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Old 08-06-2013, 11:32 AM
 
Location: US
32,530 posts, read 22,124,899 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jghorton View Post
How can one truly 'love God' ... without free will?

Who says we are required to love Him of "our own free will"?...
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Old 08-06-2013, 11:33 AM
 
Location: US
32,530 posts, read 22,124,899 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
You are confusing our imagination (which is only a poor copy of God's) . . . with God's. We can create in novels . . . but we cannot imbue our creations with life. God does and that is the difference. Life is constant change that requires decisions . . . and that requires free will.

I'm not confusing anything...
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Old 08-06-2013, 11:35 AM
 
Location: US
32,530 posts, read 22,124,899 times
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Originally Posted by Heartsong View Post
We are all prepared for destruction. If you think you are excluded from destruction, you are deluded IMO.

Where does it state that we are all prepared for destruction?...
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Old 08-06-2013, 11:38 AM
 
Location: US
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Originally Posted by Heartsong View Post
What? I'm calling God a liar because I don't hold to your interpretation of the meaning of predestination? Okay. If you say so.

What does predestination mean?...
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Old 08-06-2013, 11:40 AM
 
Location: US
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heartsong View Post
Everyone is both a sheep and a goat. Can you fathom that?

Where does it state that?...
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Old 08-06-2013, 11:43 AM
 
Location: US
32,530 posts, read 22,124,899 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
The real question is, "What does God say?" He has told us in Scripture. That's really what it comes down to.


My "dark side moments" are forgiven by virtue of the blood of Christ. None of us can claim to be without sin...but we are made pure by his blood that was shed for us.

How do you explain the verse that states that we are forgiven for sins past?...What of future sins after we are born-again?...
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Old 08-06-2013, 12:01 PM
 
19,942 posts, read 17,246,539 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
How do you explain the verse that states that we are forgiven for sins past?...What of future sins after we are born-again?...
Isaiah 53:4-5, "Surely our griefs He Himself bore, and our sorrows He carried; yet we ourselves esteemed Him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted. 5 But He was pierced through for our transgressions. He was crushed for our iniquities. The chastening for our well-being fell upon Him and by His scourging we are healed."

Heb 10:12: "But when Christ had offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God,"

In Hebrews 10, we see the image of the Priest, sacrificing daily. In the temple, there was no chair--because he was always working--daily making an offering. Jesus did one sacrifice, though--and then sat down. He need not do any more. It's over.
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Old 08-06-2013, 12:11 PM
 
Location: Florida -
10,213 posts, read 14,880,670 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
Who says we are required to love Him of "our own free will"?...
..... I'm not sure I follow your line of thinking. --- I was speaking of 'love' itself. Can it still be 'love' without free will (I think not). What is it if we say we "love God" ... yet, have no 'free will' to choose? From the beginning, people have chosen to 'love' or 'not love' God. The admonishment to 'love God' and 'love one another' throughout scripture is an imperative that requires the exercise of free will.

Are you simply using rhetorical questions and snappy one-liners here ... or do you actually have answers based on thought-out positions or scriptural research.
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Old 08-06-2013, 12:17 PM
 
19,942 posts, read 17,246,539 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jghorton View Post
..... I'm not sure I follow your line of thinking. --- I was speaking of 'love' itself. Can it still be 'love' without free will (I think not). What is it if we say we "love God" ... yet, have no 'free will' to choose? From the beginning, people have chosen to 'love' or 'not love' God. The admonishment to 'love God' and 'love one another' throughout scripture is an imperative that requires the exercise of free will.

Are you simply debating answers with snappy one-liners here ... or have you actually thought-out and scripturally researched the question/s?
Define "free will". Why does "free will" necessitate the ability to choose not to?

Or why do you seem to think that mankind has more freedom than God? God can't choose to sin.
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Old 08-06-2013, 12:22 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
17,071 posts, read 10,966,428 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
What does predestination mean?...
That is the question in the OP and so far I have not seen any argument to refute the conclusion that the term as used is reference to a plan and the expected classes of respondents to the message concerning that plan as opposed to choice of individuals. It seems to be the only interpretation that fits all the elements concerning choice, spreading the message of God's love and the other imperatives we see concerning "the Way."
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