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Raleigh is not a mid-South city. I don't know exactly what makes something mid-South (if I considered it at all, I'd say it had something to do with the Mississippi River). That second link makes it sound like a Tennessee-Arkansas super-state. It sounds like it's just a nebulous term that people have decided to make more nebulous.
I will admit, I laughed when they had Cincinnati, Indianapolis, and St. Louis included in the zecond link. I typed in Mid South Nashville in google and found over 40 businesses with Mid South before their name in Nashville. I wonder if there are better definitions than the wikipedia example, which includes parts of Oklahoma, Illinois, Indiana Missouri. It seems the most accurate. I agree that there are distinct cultural differences between the region and Nashville. The Mid South and Jackson Purchase have noticeable Delta and Deep South influences not really found here.
Actually the Birmingham metro area (+5.1%) grew considerably faster than the Memphis metro area (+1.6%) between the 2010 and 2020 census. I think the characterization of Birmingham as "stagnant" would have been more appropriate a few decades ago.
That's a great point, from 2000 to 2020 the Birmingham metro has maintained steady growth even as the city proper fought through population loss so much so that as metro area populations Memphis and Birmingham are almost identical and their rankings respectively at 43rd and 44th reflect that. If Birmingham and specifically Jefferson and Shelby counties (you can throw in St. Clair too) resume even modest population gains I find it probable and even likely that within the next 10 years or so the Birmingham metro area will pass Memphis regarding CSA rankings.
That's a great point, from 2000 to 2020 the Birmingham metro has maintained steady growth even as the city proper fought through population loss so much so that as metro area populations Memphis and Birmingham are almost identical and their rankings respectively at 43rd and 44th reflect that. If Birmingham and specifically Jefferson and Shelby counties (you can throw in St. Clair too) resume even modest population gains I find it probable and even likely that within the next 10 years or so the Birmingham metro area will pass Memphis regarding CSA rankings.
The Birmingham, AL area feels like a hidden gem metro to me, whenever I've street viewed certain parts of it. I especially like Mountain Brook, and its downtown myself.
Wouldn't be surprised IF one day the city of Birmingham manages to start growing again, that the Birmingham metro(for population) were to pass the Memphis metro(for population). I thought the primary cities of both metros were stagnant to very slowly declining, for at least the last few decades? I wonder when the last time either primary city, did have any population growth.
Back to Memphis, I'd clearly put it ahead of Jackson, MS for sure. I don't know why anyone would rank Jackson over Memphis, that's for sure!
The Birmingham, AL area feels like a hidden gem metro to me, whenever I've street viewed certain parts of it. I especially like Mountain Brook, and its downtown myself.
Wouldn't be surprised IF one day the city of Birmingham manages to start growing again, that the Birmingham metro(for population) were to pass the Memphis metro(for population). I thought the primary cities of both metros were stagnant to very slowly declining, for at least the last few decades? I wonder when the last time either primary city, did have any population growth.
Back to Memphis, I'd clearly put it ahead of Jackson, MS for sure. I don't know why anyone would rank Jackson over Memphis, that's for sure!
I agree it's natural beauty is under-rated and downtown is evolving at a rapid pace. Citywalk in Uptown Birmingham is the 1.5 mile park under the 59/20 interstate bridge that is the hot attraction and entertainment district in the city right now.
Time will tell ultimately but Birmingham’s metro has really caught up to Memphis over the last 20 years, I wouldn't be surprised either.I think it is likely the metro will resume positive momentum due to the role Birmingham plays as the logistics hub of Alabama's auto industry.
Birmingham’s metro has really caught up to Memphis over the last 20 years
That's the saddest thing about Memphis: to see all the cities and metros that were way behind Memphis (or in the same tier as Memphis) for so many years, either catch up to or surpass Memphis, while Memphis just stays stagnant.
That's the saddest thing about Memphis: to see all the cities and metros that were way behind Memphis (or in the same tier as Memphis) for so many years, either catch up to or surpass Memphis, while Memphis just stays stagnant.
I don't know if I agree that that's the "saddest thing about Memphis at all-stagnant/population decline.
This story is par for the course in the rust belt and midwest, where cities have seen this since the 1960s or 70s.
Cities there are coping/reinventing themselves/changing to adapt; cities like Cleveland, Detroit, St Louis, all have west and southern metros passing them, while they mostly stay stagnant population-wise.
High crime in Memphis is something that needs to come down. As well as increasing income and gaining higher paying jobs.
I don't know if I agree that that's the "saddest thing about Memphis at all-stagnant/population decline.
This story is par for the course in the rust belt and midwest, where cities have seen this since the 1960s or 70s.
Cities there are coping/reinventing themselves/changing to adapt; cities like Cleveland, Detroit, St Louis, all have west and southern metros passing them, while they mostly stay stagnant population-wise.
High crime in Memphis is something that needs to come down. As well as increasing income and gaining higher paying jobs.
But we are not TALKING about the other cities you listed. We are talking about MEMPHIS. This thread is about MEMPHIS, which has been shot past by other cities all around the SOUTH (not the Mid-West, which is a different animal, and is where all the cities you named are located); and it's a long list of cities, like Atlanta, Nashville, Charlotte, Dallas, Houston, Austin, and even shown up in growth in a lot of areas by cities like Chattanooga, Huntsville, and Birmingham, when for years, Memphis was either AHEAD of these cities or neck-and-neck with them. THAT is the issue at hand. And yes, it is indeed sad, and it is exactly why people give Memphis the hardest time out of all the cities listed in this poll; it's arguably the city that had the most potential but dropped the ball and has refused to pick it back up and run with it for YEARS now.
Last edited by NoClueWho; 09-19-2022 at 08:33 AM..
But we are not TALKING about the other cities you listed. We are talking about MEMPHIS. This thread is about MEMPHIS, which has been shot past by other cities all around the SOUTH (not the Mid-West, which is a different animal, and is where all the cities you named are located); and it's a long list of cities, like Atlanta, Nashville, Charlotte, Dallas, Houston, Austin, and even shown up in growth in a lot of areas by cities like Chattanooga, Huntsville, and Birmingham, when for years, Memphis was either AHEAD of these cities or neck-and-neck with them. THAT is the issue at hand. And yes, it is indeed sad, and it is exactly why people give Memphis the hardest time out of all the cities listed in this poll; it's arguably the city that had the most potential but dropped the ball and has refused to pick it back up and run with it for YEARS now.
Well one upside to Memphis not undergoing a big growth spurt in the postwar period is that more of its historic urban fabric is still intact and that will be beneficial whenever the city does experience another growth cycle.
But we are not TALKING about the other cities you listed. We are talking about MEMPHIS. This thread is about MEMPHIS, which has been shot past by other cities all around the SOUTH (not the Mid-West, which is a different animal, and is where all the cities you named are located); and it's a long list of cities, like Atlanta, Nashville, Charlotte, Dallas, Houston, Austin, and even shown up in growth in a lot of areas by cities like Chattanooga, Huntsville, and Birmingham, when for years, Memphis was either AHEAD of these cities or neck-and-neck with them. THAT is the issue at hand. And yes, it is indeed sad, and it is exactly why people give Memphis the hardest time out of all the cities listed in this poll; it's arguably the city that had the most potential but dropped the ball and has refused to pick it back up and run with it for YEARS now.
True.
Not sure why Memphis would be compared to the rustbelt. Other than being an older legacy city, there really is no reason Memphis shouldn’t have been able to capitalize on its sunbelt location. There is also the fact that it’s in a trendy state at the moment.
I agree it probably had the most potential, or at least as much, of any southern city.
But we are not TALKING about the other cities you listed. We are talking about MEMPHIS. This thread is about MEMPHIS, which has been shot past by other cities all around the SOUTH (not the Mid-West, which is a different animal, and is where all the cities you named are located); and it's a long list of cities, like Atlanta, Nashville, Charlotte, Dallas, Houston, Austin, and even shown up in growth in a lot of areas by cities like Chattanooga, Huntsville, and Birmingham, when for years, Memphis was either AHEAD of these cities or neck-and-neck with them. THAT is the issue at hand. And yes, it is indeed sad, and it is exactly why people give Memphis the hardest time out of all the cities listed in this poll; it's arguably the city that had the most potential but dropped the ball and has refused to pick it back up and run with it for YEARS now.
I get that.
My point was that the "more sad" thing about Memphis is the high crime, lack of high paying jobs, and poverty in the region.
These are all reasons that led to Memphis having stagnant/slightly declining city and metro populations, unfortunately.
I do see good new development and redevelopment happening in Memphis, in terms of buildings. South of downtown is a phenomenal urban neighborhood that is only getting better. Same goes for midtown Memphis--a lot of really great bones and beautiful streets and houses with amenities.
Unfortunately, Memphis has seen a lot of neighborhoods in-between the super bright spots, slip and fall into high crime and disrepair.
I think these neighborhoods need to start getting better, and then Memphis will patch itself back together slowly but surely.
Memphis is one of my favorite US cities--so much character, soul, culture and originality. I love to root for it and watch it improve.
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