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Not for salvation. That is crystal clear in the bible.
So for salvation what do you need? To believe in the name of Christ? And that he shed his blood for us?
Well, even the demons believe that he is Lord and he died and resurrected. The only way to gauge your believe is if you practice his injunctions. For clarity read John14 and read the first three chapters of the Revelations when he was admonishing the 7 churches. Those seven churches refer to the seven problems that exist in Christianity.
What Jesus meant was that you have nothing to do. The work is to labor to enter into rest. Sometimes this is difficult when people like you keep twisting scripture to fit their own doctrine.
By all means, work. I'll give you a wave in heaven and let you know how great it was to rely on Jesus instead of myself.
So that is why he said "As the Father sent me so I send you."
Or "If you continue in my word you are truly my disciple then you shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free."
Since you do not continue in His word you do not know the truth.
So for salvation what do you need? To believe in the name of Christ? And that he shed his blood for us?
Well, even the demons believe that he is Lord and he died and resurrected. The only way to gauge your believe is if you practice his injunctions. For clarity read John14 and read the first three chapters of the Revelations when he was admonishing the 7 churches. Those seven churches refer to the seven problems that exist in Christianity.
For clarity why don't you try reading the epistles? I'm sure if you look in your bible's table to contents you might be able to find them. Maybe.
Just how dense are you people? How many times do we have to write that works flow out of grace? Where did you ever read a post that said there should not be any works at all? Wo rid are not needed for salvation, Maybe I should try it slow....
For clarity why don't you try reading the epistles? I'm sure if you look in your bible's table to contents you might be able to find them. Maybe.
Just how dense are you people? How many times do we have to write that works flow out of grace? Where did you ever read a post that said there should not be any works at all? Wo rid are not needed for salvation, Maybe I should try it slow....
No, but they are needed as a testimonial of salvation. No testimony, no salvation. One does not testify to the world with their lips, but with one's life.
And Jesus said the good trees bear good fruit. Those to be cast into the fire do not.
No, but they are needed as a testimonial of salvation. No testimony, no salvation. One does not testify to the world with their lips, but with one's life.
And Jesus said the good trees bear good fruit. Those to be cast into the fire do not.
You would think this would be obvious, Warden. I am amazed how many simply do not see it!Thank God we're NOT all one thing or the other so only those parts of us that are wicked or unloving will be refined out as dross in the consuming fire of God's pure love . . . and we are "saved as by fire."
Last edited by MysticPhD; 05-26-2014 at 06:17 PM..
For clarity why don't you try reading the epistles? I'm sure if you look in your bible's table to contents you might be able to find them. Maybe.
Just how dense are you people? How many times do we have to write that works flow out of grace? Where did you ever read a post that said there should not be any works at all? Wo rid are not needed for salvation, Maybe I should try it slow....
Pheew! How dense are we? Wao! My dear brother, believe in your heart leads you to do good works, not the opposite. If I know that Christ died for me, I will love , not hate. I will forgive, not fester. I am directed to do things by my believe. By this shall all men know that you are Christ's disciple. Your works... and they follow you.
But are our works perfect? No. Are we going to fall? Yes. But now we have a blood we can plead to God for forgiveness. Can you now see the importance and limitation of 'works'?
Pheew! How dense are we? Wao! My dear brother, believe in your heart leads you to do good works, not the opposite. If I know that Christ died for me, I will love , not hate. I will forgive, not fester. I am directed to do things by my believe. By this shall all men know that you are Christ's disciple. Your works... and they follow you.
But are our works perfect? No. Are we going to fall? Yes. But now we have a blood we can plead to God for forgiveness. Can you now see the importance and limitation of 'works'?
This sounds to me like we're talking about the same thing. There are those saying that you have to earn salvation by works. I'm saying that the good works come out of knowing Jesus and what He's done for us.
This is where my frustration lies. I've been saying that because of grace, because of knowing Jesus, we are moved to do things (good works). Somehow that's been interpreted as I want to do nothing. Someone said "faith people" just watch TV and drink beer. Nothing could be further from the truth.
Because of Jesus, I enjoy "doing things". I'm not doing it to gain His favor and salvation, but because I already have it. That sounds like what you're saying. Correct me if I'm wrong.
For clarity why don't you try reading the epistles? I'm sure if you look in your bible's table to contents you might be able to find them. Maybe.
Just how dense are you people? How many times do we have to write that works flow out of grace? Where did you ever read a post that said there should not be any works at all? Wo rid are not needed for salvation, Maybe I should try it slow....
Works flow out of Grace? You do realize that Faith is the ACCESS to Grace, right? Therefore, can dead faith (faith with no works) access Grace?
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yeah. Ok. Mmhm. Sure.
