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Please cite the archaelogical "evidence" consisting of artifacts and records that there were Hebrew slaves in Egypt prior to 1000 BC. or that they spent 40 years in the desert.
>> Refruted by Jesus himself<<?????? Let me guess. Moses wrote the first five books of the Bible because somebody writing the New Testament claimed Jesus had said so. Is that your proof? On the other hand, Genesis 36 tells us that:
"These are the kings who ruled in the land of Edom before a king ruled the children of Israel."
This logically had to be written after Israel had it's first king about 1000 BC. Moses is said to have died about 1400 BC or four hundred years befoe Israel had a king. He couldn't have written Genesis 36, could he?
We only have a copy of the Ipuwer Papyrus which describes the Hyksos in Egypt. This tribe controlled Egypt for a time before they were driven out. They were NOT the Hebrews.
If Hebrews were in Egypt for 400 years and had risen to 2,300,000 (including 600,000 warriors) and had spent 40 years in the desert, there would be some archaelogical foot print. There isn't.
The first mention of the Hebrews seems to be the Merneptah Stele which has Hebrew nomadic herdsman already settled in Canaan in about 1200 BC. About 250 to 300 of their camps have been found there. None have weapons.
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The Egyptians were historical revisionists. They would not have preserved official records of their humiliation at the hands of God. As stated however, the Ipuwer Papyurus is good evidence that someone recorded the plagues mentioned in Exodus.
As for evidence in the desert, the Bible says that their clothing did not wear out (Deut. 29:5). That probably applied to everything else they had as well. If they took everything with them as they moved from one location to another there would be nothing to be found.
As for the Kings ruling in the land of Edom as per Genesis 36, I recall going over this with you in another thread not too long ago. I am not going to waste my time going over it again.
As for your skepticism, since you refuse to listen, that is your problem. And you will pay the penalty for your error.
Many people are not simply skeptical of the Bible but are actually hostile to what God has revealed in His word. It is one of Satan's objectives to continually attack the Bible in whatever way he can. To that end he uses such people, many of whom are readily encountered on this forum and the Religion forum, to further his aims. Such people will grab at anything that they think can be used to discredit the Bible and they will never acknowledge the Bible as the inerrant word of God.
I as well have chosen God's word and understand that the attacks upon it from the many who are skeptical and/or antagonistic toward it originate with Satan.
RESPONSE:
Actually, most "attacks" come from historians.
Is your definition of Satan anyone who doesn't agree with you?
>>The Egyptians were historical revisionists. They would not have preserved official records of their humiliation at the hands of God. As stated however, the Ipuwer Papyurus is good evidence that someone recorded the plagues mentioned in Exodus.<<
RESPONSE:
Are you seriously claiming that the Egyptians destroyed all references to people who were in Egypt for 400 years and numbered 2,300,000 when they left?
And since the writers of the Old Testment incorporated older writing, such as the Flood story in the Epic of Gilgemesh, doesn't it make sense that they would use the Ipuwer Papyrus as a source for their legends too?
>>As for evidence in the desert, the Bible says that their clothing did not wear out (Deut. 29:5). That probably applied to everything else they had as well. If they took everything with them as they moved from one location to another there would be nothing to be found.<<
RESPONSE:
Ah yes. The bible says so and ya just gotta believe! Are you claiming that 2,300,000 people wandered aboiut the desert for 40 years and didn't leave any archaelogical evidence behind such as proken pottery, buried bodies, broken tools, etc, etc?
>>As for the Kings ruling in the land of Edom as per Genesis 36, I recall going over this with you in another thread not too long ago. I am not going to waste my time going over it again.<<
RESPONSE:
Yes. Your answer was absurd then too. It was divine inspiration about the future, wasn't it?
>>As for your skepticism, since you refuse to listen, that is your problem. And you will pay the penalty for your error. <<
RESPONSE:
I listen. I just don't believe fantastic answers completely without evidence.
Since I've made no error, obviously there will be no penalty. But continue to play "let's pretend" if you really want to.
Many prefer to stick to the facts of history and reality thinking.
Findings: Dating traced from the earliest Neolithic settlement.
Jericho was deserted at the time of Joshua’s supposed conquest.
Her findings were corroborated in 1995 by radiocarbon testing from 1562 BCE [Range +/- 38 years, certainity 95%: ref: Radiocarbon, Vol 37, No2, 1995
The city had been destroyed about 1550 BCE and remained unoccupied until about the 9th century BCE.
It is amazing that people thousands of years later got it all figured out as opposed to those who were there and recorded the events......First hand...
It is amazing that people thousands of years later got it all figured out as opposed to those who were there and recorded the events......First hand...
RESPONSE:
There was no one there to record the events "first hand". That's the point.
The first seven books of the bible were written between 500 and 700 years after the events they describe. They just record the folklore current at the time they were written.
That's the subject of this thread.
If you have evidence to the contrary, by all means prewent it.
But just claiming that "it's in the bible" isn't evidence that the events really happened or were witnessed by the writers.
Last edited by ancient warrior; 09-06-2012 at 10:13 AM..
Reason: typo
I hope you are not going to try to claim that the Hebrews were really the Hyksos?
From your article:
"The story of the Exodus is most likely bases (sic) on the expulsion of the Hyksos from Egypt, for there is no other record of any mass exit from Egypt (Robertson 1990, 36; Halpern 1994, 89-96; Redford 1897, 150).
I hope you are not going to try to claim that the Hebrews were really the Hyksos?
From your article:
"The story of the Exodus is most likely bases (sic) on the expulsion of the Hyksos from Egypt, for there is no other record of any mass exit from Egypt (Robertson 1990, 36; Halpern 1994, 89-96; Redford 1897, 150).
Like I said, I'm no Archaeologist. Are you? I'm just saying there are other possibilities other than "ITS ALL A LIE. HEBREWS MADE IT ALL UP!!" And btw, if I were Pharaoh, I wouldn't want a trace of the Exodus in the History books either.
Btw, just out of curiousity, do you believe that the Epic of Gilgamesh is as historically credible as the Torah?
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Are you claiming that 2,300,000 people wandered aboiut the desert for 40 years and didn't leave any archaelogical evidence behind such as proken pottery, buried bodies, broken tools, etc, etc?
And btw, if I were Pharaoh, I wouldn't want a trace of the Exodus in the History books either.
