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When will people get that the message was the same throughout the bible.... sin=bad life, no sin=good life.... The ten commandments didn't work so Jesus came to pay the debt owed by all... So if there is still a debt owed for some... do you expect Jesus to die all over again? and again? and again?
Hebrews 9:26,27 Nor did he enter heaven to offer himself again and again, the way the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood that is not his own. Then Christ would have had to suffer many times since the creation of the world. But now he has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself.
And since all have sinned... I would guess that would mean all....
The lie is presenting a fallacy that truth in scripture only exists if it meets your approval and wording. You will expect a scripture that is specifically worded as you say yet, you will not be able to demonstrate your fallacy with your own beliefs.
It is you that actually remain in your safe thinking because you believe it is dangerous to think differently than you already do.
If I am wrong, then let a scripture stand on it's own without any explanation. By itself it is either true, or by your logic the bible contradicts itself.
1Ti 2:4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
Now rather than believing this scripture, you will have to contextualize it to fit your belief.
Try supporting your beliefs without doing so. I have no such dilemma.
So do you believe that my op verses speak for themselves or are you going to contextualize them (like katjon did) to fit your beliefs???
So do you believe that my op verses speak for themselves or are you going to contextualize them (like katjon did) to fit your beliefs???
GOD BLESS!!!
ALMOST2L8
I'll do one to give you an example.
Mt 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed [the righteousness] of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Why does this have to mean that there are some who will never enter the kingdom, ever?
It doesn't, it means that the kingdom will not have unrighteous people in it. You need all the words The key word "except" is saying that no one unrighteous gets in. It is a statement of assurance.
And it aligns perfectly with 1 timothy 2:4 anytime someone is saved and brought to the knowledge of truth they meet the clause "Except"
Simple.
Nothing contextualized to twist, no words changed in either scripture when I described what I believe.
Quote: Originally Posted by Shawn71
I don't believe Jesus is a liar, ....sorry.
When will people get that the message was the same throughout the bible.... sin=bad life, no sin=good life.... The ten commandments didn't work so Jesus came to pay the debt owed by all... So if there is still a debt owed for some... do you expect Jesus to die all over again? and again? and again?
Hebrews 9:26,27 Nor did he enter heaven to offer himself again and again, the way the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood that is not his own. Then Christ would have had to suffer many times since the creation of the world. But now he has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself.
And since all have sinned... I would guess that would mean all....
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fwif, I don't know who the poster was trying to put words in my mouth but I meant 'sorry' very sarcastically. I don't like smart alec posterswho try to put words in my mouth I'd never say.....especially when I was just posting scritpures.....umm....
Mt 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed [the righteousness] of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Why does this have to mean that there are some who will never enter the kingdom, ever?
It doesn't, it means that the kingdom will not have unrighteous people in it. You need all the words The key word "except" is saying that no one unrighteous gets in. It is a statement of assurance.
And it aligns perfectly with 1 timothy 2:4 anytime someone is saved and brought to the knowledge of truth they meet the clause "Except"
Simple.
Nothing contextualized to twist, no words changed in either scripture when I described what I believe.
Thank you phazel, for your explanation. But it still doesnt explain why Jesus would proclaim that some will not enter the kingdom of heaven.
Thank you phazel, for your explanation. But it still doesnt explain why Jesus would proclaim that some will not enter the kingdom of heaven.
GOD BLESS!!!
ALMOST2L8
There is no explanation needed, the verse does not contain the phrase "some will not enter the kingdom of heaven" that is a religious bias.
Mt 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed [the righteousness] of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
It is saying nothing more than in no case "except" anyone who's righteousness exceeds the scribes and pharasees is allowed.
People believe that there are some who will not, but that is not what this verse is declaring unless you change the words. Don't change the words and try again.
MATTHEW 6:15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, NEITHER WILL YOUR FATHER FORGIVE YOUR TRESPASSES.
OK this one says your Father will not forgive your trespasses, if you don't forgive men theirs. CORRECT???
MATTHEW 7:21 NOT every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
This one says: Not everyone that calls me lord will enter into the kingdom of heaven, but the ones that do the will of my Father. CORRECT???
I wasn't speaking just for the one verse that you gave me the explanation for, I was speaking in general of the many verses where Jesus speaks of people not entering the kingdom of heaven!!!!
I do not change verses or change interpratation. I read the verses for what they say. I know not everything is literal, but in the same token the universalists (not necessarily your individual views phazel) claim that all the verses which support our views are parables or not to be taken litterally. On the other hand the ones that state say.... Saviour of the world literally means everyone in the world. And I agree he is the Saviour of the world, but the world will not all accept him as their Saviour. I guess what it boils down to is at least we both consider him our Saviour RIGHT???
The lie is presenting a fallacy that truth in scripture only exists if it meets your approval and wording. You will expect a scripture that is specifically worded as you say yet, you will not be able to demonstrate your fallacy with your own beliefs.
It is you that actually remain in your safe thinking because you believe it is dangerous to think differently than you already do.
If I am wrong, then let a scripture stand on it's own without any explanation. By itself it is either true, or by your logic the bible contradicts itself.
1Ti 2:4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
Now rather than believing this scripture, you will have to contextualize it to fit your belief.
Try supporting your beliefs without doing so. I have no such dilemma.
Scripture does not have to say word for word, But the Word (Jesus) have to have said it through is mouth, and He didn't say it, if so, we would have it in His word. Sorry, if Jesus didn't say, then it was made up throught the mouths of men. I will take Jesus word and not mans.
When will people get that the message was the same throughout the bible.... sin=bad life, no sin=good life.... The ten commandments didn't work so Jesus came to pay the debt owed by all... So if there is still a debt owed for some... do you expect Jesus to die all over again? and again? and again?
Hebrews 9:26,27 Nor did he enter heaven to offer himself again and again, the way the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood that is not his own. Then Christ would have had to suffer many times since the creation of the world. But now he has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself.
And since all have sinned... I would guess that would mean all....
Yes, I agree with you that Jesus died for our sins, all of our sins. But all will not come to Jesus, He even said that. Life is coming to Him. Jesus said, I am the way, the truth and the life. But there are some who are coming to other gods, not to Jesus.
So, if people continue to go to other gods, then that means they are not coming to the one who will give them life.
I am not against all people being saved, I honestly want all to be saved, but God says all will not come to me, they refuse, because they are ignorant and even think that other gods can save them. Like Shawn71 says, Jesus is not a man that He should like, so I will stick with Him (Jesus). So, if you want to argue with this debate of all being saved argue with Jesus, because I am only going by what He said.
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But it still doesnt explain why Jesus would proclaim that some will not enter the kingdom of heaven.
