Cincinnati sidewalks and snow (Madison, Wilson: cul-de-sac, home, neighborhood)

[cgs2000]

I believe the thinking is that the snow and ice are 'an act of god', but our ineffective attempts to clear sidewalks are products of us as responsible individuals. Please accept that many people should not be shovelling snow or chopping ice for medical reasons. (I am NOT a lawyer)

[Sarah Perry]

Originally Posted by cgs2000

I believe the thinking is that the snow and ice are 'an act of god', but our ineffective attempts to clear sidewalks are products of us as responsible individuals. Please accept that many people should not be shovelling snow or chopping ice for medical reasons. (I am NOT a lawyer)

Oh, I absolutely accept that. I'm personally one of those people.

I would guess the general reasoning behind an ordinance such as the one in Lexington is that physical inability on the part of a property owner to personally perform such a task does not exempt that individual from maintaining their property (and easements) in a manner consistent with public health and safety. In other words, if you can't keep it up or arrange to keep it up, move someplace where someone else does it for you.

For example, although we always complied by clearing (or having someone clear) our sidewalks, my husband and I used to get occasional warnings about trimming shrubs on our corner lot when someone evidently complained they were interfering with the sight line at a stop sign. It annoyed us, but we didn't think it was unreasonable, either. It just all depends on one's expectations of how an urban environment should function, I guess.

[woxyroxme]

Originally Posted by Ohiogirl81

People in Cincinnati are irrationally afraid of snow. They want no contact with it whatsoever. Therefore, sidewalks go unshoveled.

It's lazyness too, and it extends much further than Cincinnati, the guy across the street from me can't clear a path for the mailman, another neighbor claims to have a bad back another a heart condition but is a two pack a day smoker.

Originally Posted by Wilson513

Many folks are put off by the rule that although one has no duty to clear the sidewalk, if one does and it turns to ice as it did this week, one is personally liable for the injuries that result from the ice.

Originally Posted by Sarah Perry

It's interesting to me to hear this perspective from an attorney, because I always thought the reasoning about clearing the walks and liability was so whack that I assumed the people who were saying it to me were just ignorant.

The notion that clearing the snow off your sidewalk increases your liability is sheer fallacy, it ranks up there with other ridiculous urban legends. My ignorant bar stool attorney brother in law in Dayton uses this as an excuse to not clear his sidewalk because people have to walk in front of his house to get to the mailboxes. You can only be held liable if you do something to make the sidewalk slippery, like dumping water on it to make ice, this could include a downspout that drains water onto the sidewalk.

[kjbrill]

Originally Posted by Sarah Perry

Oh, I absolutely accept that. I'm personally one of those people.

I would guess the general reasoning behind an ordinance such as the one in Lexington is that physical inability on the part of a property owner to personally perform such a task does not exempt that individual from maintaining their property (and easements) in a manner consistent with public health and safety. In other words, if you can't keep it up or arrange to keep it up, move someplace where someone else does it for you.

For example, although we always complied by clearing (or having someone clear) our sidewalks, my husband and I used to get occasional warnings about trimming shrubs on our corner lot when someone evidently complained they were interfering with the sight line at a stop sign. It annoyed us, but we didn't think it was unreasonable, either. It just all depends on one's expectations of how an urban environment should function, I guess.

Correct, and I don't see a lot of ambulatory there either. But there are others who don't agree with this position. I happen to be one, and why I am damn glad to live in Mason. Don't stuff it down my throat.

[rrtechno]

Some varied views of the snow removal question.

Akron attorney says ignore urban legend: Shovel the sidewalk - Break News - Ohio

To Shovel Or Not? What Is Your Responsibility? - NBC4i: Columbus, Ohio News, Weather and Sports (WCMH-TV)

ARMOND BUDISH: TO SHOVEL SNOW OR NOT POSES A SLIPPERY PROBLEM

http://city-egov.cincinnati-oh.gov/W...FEE4DE?m=32074

Most seem to say that you can't be held liable for injuries if you don't remove natural accumulation, but might be held liable if you create or uncover an abnormal situation. It would seem that clearing your sidewalk only to have it covered by a thin layer of new snow that might be more slippery does not, in and of itself, increase your liability.

I am not a lawyer, but that appears to be the message in all the articles.

[Wilson513]

Originally Posted by woxyroxme

It's lazyness too, and it extends much further than Cincinnati, the guy across the street from me can't clear a path for the mailman, another neighbor claims to have a bad back another a heart condition but is a two pack a day smoker.




The notion that clearing the snow off your sidewalk increases your liability is sheer fallacy, it ranks up there with other ridiculous urban legends. My ignorant bar stool attorney brother in law in Dayton uses this as an excuse to not clear his sidewalk because people have to walk in front of his house to get to the mailboxes. You can only be held liable if you do something to make the sidewalk slippery, like dumping water on it to make ice, this could include a downspout that drains water onto the sidewalk.

There is of course a reason why persons like yourself cannot render legal opinions and why persons like myself, can.

The Restatement of Torts Second, guides all courts in their determinations on this topic:

Gratuitous Services. A land possessor through his/her own acts or promises may impose additional duties upon himself/herself One who undertakes, gratuitously, or for consideration, to render services to another which he should recognize as necessary for the protection of the other's person or things, is subject to liability to the other for physical harm resulting from his failure to exercise reasonable
care to perform his undertaking, if
(a) his failure to exercise such care increases the risk of such harm, or
(b) the harm is suffered because of the reliance upon the undertaking.

[cgs2000]

Wasn't there some controversy a few years ago in Cincinnati about responsibility to maintain/repair sidewalks in the right of way, when sidewalks had been created or mandated by the City? I recall that homeowners (those nasty people!) were complaining about sidewalk inspectors who were citing minuscule cracks and ordering that entire slabs be replaced.

[woxyroxme]

Originally Posted by Wilson513

There is of course a reason why persons like yourself cannot render legal opinions and why persons like myself can

I got my information from a few law firm websites. Google is your friend.

Lebanon city ordinance 541.02 states that property owners are required to remove any snow or ice from the properties adjacent sidewalks within the first four hours of daylight following a snow or ice event.

Just because people can sue because they did not get a toy in their Cracker Jack box does not mean they will win a million dollars.

[flashes1]

I view clearing your sidewalk of snow as something a good neighbor does. It shows you care about other people....and takes 10-20 minutes to do. Not a big deal.

[ProkNo5]

I went to City Council two years ago to ask why they're not enforcing the snow removal law (the city does actually require you to clear your sidewalk) and I was told directly by council that they've tried to enforce it in the past and gotten struck down by the "act of god" law. As a result they've decidedly stopped enforcing it.

I've taken to just walking in the streets during these weeks every winter.

Ohio Revised Code 4511.50: Where a sidewalk is provided and its use is
practicable, pedestrians shall not walk along or upon
the adjacent roadway. Where a sidewalk is not
available, pedestrians walking along and upon a
highway shall walk only on a shoulder, as far as
practicable from the edge of the roadway. Where
neither sidewalk nor shoulder is available, pedestrians
shall walk as near to the outside edge of the roadway
and only on the left side of the roadway, facing
traffic. Any pedestrian upon a roadway shall yield the
right-of-way to all vehicles upon the roadway