:13-21
Death for Blasphemy Leviticus 24:10-16
Kill People for Working on the Sabbath Exodus 31:12-15 (and don't give me "But Jesus said...", because Jesus never explicitly condoned working on the Sabbath in general, only specific kinds of work).

It even promotes the killing of nonbelievers in 2 Chronicles 15:12-13.

Last edited by Vic 2.0; 08-24-2012 at 06:19 AM..
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Old 08-24-2012, 10:29 AM
 
Location: Austin, TX
4,760 posts, read 13,850,355 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic 2.0 View Post
It isn't just remarriage, either, that Christians do not oppose with the same zeal even though the bible (Jesus himself, no less) explicitly forbids it in many cases. Yes, the bible says to kill gays. But that doesn't make homosexuality special. Here are some other "sins" in the bible for which the penalty was supposed to be death:

Kill People Who Don't Listen to Priests or Judges Deuteronomy 17:12
Kill Fortunetellers Leviticus 20:27
Death for Hitting Dad or Mom Exodus 21:15
Death for Cursing Parents Leviticus 20:9
Death for Adultery Leviticus 20:10
Death for Prostitution Leviticus 21:9
Kill people who promote other religions, even if they're a family member or your wife Deuteronomy 13:1-10
Kill the Entire Town if One Person Worships Another God Deuteronomy 13:12-19
Kill Women Who Are Not Virgins On Their Wedding Night Deuteronomy 22:13-21
Death for Blasphemy Leviticus 24:10-16
Kill People for Working on the Sabbath Exodus 31:12-15 (and don't give me "But Jesus said...", because Jesus never explicitly condoned working on the Sabbath in general, only specific kinds of work).

It even promotes the killing of nonbelievers in 2 Chronicles 15:12-13.
Horrific list, eh? We don't see Biblical literalists agitating about these things, do we? Because these are absurd. Just like anti-gay sentiments are absurd, except some people persist in using religion to justify their homophobia.
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Old 08-24-2012, 11:20 AM
 
Location: TX
6,486 posts, read 6,407,709 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Topaz View Post
Horrific list, eh? We don't see Biblical literalists agitating about these things, do we? Because these are absurd. Just like anti-gay sentiments are absurd, except some people persist in using religion to justify their homophobia.
No kidding. Sometimes, you hear of how "The old law is no more. Jesus has fulfilled it." But then, for some reason, that doesn't include homosexuality (even though Jesus explicitly forbids remarriage and says absolutely nothing about homosexuality, hmmm).
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Old 08-24-2012, 06:16 PM
 
Location: Free State of Texas
20,457 posts, read 12,850,404 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic 2.0 View Post
It isn't just remarriage, either, that Christians do not oppose with the same zeal even though the bible (Jesus himself, no less) explicitly forbids it in many cases. Yes, the bible says to kill gays. But that doesn't make homosexuality special. Here are some other "sins" in the bible for which the penalty was supposed to be death:

Kill People Who Don't Listen to Priests or Judges Deuteronomy 17:12
Kill Fortunetellers Leviticus 20:27
Death for Hitting Dad or Mom Exodus 21:15
Death for Cursing Parents Leviticus 20:9
Death for Adultery Leviticus 20:10
Death for Prostitution Leviticus 21:9
Kill people who promote other religions, even if they're a family member or your wife Deuteronomy 13:1-10
Kill the Entire Town if One Person Worships Another God Deuteronomy 13:12-19
Kill Women Who Are Not Virgins On Their Wedding Night Deuteronomy 22:13-21
Death for Blasphemy Leviticus 24:10-16
Kill People for Working on the Sabbath Exodus 31:12-15 (and don't give me "But Jesus said...", because Jesus never explicitly condoned working on the Sabbath in general, only specific kinds of work).

It even promotes the killing of nonbelievers in 2 Chronicles 15:12-13.
That's Judaism, not Christianity.
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Old 08-24-2012, 06:35 PM
 
Location: TX
6,486 posts, read 6,407,709 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmiej View Post
That's Judaism, not Christianity.
Which is it:

1. Everything in the Old Testament is to be ignored by Christians.
2. Only what Jesus contradicted is to be ignored by Christians.
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Old 08-24-2012, 06:43 PM
 
Location: Free State of Texas
20,457 posts, read 12,850,404 times
Reputation: 2498
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic 2.0 View Post
Which is it:

1. Everything in the Old Testament is to be ignored by Christians.
2. Only what Jesus contradicted is to be ignored by Christians.
You knowingly posted Jewish law as Christianity. You also are aware that Jesus fulfilled the Law's requirements. Finally, you are aware that homosexuality is condemned in the NT.

You were doing much better when you asked why Christians don't condemn other sins with the veracity of homosexuality. Stick with that.
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