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Now, I might be taking a slight at Minnesota sports, but oh well...I'll repent later! Not only does Detroit teams have a very good attendance record, but Detroit teams seem to, uh, win! The reason why Minnesota teams don't win, might relate to the reason why there is even a debate about the new Vikings football stadium in the first place. Minnesotans are too frugal over their spending. I don't know exactly what the payrolls are for each of the 4 Minnesota teams or how the rank overall in their respected leagues. I do know the Twins payroll is near the bottom of Major League Baseball....
I do know you are wrong on this as the Twins now rank 9th out of 30 teams.
Location: Cleveland bound with MPLS in the rear-view
5,509 posts, read 11,872,410 times
Reputation: 2501
Quote:
Originally Posted by JmanAA
Minnesota needs to build a new football stadium for the Vikings! Period! I applaud Gov. Dayton for calling the special session, and getting this done. As an anonymous poster on another board said, Minneapolis-St. Paul is the 14th (or 15th) largest metro in the country, they need to start acting like it. Raise the sales tax by .5 percent, and get that stadium built. I am not a Minnesota native nor am I a fan of the vikings, but I do think it's really cool to have an NFL team in the city and I am supporting Minnesota fans who want a new stadium built and who want their beloved football team to stay in Minnesota. I wasn't here when the whole debate over the financing of the new Twins baseball stadium (Target Field) was going on, but I commend the leaders for making sure that Stadium was financed and built, and I'm sure some of those "cry babies" are now very very proud the stadium was built. Plus, I see that Metrodome almost everyday, and it's plain UGLY and looks very outdated. The Vikings deserve a new stadium, so hopefully the leaders will do everything they have to do to make sure that stadium is built. It's a shame this even has to be an issue.
You have to appreciate how TOUCHY the issue is though....
The State is working its way out of a $5 billion budget deficit.
Taxes in the State are among the highest in the country already.
Two recent stadiums have been built (for Twins and Gophers) and a light rail line is being constructed currently -- all are very expensive and some have raised tax rates locally.
Schools and teachers have been cut completely and tuition continues to increase in private schools and colleges.
There's always that reminder about the state of our infrastructure as well, especially considering this is the place where a National Interstate collapsed with people on it!
Considering all of that, not to even mention the politics of it and much much more, you can see why asking for ANOTHER stadium to subsidize a billionaire owner (who isn't from the state) is a very very touchy subject. ESPECIALLY in this terrible economy (arguably the 2nd worst ever in the past 100+ years!).
It's a lot to ask for, and nobody wants to be the one to cut vital services (schools, fire, police) or raise taxes to fund a GAME.
P.S. I am a DIE HARD Vikings fan, and I know we need a stadium! However, schools should always come first and I don't want to live in a place that puts kids and education second to stadiums.
OK. I stand corrected. I didn't know the Twins started spending more money. You really can't attack me (that much) on anything more than my neglect to do research in making sure the Twins were still one of the lowest spending teams in the MLB. But, you know as well as I do that the Twins have always had a reputation for having one of the lowest payrolls (and for a few years, the absolute lowest payroll) in Major League Baseball. You know why that is? Because, they were. For example, in 2000, the Minnesota Twins were dead last in payroll. Source: CNNSI.com - MLB Baseball - 2000 Baseball Payrolls - Thursday April 13, 2000 06:29 AM
I do see that things were starting to get better afterward: MLB Payrolls for years 2000 to 2005 (http://alanjones.us/mlb-payrolls.htm - broken link), but were still in the bottom half of the league. I didn't do my research this time and assumed something, I think many people (even in Minnesota) would still assume the Twins had one of the lowest team salaries in the MLB.
Location: Cleveland bound with MPLS in the rear-view
5,509 posts, read 11,872,410 times
Reputation: 2501
^I think that's a fair assumption. The Twins couldn't make money but had a winning record regardless, and their reputation as "pirhannas" came because they fight hard and play extremely well as a team, instead of swinging for the fences and buying their victories like the Yankees or Red Sox do. Locals love that!
Most literate? Depends on whom you ask. Some say it is D.C., some say Seattle, some say Boston.
While there are parts of Mpls that have progressive politics, there are other parts of Mpls and MN that are super conservative (just like a number of upper Midwest states).
As far as crime, Mpls is not immune. In a 2010 ranking, it came in 48th overall, just below Akron and above cities like Miami and Dallas.
My point is that not everyone wants to be Mpls or MN like you so boldly stated. For example, I live in Madison; I know many people that live here that would be sad if we became a sprawling metro of ~ 3 million people and had to deal with the sorts of problems that come with becoming a big city. Or my family in IL, a state with more than double the GDP and output of MN. I'm not sure they are clambering to to lose almost $400 billion worth of GDP.
I love Minnesota, but not everyone necessarily wants to be/live/work in Minnesota.
1. You are confusing educated with literate they are two separate things. Literacy normally place Seattle first some years, Minneapolis first some years but not even arguable those are the most literate cities.
2. No city is immune to crime but there is much less of it in Minneapolis and Minnesota compared to Chicago or Illinois. Much less and much less violent. I'm sure any respect deserving Chicagoan would rather have the crime rate of Minneapolis than Chicago's.
3. The same can be said of Chicago, its areas of liberal vs conservative politics but progressive isn't a liberal vs conservative thing IMO. Progressive politics is the prolonged effort to improve and better the quality of life, Minneapolis has more success with that than does Chicago. Chicago's politics are regressive with the corruption IMO
4. Never claimed everyone wishes to be like Minneapolis or Minnesota but Minneapolis has qualities other midwestern cities should try to replicate.
4. Never claimed everyone wishes to be like Minneapolis or Minnesota but Minneapolis has qualities other midwestern cities should try to replicate.
10-17-2011, 11:37 PM
Slyman11
Senior Member
Location: DC/MIA
306 posts, read 56,923 times
Reputation: 128
"Every other city in the midwest wishes it had Minneapolis or Minnesota's success. It's what Columbus and Indy should look up to being like, not Saint Louis, Detroit, Chicago, etc"
10-17-2011, 11:37 PM
Slyman11
Senior Member
Location: DC/MIA
306 posts, read 56,923 times
Reputation: 128
"Every other city in the midwest wishes it had Minneapolis or Minnesota's success. It's what Columbus and Indy should look up to being like, not Saint Louis, Detroit, Chicago, etc"
Read it again please, stating every city in the midwest wished to have Minneapolis's success is not perpetually the same as saying every city wishes to be Minneapolis. Wishing for similar success in a city more successful at different things does not mean wanting to be a carbon copy of the aforementioned city.
Why would you not want Chicago to be more literate, having a better economy, being safer, etc?
Minnesota needs to build a new football stadium for the Vikings! Period! I applaud Gov. Dayton for calling the special session, and getting this done. As an anonymous poster on another board said, Minneapolis-St. Paul is the 14th (or 15th) largest metro in the country, they need to start acting like it. Raise the sales tax by .5 percent, and get that stadium built. I am not a Minnesota native nor am I a fan of the vikings, but I do think it's really cool to have an NFL team in the city and I am supporting Minnesota fans who want a new stadium built and who want their beloved football team to stay in Minnesota. I wasn't here when the whole debate over the financing of the new Twins baseball stadium (Target Field) was going on, but I commend the leaders for making sure that Stadium was financed and built, and I'm sure some of those "cry babies" are now very very proud the stadium was built. Plus, I see that Metrodome almost everyday, and it's plain UGLY and looks very outdated. The Vikings deserve a new stadium, so hopefully the leaders will do everything they have to do to make sure that stadium is built. It's a shame this even has to be an issue.
I agree that the Vikings should have a better stadium, BUT it should not be built in Arden Hills. IMO, the stadium should be built next to or near existing light rail and / or commuter rail lines. Furthermore, I think Zygi Wilf should not have as much say as he has had thus far as he is the one begging for money from city, county, and state officials. BTW, the main issue Minnesota has with getting the stadium or any other project done is its politicians. Minnesota is full of idiot politicians who don't want to do their jobs because they are afraid of losing their jobs so, they constantly pass the buck off to someone else / group and can never come up with creative or innovative ways of doing things. They always wait until the last hour to get things done, which is so frustrating.
Local and state politicians should be ashamed of themselves if they allow the Vikings to leave one of the central cities (MPLS or STPL) as they will be intentionally allowing for a decrease in light rail and commuter rail ridership numbers. They constantly push for light rail as being part of smart growth and how it's essential for the Twin Cities vitality. How is building in Arden Hills smart growth? They (the politicians) should expect the public to turn on them when it comes to additional light rail lines.
Anyway, here are the stadiums and arenas located next to or within a short walking distance from light rail and commuter lines.
* Target Field
* Target Center
* Metrodome
* TCF Stadium
* Williams Arena
* Mariucci Arena
* Ridder Arena
* Xcel Energy Center
* Roy Wilkins Auditorium
Read it again, stating every city in the midwest wished to have Minneapolis's success is not perpetually the same as saying every city wishes to be Minneapolis. Wishing for similar success in a city more successful at different things does not mean wanting to be a carbon copy of the aforementioned city.
Why would you not want Chicago to be more literate, having a better economy, being safer, etc?
First, I don't live in or near Chicago nor do I live in Illinois, so it doesn't exactly matter to me what they do/don't do. Second, I wish everyone in the world would be literate, but no country nor city is completely literate. Third, Chicago has a much larger economy than Mpls; many argue that Chicago has the most balanced economy in the U.S. Fourth, yes, I wish every city were safer. However, I still contend that you are placing Mpls on too high of a pedestal, and I think that there are a number of cities that would argue against aspiring to be Mpls because some cities are safer and less congested than Mpls and have perfectly fine economies with low unemployment.
First, I don't live in or near Chicago nor do I live in Illinois, so it doesn't exactly matter to me what they do/don't do. Second, I wish everyone in the world would be literate, but no country nor city is completely literate. Third, Chicago has a much larger economy than Mpls; many argue that Chicago has the most balanced economy in the U.S. Fourth, yes, I wish every city were safer. However, I still contend that you are placing Mpls on too high of a pedestal, and I think that there are a number of cities that would argue against aspiring to be Mpls because some cities are safer and less congested than Mpls and have perfectly fine economies with low unemployment.
1. So you're saying Minneapolis and metro Minneapolis are more dangerous than Chicago and Chicagoland? That's a first, the crime is no where as bad and its not my opinion its a fact.
2. Having a larger economy means nothing in the well being of a population IMO. Chicago's unemployment rate is 4.6% higher than that of Minneapolis, meaning more unemployment in Chicagoland than Minneapolis
3. If you are defending Chicago then you should take a stand with what Chicago is doing, saying you don't care is ridiculous if you're supporting Chicago in this thread.
4. I contend you're placing Minneapolis on to low a 'pedestal'. It may not be the largest but its the best rounded metro in the midwest and supporting evidence aka education rates, employment rates, crime rates all support that
Not saying Chicago is bad but I and very many others prefer of Chicago to be more literate, better employed, and safer like the way Minneapolis is compared to Chicago or Detroit now IMO
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Not only does Detroit teams have a very good attendance record, but Detroit teams seem to, uh, win! The reason why Minnesota teams don't win, might relate to the reason why there is even a debate about the new Vikings football stadium in the first place. Minnesotans are too frugal over their spending. I don't know exactly what the payrolls are for each of the 4 Minnesota teams or how the rank overall in their respected leagues. I do know the Twins payroll is near the bottom of Major League Baseball....
I do know you are wrong on this as the Twins now rank 9th out of 30 teams.