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the rest are not real cities. Atlanta kinda but not really.
I’d give Atlanta the edge over Miami. Downtown and Midtown Atlanta could fit well at home in any of the major Northern cities. Downtown Miami and Brickell still feel small and don’t give much of a sense of being in a large urban area.
That said, they are ALL “real cities.” Just developed very differently.
New Orleans for sure. Historically it was one of the largest cities in the country at the same time that many Northeastern cities were growing and developing. The city is compact with dense housing, very unlike most Sunbelt cities.
In terms of "traditional urbanity" in the South, it's New Orleans by far - not even close. The urban vernacular is rather low-slung, but it's a very tight city on the street level, with small lots and numerous walkable business districts.
After that, Charleston and Savannah have nice traditional urban areas around downtown, but they are much smaller cities - and feel like it. Richmond and Louisville are undersung in terms of their traditional urban core as well.
There's nothing else I've seen in the South which resembles a traditional urban neighborhood. The norm is much more that once you leave the downtown commercial area (whether full of new-construction buildings or charming historic ones) you transition straight to detached single-family homes, without any "middle density" residential communities worth mentioning.
In terms of "traditional urbanity" in the South, it's New Orleans by far - not even close. The urban vernacular is rather low-slung, but it's a very tight city on the street level, with small lots and numerous walkable business districts.
After that, Charleston and Savannah have nice traditional urban areas around downtown, but they are much smaller cities - and feel like it. Richmond and Louisville are undersung in terms of their traditional urban core as well.
There's nothing else I've seen in the South which resembles a traditional urban neighborhood. The norm is much more that once you leave the downtown commercial area (whether full of new-construction buildings or charming historic ones) you transition straight to detached single-family homes, without any "middle density" residential communities worth mentioning.
I'd argue that Richmond is as, if not more urban than New Orleans.
I'd argue that Richmond is as, if not more urban than New Orleans.
The vernacular is more urban (since it's rowhouses and near-rowhouses, which New Orleans really only has in parts of the French Quarter) but the overall size of the intact 19th century core is I think somewhat smaller overall.
The vernacular is more urban (since it's rowhouses and near-rowhouses, which New Orleans really only has in parts of the French Quarter) but the overall size of the intact 19th century core is I think somewhat smaller overall.
New Orleans has a land area of 169 sq/mi. Richmond's is 62 sq/mi. It would reason that Richmond has the smaller urban core, but I don't think it's less urban, on any level.
Richmond is a real city in the south by northern standards - it's why I moved here from Boston. I've lived in Miami, it isn't a real city by my Yankee standards. In fact, I wouldn't say any of the rest but New Orleans count, though I really like a lot of things about Austin. But not enough neighborhoods without yards...
I’d give Atlanta the edge over Miami. Downtown and Midtown Atlanta could fit well at home in any of the major Northern cities. Downtown Miami and Brickell still feel small and don’t give much of a sense of being in a large urban area.
That said, they are ALL “real cities.” Just developed very differently.
Miamis density is 12,604 poeple per square mile. Its more densely densely populated as Philadelphia and Washington DC. Southern folks always want to talk MSA, but in the north we talk City proper. City proper Miami is a real city
Atlanta's density is 3,547 people per square mile. The same as many suburban towns in the north.
This is such a hilariously pretentious thread. "Real" cities in the South, based on "northern standards". LOL! Sorry, but a city (oh, excuse me........"real city", I guess as opposed to a "fake" city. Who knows, lol) doesn't have to have residents living together like sardines and "encouraged" to live a car free lifestyle, both resulting in insane costs of living in order to be piously considered by others narrow definitions as "real".
Gosh, I was thinking all of these years that I was actually living in a real city! I mean, dang! I feel so......so enlightened now. Being saved from one's blissful ignorance by others much more worldly than I is so empowering and freeing. I mean.......thank you................and "bless your hearts"...........
LOL!!!
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