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Carving out one scripture without the preceding scriptures that it refers to will convince some. who are already biased or unfamiliar with the Bible, of your viewpoint. I would think thoughtful skeptics and atheists would avoid doing so. So lets look at the scripture in context:
Genesis 6:1-4 states, "Now when men started to grow in number on the surface of the ground and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of the true God began to notice that the daughters of men were beautiful. So they began taking as wives all whom they chose. 3 Then Jehovah said: “My spirit will not tolerate man indefinitely, because he is only flesh. Accordingly, his days will amount to 120 years.” 4 The Nephʹi·lim were on the earth in those days and afterward. During that time the sons of the true God continued to have relations with the daughters of men, and these bore sons to them. They were the mighty ones of old times, the men of fame.
Genesis 6:4 "in those days" refers to the days that the offspring of these "mixed marriages "(between angels and humans) were born and living alongside humans AND ALSO when Jehovah pronounced the following about man.."My spirit will not tolerate man indefinitely..." (Genesis 6:1-3) The "afterward" refers to the continued mixed marriages of angels and humans as it says in Genesis 6:4 even after God had said he would end his patience with men after 120 years. Thus despite God's pronouncement the disobedient sons of God (disobedient angels) continued this situation "mixed marriages" until the flood came after which the Bible states all (men and nephilim) except the eight people in the ark perished.
The scripture in Deuteronomy 3:11 does not mean Og descended from the nephilim. Why? Simple. The Hebrew word used in Deuteronomy is Ha-repaim. This was a tribe of men who the Bible indicates lived east of the Dead Sea and were tall in size but NOT the descendants of nephilim. The Hebrew word in Genesis by the way is Ha-nepilim. NOT the same word; NOT the same meaning as Ha-repaim in Deuteronomy.
Good comment but the ones who refuse to believe will twist and turn in reply. They do not want an answer they want to denigrate. Says a lot about such and it makes responding a waste of time.
Thrillobyte... In all of your posts in your attempt to make people stumble away from God, understand this.
Christianity is not based on proof. That does not mean these events did not take place. But it does mean we do not have to have an answer for every single detail.
Christianity is based on faith in God. Christianity is based on a relationship with God. Faith in God is more precious than gold. It is impossible to please God without faith. That implies that even though we may not understand every single detail, by faith we take the events in Scripture as they appear.
We are never called to prove anything in the Bible. We are called to have faith in God and in the events recorded in the Bible.
So if I can't explain the Nephilim to your liking - it's OK. It does not imply that those events did not occur.
Exactly. My faith in Christ doesn't crumble because the story of Noah doesn't fit neatly into the context of modern science. We are talking about an ancient world that may have existed on different laws of reality. God created everything including physics. Besides there will never be enough proof to satisfy skeptics who have hardened their hearts towards God.
Most of us know that Genesis is filled with inane allegory--wild stories so outlandish they defy logic. But none it seems, is as totally out in left field as the bizarre consequences of what happened AFTER the Great Flood of Noah and why. Let's look at the verses in contention:
So let's picture this scenario EXACTLY as the Bible paints it: "There were Nephilim BEFORE the flood and AFTER the flood [as it is worded above]. More exactly, "There were Nephilim in those days [before the flood] AND AFTER [the flood] when the Sons of God went in unto the daughters of humans and had children by them"
The Bible clearly states that the wicked angels had sexual intercourse with human women AFTER the flood and produced more Nephilim. Famous examples of post-flood Nephilim are Og:
Now picture this even further: The people on earth pre-flood are wicked. Nephilim are polluting the gene pool with the seed of satan out of which Jesus has to come pure as an unblemished lamb in order to save mankind from their sins. Only Noah and his children are left unpolluted out of the millions of people inhabiting the earth. God says, "I will destroy ALL life..." and makes the decision to wipe out the totality of all life on earth including the innocent animals (but he inconveniently forgets about the fish).
So he does. The rains come, a great flood ensues and everyone is killed. Presumably, God would then lock up the evil angels who started the trouble in the first place impregnating human women and creating these giant Nephilim, right?? I mean this begs the question:
Why would God wipe out the whole human race to get rid of the Nephilim and then not lock up the evil Sons of God afterwards so he doesn't have to create another flood all over again?
You'd think God would be clever enough to do that, right?
You'd be wrong. Totally 100% wrong.
Not only does God NOT lock up the Sons of God [evil angels---the "Watchers", as they were called] but he actually permits them to resume their nefarious activities of impregnating women with their polluted seed after the flood according to scripture. WHY??????
I have asked this question of Bible literalists a dozen times and to date no one has been able to answer it, presumably because even to the most hardcore fundamentalist the lack of action on God's part makes absolutely no sense on its face.
I invite Bible inerrantists/literalists to try to answer the question without resorting to equally outlandish excuses and explanations, but I sincerely believe that, as always, nobody will touch this question with a....um...13-foot pole (wink).
I answered on the other Nephilim thread -- I don't see that the Nephilim were huge half-breed angel/humans. There really isn't anything in the text to suggest it. Angels are spiritual in nature...not physical. Scripture does not suggest they can reproduce. The Nephilim is a way of describing people that grew to be big and tall. They were completely human.
Having said that, God did wipe out the earth except for Noah and his family. He spared them, and saved them in an ark. God hates sin so much that he was willing to destroy all life except those few that he saved. That SHOULD speak to you and make you look at your own life.
It also shows that given a "2nd chance", human beings will always fail God. Noah and his family were saved--the human race was given a 2nd chance....and they failed miserably. Right after they got off the ark, they sinned against God.
There were Nephilim before the flood and there were Rephaim after the flood.
The Nephilim were not angels but were sons of the elohim. Adam was called a son of Elohim. He was an elohim. The human sons of the elohim were trying to marry the daughters of Adam to amalgamate power.
Deu 3:11 (For only Og king of Bashan had remained of the rest of the Rephaim. Behold, his divan is a burial divan of wrought iron. Is it not in Rabbah of the sons of Ammon? Nine cubits is its length and four cubits its width, in the cubit measure of a man..
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillobyte
Most of us know that Genesis is filled with inane allegory--wild stories so outlandish they defy logic. But none it seems, is as totally out in left field as the bizarre consequences of what happened AFTER the Great Flood of Noah and why. Let's look at the verses in contention:
So let's picture this scenario EXACTLY as the Bible paints it: "There were Nephilim BEFORE the flood and AFTER the flood [as it is worded above]. More exactly, "There were Nephilim in those days [before the flood] AND AFTER [the flood] when the Sons of God went in unto the daughters of humans and had children by them"
The Bible clearly states that the wicked angels had sexual intercourse with human women AFTER the flood and produced more Nephilim. Famous examples of post-flood Nephilim are Og:
Now picture this even further: The people on earth pre-flood are wicked. Nephilim are polluting the gene pool with the seed of satan out of which Jesus has to come pure as an unblemished lamb in order to save mankind from their sins. Only Noah and his children are left unpolluted out of the millions of people inhabiting the earth. God says, "I will destroy ALL life..." and makes the decision to wipe out the totality of all life on earth including the innocent animals (but he inconveniently forgets about the fish).
So he does. The rains come, a great flood ensues and everyone is killed. Presumably, God would then lock up the evil angels who started the trouble in the first place impregnating human women and creating these giant Nephilim, right?? I mean this begs the question:
Why would God wipe out the whole human race to get rid of the Nephilim and then not lock up the evil Sons of God afterwards so he doesn't have to create another flood all over again?
You'd think God would be clever enough to do that, right?
You'd be wrong. Totally 100% wrong.
Not only does God NOT lock up the Sons of God [evil angels---the "Watchers", as they were called] but he actually permits them to resume their nefarious activities of impregnating women with their polluted seed after the flood according to scripture. WHY??????
I have asked this question of Bible literalists a dozen times and to date no one has been able to answer it, presumably because even to the most hardcore fundamentalist the lack of action on God's part makes absolutely no sense on its face.
I invite Bible inerrantists/literalists to try to answer the question without resorting to equally outlandish excuses and explanations, but I sincerely believe that, as always, nobody will touch this question with a....um...13-foot pole (wink).
It also shows that given a "2nd chance", human beings will always fail God. Noah and his family were saved--the human race was given a 2nd chance....and they failed miserably. Right after they got off the ark, they sinned against God.
This begs the question: Wouldn't God have KNOWN that humans were going to fail again? If so, why would he have bothered wiping them out in the first place?
Also, today's world is pretty ugly, but there is still lots of good, and plenty of good people. Do you really believe that EVERY person on Earth at that time, except for Noah and gang, was so terrible that they deserved to be killed? Even infants and toddlers?
Either way, the verse does not say the angels had sex with humans after the flood. It says the nephilim were on earth when God spoke about the days of humans being reduced to 120 yeas, and after that, but it does not say they were there after the flood.
"I kissed my girlfriend at my house and also afterward, when I kissed her at the soda shop."
New International Version
The Nephilim were on the earth in those days and also afterward when the sons of God went to the daughters of humans and had children by them.
English Standard Version
The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of man and they bore children to them.
New American Standard Bible
The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men, and they bore children to them.
King James Bible
There were giants in the earth in those days and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them
International Standard Version
The Nephilim were on the earth at that time (and also immediately afterward), when those divine beings were having sexual relations with those human women, who gave birth to children for them.
NET Bible
The Nephilim were on the earth in those days (and also after this) when the sons of God were having sexual relations with the daughters of humankind, who gave birth to their children.
Og, a remnant [leftover] of the Nephilim..." remnant of when---before the flood or after the flood. Gotta be one or the other. Either way, the Bible says in no uncertain English that Nephilim were on the earth before AND after the flood. That's plain English. That's EXACTLY what the text says.
The verse reads that there were Nephilim AFTER THE FLOOD and also that the Sons of God went in to the women "AFTERWARD"----placing the presence of Nephilim at least AFTER THE FLOOD. We assume the Sons of God did this also BEFORE the flood although it doesn't specifically say so, because how else could the Nephilim have gotten on the earth before the flood if the Sons of God didn't have sex with the human women? So, sex with the women DEFINITEY AFTER THE FLOOD, and we assume BEFORE the flood.
Find a way around that!
Last edited by thrillobyte; 10-12-2015 at 10:06 AM..
Surely one is not advocating it is based on lies and myths?
If not PROOF, why did Thomas demand to see the marks before he would believe?>
Is this part of the lies?
Quote:
Originally Posted by zthatzmanz28
I realized Jesus is born, lives and dies out of LOVE.
Thomas demanded proof because he refused to believe. I think he was the only one who made that request. Jesus graciously granted his request. Thomas did not ask Jesus to line up and validate all of the OT prophecies concerning His resurrection.
My faith in Christ doesn't crumble because the story of Noah doesn't fit neatly into the context of modern science. We are talking about an ancient world that may have existed on different laws of reality. God created everything including physics. Besides there will never be enough proof to satisfy skeptics who have hardened their hearts towards God.
What is this different law(s) of reality?
Is this a reference to the imagination?
This begs the question: Wouldn't God have KNOWN that humans were going to fail again? If so, why would he have bothered wiping them out in the first place?
Also, today's world is pretty ugly, but there is still lots of good, and plenty of good people. Do you really believe that EVERY person on Earth at that time, except for Noah and gang, was so terrible that they deserved to be killed? Even infants and toddlers?
Actually he did know they would but He had a time schedule and the actions of the "Sons of God" were designed to stop it from happening. God stopped them and set up His own schedule running again. He knows far better than we when is the best tome to fix the problem Satan and Adam's rebellion caused. Man is just as ignorant today as 5000 year ago, they just think the little knowledge they have now makes them superior. Silly.
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