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Then why do christians use our bible?...Jeremiah 31 states who this new covenant will be made with...
You know why. Because Christianity came out of Judaism but changed over time and the Jewish Bible was altered and reinterpreted understood differently to fit Christian beliefs.
As said before, the New Covenant that HaShem makes is with Judah and Israel...
And as I have said before, Jewish perceptions mean nothing on this subject in a Christianity forum. ALL of Christianity accepts that Jesus established a "New Covenant" and you are out of line in this forum. All Jeremiah really accomplished was to establish the inadequacy of the Mosaic Covenant.
Then why do christians use our bible?...Jeremiah 31 states who this new covenant will be made with...
"Your Bible" is background for Christianity, not authority, though some misguided Christians may think so, and all we need to see from Jeremiah is that he considered the then current (Mosaic) Covenant inadequate.
And as I have said before, Jewish perceptions mean nothing on this subject in a Christianity forum. ALL of Christianity accepts that Jesus established a "New Covenant" and you are out of line in this forum. All Jeremiah really accomplished was to establish the inadequacy of the Mosaic Covenant.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift
"Your Bible" is background for Christianity, not authority, though some misguided Christians may think so, and all we need to see from Jeremiah is that he considered the then current (Mosaic) Covenant inadequate.
As said before, the New Covenant that HaShem makes is with Judah and Israel...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965
One law replaced with another...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801
In Christianity, it means something different, as you know.
Your Jewish take on it doesn't change that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965
Then why do christians use our bible?...Jeremiah 31 states who this new covenant will be made with...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801
You know why. Because Christianity came out of Judaism but changed over time and the Jewish Bible was altered and reinterpreted understood differently to fit Christian beliefs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift
And as I have said before, Jewish perceptions mean nothing on this subject in a Christianity forum. ALL of Christianity accepts that Jesus established a "New Covenant" and you are out of line in this forum. All Jeremiah really accomplished was to establish the inadequacy of the Mosaic Covenant.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift
"Your Bible" is background for Christianity, not authority, though some misguided Christians may think so, and all we need to see from Jeremiah is that he considered the then current (Mosaic) Covenant inadequate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
Christianity seems to be pretty corrupt though which was predicted, just as Judaism is based around taking the signs as literal things to be physically observed, the various Christian churches do the same
God is not the Christian God or the Jewish God it seems to me, the same as he not just the God of the fundamentalist or the universalist or Baptist
“The Christ” which spoke to the prophets is the same that spoke through the apostles to gather all together (Israel) under one head
the writings we have are spiritual things where we are to learn to listen to the spirit and not judge each other
The writings are timeless and speak to us now
What I see is prophetic things, and we should be looking at what the names mean and not worshipping or focussing on the physical things which were the “types”
Light blue is mine
Jesus Ministers to Great Crowds
Mat 4:23 And Jesus (his disciples) went around all Galilee (the sea) teaching in their synagogues (churches, temples) and proclaiming the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every disease and every sickness among the people. (Spiritual blind, deaf, lame, possessed)
Mat 4:24 And the report of Him went out into all Syria. And they brought to Him all the ones being badly ill, suffering various diseases and torments, also those being demon-possessed, and those being moonstruck, and paralytics; and He healed them.
Mat 4:25 And many crowds followed Him from Galilee (the sea)and Decapolis (10 cities), and Jerusalem, and Judea, and beyond the Jordan.
The Sermon on the Mount
Mat 5:1 But seeing the crowds, He went up into the mountain, and seating Himself, His disciples came near to Him.
The Beatitudes
Mat 5:2 And opening His mouth, He taught them, saying:
Mat 5:3 Blessed are the poor in spirit! For theirs is the kingdom of the Heavens.
Mat 5:4 Blessed are the ones mourning! For they shall be comforted.
Mat 5:5 Blessed are the meek! For they shall inherit the earth. Psa. 37:11
Mat 5:6 Blessed are they who hunger and thirst after righteousness! For they shall be filled.
Mat 5:7 Blessed are the merciful! For they shall obtain mercy.
Mat 5:8 Blessed are the pure in heart! For they shall see God.
Mat 5:9 Blessed are the peacemakers! For they shall be called sons of God.
Mat 5:10 Blessed are they who have been persecuted for righteousness' sake! For theirs is the kingdom of Heaven.
Mat 5:11 Blessed are you when they shall reproach you, and persecute you, and shall say every evil word against you, lying, on account of Me.
Mat 5:12 Rejoice and leap for joy, for your reward is great in Heaven; for in this way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.
1Co 12:13 For also we all were baptized by one Spirit into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, even all were given to drink into one Spirit.
1Co 12:14 For also the body is not one member, but many.
The physical sabbath day Saturday, and the physical 8th day Sunday are symbols which point to the creation account and the millennial 7th day ..... and the recreation which is the never ending 8th day
The church was worshipping on Sunday long before Constantine was even born. Here is the historical proof.
1.)The Epistle of Barnabas (c AD 80-120)
CHAPTER XV.--THE FALSE AND THE TRUE SABBATH.
''Your present Sabbaths are not acceptable to Me, but that is which I have made, [namely this,] when, giving rest to all things, I shall make a beginning of the eighth day, that is, a beginning of another world. Wherefore, also, we keep the eighth day with joyfulness, the day also on which Jesus rose again from the dead. And when He had manifested Himself, He ascended into the heavens.''[Bolding mine]
1 On the Lord's Day of the Lord come together, break bread and hold Eucharist, after confessing your transgressions that your offering may be pure; 2 but let none who has a quarrel with his fellow join in your meeting until they be reconciled, that your sacrifice be not defiled. 3 For this is that which was spoken by the Lord, "In every place and time offer me a pure sacrifice, for I am a great king," saith the Lord, "and my name is wonderful among the heathen." [Bolding mine]
JUSTIN MARTYR -- THE FIRST APOLOGY OF JUSTIN (c. AD. 150-160)
CHAPTER LXVII -- WEEKLY WORSHIP OF THE CHRIS- TIANS.
And we afterwards continually remind each other of these things. And the wealthy among us help the needy; and we always keep together; and for all things wherewith we are supplied, we bless the Maker of all through His Son Jesus Christ, and through the Holy Ghost. And on the day called Sunday, all who live in cities or in the country gather together to one place, and the memoirs of the apostles or the writings of the prophets are read, as long as time permits; then, when the reader has ceased, the president verbally instructs, and exhorts to the imitation of these good things. Then we all rise together and pray, and, as we before said, when our prayer is ended, bread and wine and water are brought, and the president in like manner offers prayers and thanksgivings, according to his ability, and the people assent, saying Amen; and there is a distribution to each, and a participation of that over which thanks have been given, and to those who are absent a portion is sent by the deacons. [Bolding mine]
Constantine wasn't born until c. AD 272 to 280 which was long after the church began Sunday worship.
I realize that you feel justified in having presented the above, um, whatever it's supposed to be, but nowhere - I repeat NOWHERE - is or was a command ever made to abrogate the 7th-day Sabbath. And, as long as Christians believe in a God (as per the Bible) who created 'everything' and claim to worship this same God then no other source - whether written by Paul, Barnabus, etc. etc. can change this.
I also realize that mainstream Christianity HAS TO come up with reasons to have blatantly violated a command of the God they claim to worship and to defend their 'Sunday sabbath' and so they offer up non-biblical sources with which to accomplish this ...hence the contents of the above post. But, they fail to realize in their zeal to prove someone else wrong that the above contents have NOTHING to do with the abrogation of the Sabbath command. NOTHING and NO ONE can change the biblical account of Creation as long as one claims to believe in an Almighty God who created EVERYTHING that there is.
You don't believe in the biblical God? Fine.
You follow Paul and believe that he became the mouth-piece for God? You're in good company. So does the mainstream Christian Church.
You DO believe in the biblical God? Then keep the commands of the deity you claim to worship.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555
And no, Christians do not have to keep the Saturday Sabbath.
That's right. Christians don't have to keep the 7th-day Sabbath. But they WILL keep the Sabbath voluntarily out of respect for the God they claim to worship. They WILL 'remember' the command that was abrogated centuries ago 'by man' and later claimed as evidence of the accepted authority of the Roman Catholic Church even by, um, so-called 'Protestants'. If one were to read the Bible from Genesis to Revelation without any help from outside sources they would not find ANY scripture where the 7th-day Sabbath was ever revoked by God.
I realize that I'm on the wrong side of this particular discussion, but I'm perfectly fine with that.
You follow Paul and believe that he became the mouth-piece for God? You're in good company. So does the mainstream Christian Church.
You DO believe in the biblical God? Then keep the commands of the deity you claim to worship.
I think I'll take a pass on structuring my spiritual life around your criteria.
You can live with that, can't you?
When I was in my 20s, I thought that anyone who disagreed with me on doctrine could only do so because:
a) They aren't as intelligent as I am.
b) They don't know the Bible as well as I do.
c) They don't love God as much as I do.
d) They don't care about sound doctrine as much as I do.
e) They are more fleshly than I am.
When I got into my 30s I realized the real problem: I have control issues.
Guess what? There are a lot of people out there who love God, love the Bible and care about spiritual things who disagree with me. It isn't a problem. I'm not their judge.
I think I'll take a pass on structuring my spiritual life around your criteria.
You can live with that, can't you?
When I was in my 20s, I thought that anyone who disagreed with me on doctrine could only do so because:
a) They aren't as intelligent as I am.
b) They don't know the Bible as well as I do.
c) They don't love God as much as I do.
d) They don't care about sound doctrine as much as I do.
e) They are more fleshly than I am.
When I got into my 30s I realized the real problem: I have control issues.
Guess what? There are a lot of people out there who love God, love the Bible and care about spiritual things who disagree with me. It isn't a problem. I'm not their judge.
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