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This.
I'd definitely put Milwaukee on any Top 5 Most Underrated and Misunderstood list.
It's not Detroit. It's not St. Louis. It never fell hard like those. It still has a decent amount of manufacturing, which is a good thing in my opinion, but I'd hesitate to even call it rustbelt anymore with its diverse economy.
Phoenix would basically win the "best place to live a spread-out car-centered suburban lifestyle" between the two, maybe, but not much in the way of visiting, especially if we're strictly talking stuff in the cities themselves.
I say this as someone who generally likes Phoenix.
I don't disagree that Milwaukee is probably under-rated, I've personally never been there and just know stories from those who have relocated to the Phoenix area from there. But I can't help chuckle about the comment that Phoenix doesn't have much in the way of visiting. The numbers paint a much different picture.
Greater Phoenix Region:
- Estimated direct spending by visitors in the region exceeded $16.7 billion in 2019
- 69,000 guest rooms at over 500 hotels, and 40 full-service properties
- 46.2 million people traveled through Sky Harbor in 2019
Greater Milwaukee Region:
- In 2019 tourism brought in over $5.9 billion
- 19,289 hotel rooms at 157 properties
- 3.5 million people traveled through Mitchell Airport in 2019
I think Phoenix is very underwhelming attraction-wise for a city of 4.5 million people, however, its still hard for Milwaukee to actually have more appeal on the basis of size alone. There's a lot more options for shopping, hiking, and restaurants in Phoenix compared to Milwaukee even if everything else is underwhelming. I'd give a slight edge to Phoenix.
I've been to the Botanical Gardens, Downtown, Downtown Tempe, The Heard Museum, The Pueblo Grande Site, the mountain reserve, and Taliesin West. All of these were pretty cool but I'm not sure any of these were super exceptional(some of the archaeological sites were very interesting however) especially for a city of its size.
So maybe its an exaggeration to say that there is very little going on there but it definitely felt like one massive suburb with a couple of interesting areas and attractions here and there. I gave it the edge in terms of how much there was and shopping opportunities, but Phoenix in-of-itself is probably one of the least interesting and bland cities in the country.
I've been to the Botanical Gardens, Downtown, Downtown Tempe, The Heard Museum, The Pueblo Grande Site, the mountain reserve, and Taliesin West. All of these were pretty cool but I'm not sure any of these were super exceptional(some of the archaeological sites were very interesting however) especially for a city of its size.
So maybe its an exaggeration to say that there is very little going on there but it definitely felt like one massive suburb with a couple of interesting areas and attractions here and there. I gave it the edge in terms of how much there was and shopping opportunities, but Phoenix in-of-itself is probably one of the least interesting and bland cities in the country.
The 'botanical gardens' you describe in the category of not exceptional is the Desert Botanical Garden, the largest collection of cactus plants in the world. The MIM, which you seem to have missed, contains the largest collection of musical instruments in the world and is a top 20 museum in the US. The Arizona Commemorative Air Force is the home of one of the largest Commemorative Air Force units in the world. The Phoenix Zoo opened is the largest privately owned, non-profit zoo in the United States.
And then there's Roosevelt Row, in downtown Phoenix which hosts one of the nation’s largest art walks every First Friday. Roosevelt has recently been highlighted by USA Today as “The Top 10 Arts Districts in the US.†Experience the amazing art the Roosevelt Row Arts District has to offer! (Read other USA Today coverage here.)
As for major events, there's just a plethora of them. From the world's greatest collector car auction, Barrett Jackson, to the greatest show on turf (Phoenix Open) on through spring training.
Last edited by locolife; 07-06-2021 at 01:29 PM..
Reason: Back handed boosting
Phoenix has quite a few gems sprinkled around its metro, the problem is the land area is so huge, you will spend a lot of the time in the car just getting from place to place. For instance, I find Taliesin West and the MIM to be two of the coolest attractions in the city. If you are staying in downtown Phoenix, either of these attractions will require a 45-60 mile round-trip drive. Milwaukee has the advantage of compactness and relative walkability.
Overall, I would choose Phoenix just because the Sonoran desert environment is so unique and interesting and there are a lot of things to explore. That said, if we're talking short weekend getaways, Milwaukee is probably a better option because you can get more out of your short stay.
For me, visiting a city is less about seeing specific attractions and more about just walking around the neighborhoods without a pre-defined plan, seeing what I find, absorbing what the urban fabric is like and how locals live. Phoenix only really has a few neighborhoods in city limits where you can do that. Sure there's Scottsdale, but Milwaukee has suburban downtowns too.
I will say the numerous cacti species in southern Arizona are really cool, coming from northern Nevada which doesn't have them. That alone made my trip interesting and worthwhile, even leaving out my side trips to Tucson and the smaller towns southeast of there (Tombstone, Bisbee).
[quote=nadnerb;61396189]Phoenix has quite a few gems sprinkled around its metro, the problem is the land area is so huge, you will spend a lot of the time in the car just getting from place to place. For instance, I find Taliesin West and the MIM to be two of the coolest attractions in the city. If you are staying in downtown Phoenix, either of these attractions will require a 45-60 mile round-trip drive. Milwaukee has the advantage of compactness and relative walkability.
Yes, Phoenix is not compact but it is logistically well designed. To make that 40 mile round trip journey to MIM you'll spend about 20 minutes traveling each direction by car, at almost any time of day. I know first hand I can easily spend more than 20 minutes traversing a "compact, walkable" city to get from one side to the other. So it's not all bad...
Case in point since I'm familiar with it, traveling from downtown Boston at Government Center to the Museum of Fine Art, currently at 7pm on a Tuesday it will take you 14 minutes by car to travel those 3.2 miles. And that's without counting time to deal with parking on each end of your journey. The train will take 23 minutes. And biking will take 22 minutes. Density doesn't always make things faster or more convenient.
Phoenix wins based on sheers size alone. Not only does it have more to do within the metro, but it also has far more outdoor recreational activities to do surrounding it.
Phoenix has quite a few gems sprinkled around its metro, the problem is the land area is so huge, you will spend a lot of the time in the car just getting from place to place. For instance, I find Taliesin West and the MIM to be two of the coolest attractions in the city. If you are staying in downtown Phoenix, either of these attractions will require a 45-60 mile round-trip drive. Milwaukee has the advantage of compactness and relative walkability.
Yes, Phoenix is not compact but it is logistically well designed. To make that 40 mile round trip journey to MIM you'll spend about 20 minutes traveling each direction by car, at almost any time of day. I know first hand I can easily spend more than 20 minutes traversing a "compact, walkable" city to get from one side to the other. So it's not all bad...
Case in point since I'm familiar with it, traveling from downtown Boston at Government Center to the Museum of Fine Art, currently at 7pm on a Tuesday it will take you 14 minutes by car to travel those 3.2 miles. And that's without counting time to deal with parking on each end of your journey. The train will take 23 minutes. And biking will take 22 minutes. Density doesn't always make things faster or more convenient.
No but you can visit things in between along your walk and maybe actually enjoy it, versus driving in traffic.
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