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Depends how you define growth. Population growth is not good without economic growth. economic growth is the key. sustainable just means flatline. meaning not growth or shrinkage in either aspect. so yes a city can be very sustainable without growth, and some people would consider it preferable!
Coming from California, both Georgia and Pennsylvania seem to have an awful lot of cigarette smokers and, outside of the posh urban areas, some scary-looking people with very odd piercings, tattoos and styles of dress (e.g., men with long beards, shaved heads and hoop earrings). I’ve never lived in Appalachia, so that could be the reason for the culture shock on my end. In reality, however, Georgia is more similar to Maryland than Pennsylvania: most of the built environment is clean and new-looking. Also, there are lots and lots of black people everywhere you go. Of course, there is nothing wrong with that, but woah, it’s definitely not Iowa, New Hampshire, Washington or any other “General American” state, that’s for sure.
Depends how you define growth. Population growth is not good without economic growth. economic growth is the key. sustainable just means flatline. meaning not growth or shrinkage in either aspect. so yes a city can be very sustainable without growth, and some people would consider it preferable!
Welll, this was talking specifically about states not cities. But what’s more, states’ ability to pay their bills almost always corresponds to a tax base that is growing. Take Connecticut for example. Their population has fallen this decade and their GDP has shrunk about 2%. So one of the richest states in the nation is having a crisis while the US economy booms because they had planned their budgets around continued growth. At some point stagnation is a problem as expenses go up without a corresponding increase in income.
Coming from California, both Georgia and Pennsylvania seem to have an awful lot of cigarette smokers and, outside of the posh urban areas, some scary-looking people with very odd piercings, tattoos and styles of dress (e.g., men with long beards, shaved heads and hoop earrings). I’ve never lived in Appalachia, so that could be the reason for the culture shock on my end.
I can't think of a state that doesn't have pretty substantial sociocultural and economic differences between major urban areas and "the rest" of itself. Really has nothing to do with "Appalachia."
California, for example, has plenty of rural areas where there's a "The Hills Have Eyes" super-desolate vibe outside of its glamorous coast.
The northern stretch of the Appalachian mountain chain comprising Pennsylvania is still a world away from the more traditionally thought about "Appalachia" in places like West Virginia and Kentucky that you're alluding to.
Well I don’t know about all that, but certainly when discussing Pennsylvania, Philly’s non-PA bits have to be redacted out for consistency.
When discussing just the states themselves, yes I agree. However, I regularly see people argue on here that say NYC and Philly "cheat" with their population and economy because their populations and economies spread beyond man-made imaginary lines on the ground.
I haven't lived in GA, so I'm genuinely asking if you could please explain these.
1. I've yet to see a ranking that ever puts GA K-12 over PA K-12.
2. PA roads are older than GA, that's for sure. But OP asked about public transit and sustainability as well. Hands down PA has the better public transit. And as a conservative state, I'd assume (knowing full well what assuming can do both you and me) that GA doesn't care about sustainability as much as PA with a Dem. Governor and heavily blue Pittsburgh and Philly.
3. I know nothing about suburbs because I'm a city boy. But isn't the Main Line one of the best suburban regions in the country? And then there is all of South Jersey as well. Is GA better for suburbs because they're more affordable?
4. Philly is often regarded as one of the top food cities in the country. I know Atlanta also has good food, but can it really compare? Philly has some of the best Italian food in the country, a large Jewish population for good delis, a large Caribbean Latin population for Cuban/Puerto Rican/Dominican food, a full Chinatown, a heavy Vietnamese area in South Philly, a sizable Mexican population in South Philly bringing in great Mexican food, famous chefs in all cuisines especially Israeli/Mediterranean (Zahav), and more I can't think of. Philly has the cheesesteak to call its own. The soul/Southern food/cuisine is good in the area with the large black population. I can't comment much on Pittsburgh's cuisine and dining culture, but with just Philly alone, I can't see how GA can win that category, so it doesn't make sense that you can add Pittsburgh's dining and still have PA come out behind GA in that category.
Please don't take this as argumentative. I'd genuinely just like to hear your side of those 4.
You seem to be viewing PA with a Philly bias. Philadelphia has better Public Transit than Atlanta but PA roads on the whole are so bad that it knocks it down a couple pegs. The main line things is sort of subjective. I think it's nice but super over priced. That's something that shouldn't be overlooked. Atlanta offers better more affordable suburbs. Pittsburgh suburbs are notoriously meh. Outside of Philly PA food doesn't really do it for me. Even in Philly I get strange looks when I ask for provolone cheese on my cheese steak. Like I'm sorry I like real cheese ok.
Edit: On second thought maybe I'd give pk-12 to PA.
Last edited by Turnerbro; 11-17-2019 at 08:28 PM..
The point would be that Georgia doesn't seem to have much else to talk about than Atlanta. Atlanta didn't get to the national stage its on now until the 1990's. Pittsburgh had already been there since the 1880's and still gets stuff like G-20, etc.
Does Georgia have a secondary metro that compares to Pittsburgh? Savannah? Columbus?
Savannah isn't on Pittsburgh's level but it shouldn't be overlooked.
Economy - GA
Education, K-12 - PA
Education, colleges and universities - PA
Infrastructure (road conditions, public transit, bridges, water/energy sustainability/supply, etc.) - GA
Housing (quality of architecture, selection of old and new, urban, suburban and rural, etc.) - GA
Cost of living - GA
Major cities - PA
Suburbs - GA
Small cities and rural areas - Tie
General state culture, events and activities - Tie
Cuisine - GA
Outdoor recreation - GA
Scenery - GA
Climate - GA
Geographic position (proximity to out-of-state opportunities and recreation; importance in surrounding region) - GA
PA is actually one of my favorite states. But I love GA as well and just see it as a more livable, higher QOL than PA due to its climate, COL, and economy.
What do you prefer about Georgia’s suburbs? The Philly burbs are outstanding, along with Pittsburgh’s. The Lehigh Valley and South Central have a lot of new suburban development if that’s what you prefer.
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