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Agreed. I don't think the popularity of Cajun or Creole restaurants has anything to do with New Orleans influencing the surrounding region. I've seen Cajun restaurants in Paris and I've heard of one in Tokyo! There even used to be (not sure if it's around anymore) a chain of New Oreans style restaurants in England called something like Roux Orleans. If anything that just proves how unique Louisiana's food is because it has become one of the foods of the world. There are not too many Quebecois restaurants around the world...(although I love Quebecois food)
When you go to a New Orleans styled restaurant outside NOLA, it's usually a Cajun/Creole style fusion place.
That being said, you can get Creole food outside of NOLA all the way throughout the Caribbean and other parts of Latin America and I believe parts of Africa. All NOLA cuisine is just Creole done with different ingredients and their own specific twist. They also have their own specialties like the muffaletta sandwich and po' boys. But if you go throughout the caribbean and eat their local dishes (not influenced by NOLA) you're going to be strongly reminded of NOLA food. The main differences is in their stews they tend to use pork or fish versus shell fish. But the taste (style of food, spices) is so eerily similar that feels like you went to go make a recipe and substituted out 1 or 2 ingredients because you didn't have them.
All Quebecois food is french food done with their own ingredients and twists with some of their own specialties like those bagels and those french fries covered in cheese. Sound familiar? NOLA cuisine isn't anymore unique than Quebecois it's more famous though. The reason it's more famous is that NOLA cuisine is used to represent Creole whereas Quebecois isn't used to represent French. We can get into a discussion why, but it's pretty obvious why from history.
I really meant that there is a much higher amount of people that learn French in the city than elsewhere in America.
Interior new england is the most "french" place in the United States. Maine (population 1.3 million) has more French speakers than Louisiana (population 4.7 million). I also believe most French speakers in NOLA are not natives (Cajun speakers) but rather immigrants or people who learned.
Well those statistics are a little strange. It says the United States is 13% Catholic where most stats say it is about 23%. 6% of New Orleans is religious? I am talking about much more than Creole but also the affects all the other immigrant groups had. Also like you pointed out, things can be Creole but very different like how Brazil and New Orleans have creoles. Plus as you said Mobile lost a lot of its Creole heritage. Creole is just a word it does not mean they are at all culturally similar. The French Quarter is in-authentic, a lot of the attractions are for tourists and about what New Orleans is "imagined" to be but it does not even scratch the surface of what New Orleans culturally is. I was just trying to point out that is what the average tourist sees, not directed towards you in particular.
Well, that's pushing it. The word is used differently, so let's get that out of the way.
Some people use Creole to refer to any French person born in Louisiana. But more often a mixed-race person out of Louisiana.
I use it to refer to any mixed-race person, provided the person is mixed with either spanish/portuguese/french with some african (from the slave trade) and some native group from the west indies.
Some people go farther and use it for anyone born in one of the former spanish, portuguese or french colonies.
But many of the Caribbean countries and Latin America (Brazil) have such strong notable similarities in food, carnival (Mardi Gras), costume, religion (a mix of african and west indie with catholicism), superstition, approach to life. All of them are slightly different from each other (like NOLA) because the mix of people, subsequent immigration, histories and local topography were different. But if we were to be that strict, every culture would be just as unique as the rest.
You think that "Cajun" was good, what did you even eat? Jambalaya?
What are you talking about? The Cajun food I ate in the glades? That was fried frog legs done Cajun style.
Did you chime in just to ask that stupid question or you just like flirting with me? I know you're a guy (with a girls name) but you sure carry on like a girl.
Well, that's pushing it. The word is used differently, so let's get that out of the way.
Some people use Creole to refer to any French person born in Louisiana. But more often a mixed-race person out of Louisiana.
I use it to refer to any mixed-race person, provided the person is mixed with either spanish/portuguese/french with some african (from the slave trade) and some native group from the west indies.
Some people go farther and use it for anyone born in one of the former spanish, portuguese or french colonies.
There's no real exact definition of Creole. The original term comes from the Spanish word, "Criollo", which was used in the colonial caste system to define Spaniards born in the colonies who ranked lower than those born in Spain. The term was used as Creole amongst the French colonies, but over time it just came to refer to the mix of cultures in any area of the Caribbean and Latin America or Africa. Originally it didn't refer to those of mixed African descent. In some ways the Louisiana Creole culture is most influenced by the white French Creole planters that fled after the Haitian Revolution. The term Creole just eventually came to be associated with mixed.
There's tons of different cuisines, languages, and cultures called "Creole". It can refer to the mix of cultures anywhere in former French, Spanish, or Portuguese colonial region--even in Peru there's Criollo or Creole cuisine mixing Spanish, African, Chinese, and Native American traditions. There's no real definitive Creole cuisine for the whole region--you're right that there's a lot of similarities between the Caribbean and New Orleans--however at the same time there's other cultural influences such as Italian or German that have infused into Louisiana Creole cuisine that differentiates it.
But it's just as food in Quebec is heavily influenced and reminiscent of French cuisine, but it's also been influenced by waves of Irish and later Italian and Jewish immigrants.
--however at the same time there's other cultural influences such as Italian or German that have infused into Louisiana Creole cuisine that differentiates it.
That's true (though I didn't know German had much of an influence) but the same song and dance can be said about every local. The specific mixing and then immigrants and the available ingredients all helped shape their dishes and thus all are slightly different from each other. But they share a strong, recognizable "backbone." I think and suspect that this backbone is a west african way of making dishes but I never traveled there.
That's true (though I didn't know German had much of an influence) but the same song and dance can be said about every local. The specific mixing and then immigrants and the available ingredients all helped shape their dishes and thus all are slightly different from each other. But they share a strong, recognizable "backbone." I think and suspect that this backbone is a west african way of making dishes but I never traveled there.
West African food and culture and the slave trade is one of the key elements that influenced the whole Latin/Carribbean region, along with New Orleans(and the rest of the American South) and sort of ties the region together in many ways. There's similarities between Jamaican or West Indian food and American soul food as well on some levels(like collard greens in the South and the prepration of callaloo in Jamaica). So yeah, the African influence in some ways provides a common foundation for a lot of the region-including music as well.
But at the same time you have all these French and Spanish and Portugese colonial influences--and one has to take into consideration that the Spanish and Portugese were influenced by a lot of North African/Moorish culture(in both food and music)--which in some ways mixed in and influenced West Africa in some ways. So it's all just a crazy cross-cultural stew.
Jazz music itself is really a result of a "Creole" mix as well. It was a basically what happened in Jim Crow-era New Orleans when the educated free mixed-race Creoles in New Orleans(who were classically trained in European musical styles and marching bands) suddenly found themselves associating with the poorer former slaves who kept African drumming rhythms and call and response chats from West Africa alive at Congo Square.
Well, that's pushing it. The word is used differently, so let's get that out of the way.
Some people use Creole to refer to any French person born in Louisiana. But more often a mixed-race person out of Louisiana.
I use it to refer to any mixed-race person, provided the person is mixed with either spanish/portuguese/french with some african (from the slave trade) and some native group from the west indies.
Some people go farther and use it for anyone born in one of the former spanish, portuguese or french colonies.
But many of the Caribbean countries and Latin America (Brazil) have such strong notable similarities in food, carnival (Mardi Gras), costume, religion (a mix of african and west indie with catholicism), superstition, approach to life. All of them are slightly different from each other (like NOLA) because the mix of people, subsequent immigration, histories and local topography were different. But if we were to be that strict, every culture would be just as unique as the rest.
The term Creole is not a definite one. I am Creole in a sense of the word, I'm black with Cherokee and white blood.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PosterExtraordinaire
What are you talking about? The Cajun food I ate in the glades? That was fried frog legs done Cajun style.
Did you chime in just to ask that stupid question or you just like flirting with me? I know you're a guy (with a girls name) but you sure carry on like a girl.
Just to further prove you don't know what you're talking about.
When you go to a New Orleans styled restaurant outside NOLA, it's usually a Cajun/Creole style fusion place.
That being said, you can get Creole food outside of NOLA all the way throughout the Caribbean and other parts of Latin America and I believe parts of Africa. All NOLA cuisine is just Creole done with different ingredients and their own specific twist. They also have their own specialties like the muffaletta sandwich and po' boys. But if you go throughout the caribbean and eat their local dishes (not influenced by NOLA) you're going to be strongly reminded of NOLA food. The main differences is in their stews they tend to use pork or fish versus shell fish. But the taste (style of food, spices) is so eerily similar that feels like you went to go make a recipe and substituted out 1 or 2 ingredients because you didn't have them.
All Quebecois food is french food done with their own ingredients and twists with some of their own specialties like those bagels and those french fries covered in cheese. Sound familiar? NOLA cuisine isn't anymore unique than Quebecois it's more famous though. The reason it's more famous is that NOLA cuisine is used to represent Creole whereas Quebecois isn't used to represent French. We can get into a discussion why, but it's pretty obvious why from history.
The food is still home-grown. New Orleans Creole food (which in your definition seems to be any food that originated or is historically popular in the city) is still different. Like you said it has different ingredients and a specific twist. Is that supposed to downplay the food as if you can get the exact same thing in the caribbean or where ever. I also never really thought of foods like the muffaletta or po-boys as Creole food, I kind of think there are different categories. Calling a muffaletta Creole food to me woud be similar to calling a Philly cheese steak or Chicago deep dish pizza Creole. But there are so many definitions of Creole, so it seems like it is what ever a person's personal beliefs are. If you want to follow your route, then one could probably list hundreds of foods that are New Orleans Creole ranging from mexican influenced to Chinese influenced.
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