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Again. The issue is Gods will. Are you saying that when the Bible says God wants all men to be saved God is incapable of controlling Its own will and chooses not to make salvation available to all even though that was Gods desire?
You seem confused .
As to the silly screed, normal theologians regard Calvinism as a dangerous heresy that undermines the very character of God, as it turns God from a loving God to a capricious one who sends people to eternal torment on a personal whim . Hardly a decent form of Christianity.
I'm saying that we can clearly see in Scripture that God desires some things, but they do not happen. Not because he doesn't want them, but because he allows them to not happen.
He desires that we not sin. But we do. He desires that all me be saved. But not all will be. It really is that simple. If we take an honest look at Scripture, that's what we see. No matter what your personal bias is against whatever system of belief we're talking about, it's that clear.
I'm saying that we can clearly see in Scripture that God desires some things, but they do not happen. Not because he doesn't want them, but because he allows them to not happen.
He desires that we not sin. But we do. He desires that all me be saved. But not all will be. It really is that simple. If we take an honest look at Scripture, that's what we see. No matter what your personal bias is against whatever system of belief we're talking about, it's that clear.
Again, a totally unrelated point. The issue here is not something outside Gods control, like the sin of people, but Gods own will. Again, are you suggesting God has no control over Itself? That on the one hand God can say It desires all men to be saved, but when it comes to putting the plan of salvation into action God couldn’t make Itself do what It desires, and instead God created the limited atonement of Calvinism against Its own will ? How ridiculous. That’s the issue here, Gods own will in enacting the plan of salvation, not unrelated issues God can’t control .
I'm saying that we can clearly see in Scripture that God desires some things, but they do not happen. Not because he doesn't want them, but because he allows them to not happen.
He desires that we not sin. But we do. He desires that all me be saved. But not all will be. It really is that simple. If we take an honest look at Scripture, that's what we see. No matter what your personal bias is against whatever system of belief we're talking about, it's that clear.
Was Paul lying when he said he could do all things through Christ who strengthens him? The Paul who said we are more than conquerors ?
Just think God is able and if he is, we who are joined to him in Spirit are too. This is Sunday school stuff.
Again, a totally unrelated point. The issue here is not something outside Gods control, like the sin of people, but Gods own will.
Nothing is "outside God's control". Nowhere have I remotely suggested that. Not sure why you keep making that claim.
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Again, are you suggesting God has no control over Itself? That on the one hand God can say It desires all men to be saved, but when it comes to putting the plan of salvation into action God couldn’t make Itself do what It desires, and instead God created the limited atonement of Calvinism against Its own will ? How ridiculous. That’s the issue here, Gods own will in enacting the plan of salvation, not unrelated issues God can’t control .
I'm waiting for you to address the issue. I've repeatedly said it. I get it. You have no answer for it, and you're unwilling to simply admit that yes, God desires some things that he allows to not come to happen.
Nothing is "outside God's control". Nowhere have I remotely suggested that. Not sure why you keep making that claim.
You just said God wants us not to sin but we do. That is what I am referring to.
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I'm waiting for you to address the issue. I've repeatedly said it. I get it. You have no answer for it, and you're unwilling to simply admit that yes, God desires some things that he allows to not come to happen.
I have addressed everything you have brought up. Don’t start being disingenuous. I have not avoided anything you have said. I have pointed out that what God desires regarding things not under Its control versus Gods control over Its own plan of salvation are two different things . God says It wants all men to be saved, so either God can control Its own desire for about how salvation is available to all or It can’t. Which is it?
You just said God wants us not to sin but we do. That is what I am referring to.
Yes. that's right. HE COULD make us unable to sin. But he chooses not to.
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I have addressed everything you have brought up. Don’t start being disingenuous. I have not avoided anything you have said. I have pointed out that what God desires regarding things not under Its control versus Gods control over Its own plan of salvation are two different things .
He COULD make everything come to happen. He chooses not to. He COULD choose to make us unable to sin. But he chooses not to. He COULD cause all to be saved. But he chooses not to. Same thing.
Sometimes things happen that go against what he wills. Because he allows it.
So educate me on what the verse means to you.... in your own words.
Look at the context. It's about Paul living in harsh conditions, without all the things he needs. But he's learned to be content in all things, because Jesus is enough. It's about contentment. It's about living sacrificially and being content to be in Christ. It's not about a supernatural power to make things happen.
God desires some things that he allows to not come to happen.
So how do you explain Job 23:13
13 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? and what his soul desireth, even that he doeth.
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