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Two of my favorite cities in the country. There are somewhat comparable in that they are big, real urban cities that are a little overshadowed by NYC, LA, maybe even SF or DC in national prominence.
For Chicago- Bigger. While it isn't a huge city like NYC or London, it does feel like you are in a BIG city in a what that no other US city really does. Tons to do. Better shopping, nightlife, restaurants, museums, theater, etc. More developed neighborhoods- Chicago has tons of commercial corridors throughout the city. Places like Wicker Park, Lakeview/Lincoln Park have foot traffic and vibrancy to rival many city downtowns. You really can find everything you need right in your own neighborhood. Higher national prominence- The skyscrapers, the pizza, Navy Pier, Mich Ave, the the Riverwalk, the Bean, the L, Wrigley Field, etc. Bigger corporate presence- tons of fortune 500 companies, investment firms, tech companies, advertising/professional services firms have have offices in Chicago. Philly has a fine economy. But, it seems a little more Comcast,Eds/Meds, and stuff in the suburbs. Cleaner, polished- Chicago has had a ton of investment in its downtown for many many years now. The Lakefront- that's a really unique aspect of the city. Riverfronts are nice, but they aren't as spectacular. Coastal cities are generally not right on the coast.
For Philly- Weather- Philly's winters, springs, and falls are warmer and the summers aren't that much worse. Location- Ocean to the east, Mountains to the west, NYC to the north and DC to the south. Topography and vegetation- Chicago's Lakefront tops Philly's riverfront. But, Philly has hills and stream valleys right in the city that create opportunities for hiking. The forested, hilly Piedmont region that starts right in Philly is more scenic than Chicago's flat, prairie land setting. Character/local culture- this is subjective and controversial. But, I find Philly to be more unique culturally. Chicago's white population has a very middle America feel, with lots of big 10 grads from the midwest suburbs. Philly has a very old money east coast WASP, ethnic Italian/Jewish east coast feel. More hipster/artists in the core. Chicago is a bigger immigrant hub, but Philly's smaller size seems to make it feel a little more like a melting pot. Chinatown is right downtown, the Italian market could be the Latino market. Lots of old school restaurants, mom and pop bodega type places. More historic, urban built environment- Chicago has world renowned architecture. But, Philly has a very human scaled environment with narrow streets filled with colonial rowhouses, browstones and ornate highrises. It's like a cross between lower Manhattan, Brooklyn and London. Chicago's neighborhoods have a leafier, lower lot occupancy feel, which maybe more attractive to live. But, Philly has very hip tight brick urban feel that's only found few cities.
I have lived in both, and prefer Chicago. However, I have a lot of love for Philly. There is a certain “Northeast” feel to Philly that is hard to describe, but I really like.
The biggest difference to me socially is that I have found Chicago’s downtown core (River North, West Loop, Gold Coast) offers a cosmopolitan “big city” nightlife experience (restaurants, upper scale bars, etc) that I like more than Center City/Rittenhouse square.
The neighborhoods have a similar local feel in both cities. Again, with Chicago being bigger, there are more to explore.
Also, I love the lake front and Lincoln Park in Chicago.
Overall I prefer Chicago but Philly is really cool. I wish I lived there a little longer so I could have explored the city a little more.
Two of my favorite cities in the country. There are somewhat comparable in that they are big, real urban cities that are a little overshadowed by NYC, LA, maybe even SF or DC in national prominence.
For Chicago- Bigger. While it isn't a huge city like NYC or London, it does feel like you are in a BIG city in a what that no other US city really does. Tons to do. Better shopping, nightlife, restaurants, museums, theater, etc. More developed neighborhoods- Chicago has tons of commercial corridors throughout the city. Places like Wicker Park, Lakeview/Lincoln Park have foot traffic and vibrancy to rival many city downtowns. You really can find everything you need right in your own neighborhood.
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I don't know about that. In my experience Chicago neighborhoods tend to be pretty sleepy (unless there are some special events going on). Wicker Park maybe... sometimes. That's about it. I would love to see a YouTube video of a random day in a Chicago neighborhood outside of downtown showing the kind of vibrancy/pedestrian traffic you are suggesting.
Last edited by Fitzrovian; 06-15-2022 at 09:17 PM..
I have lived in both, and prefer Chicago. However, I have a lot of love for Philly. There is a certain “Northeast” feel to Philly that is hard to describe, but I really like.
The biggest difference to me socially is that I have found Chicago’s downtown core (River North, West Loop, Gold Coast) offers a cosmopolitan “big city” nightlife experience (restaurants, upper scale bars, etc) that I like more than Center City/Rittenhouse square.
The neighborhoods have a similar local feel in both cities. Again, with Chicago being bigger, there are more to explore.
Also, I love the lake front and Lincoln Park in Chicago.
Overall I prefer Chicago but Philly is really cool. I wish I lived there a little longer so I could have explored the city a little more.
2 really cool cities.
It’s almost bizarre how much more of a “big city” Chicago is than Philly. Like Chicago feels like a genuinely grand global city.
Philly has been so big for so long though. I guess the amenities don’t present the same way? Like Fairmont Park isn’t quite front and center like Grant/millennium park. The subway is obviously hidden in the way the EL isn’t. And Philly has fewer skyscrapers.
Being the center of the Midwest probably helps a lot though.
I'm biased, I love and adore Chicago but the 2 are different loves. Philly much more northeastern culture, closer to better scenery in mountains and beaches, proximity to NY, Delmarva and other neat stuff. Chicago is close to Gary, Indiana. Midwestern cultured, flat gridlike, Lake Michigan is very nice when the winter jet stream dip isn't dropping temps to -15. National importance certainly subjective depending what you consider important but Chicago the more regional hub major city. Philly greater in terms of traditional history certainly. Which gives Philly a unique feel in that it's still very large but homey outside major tourist areas.
O' Hare/Midway is a boon price wise if you fly a lot. Not that NY airports are far away from here, so that's a wash. Crime? Chicago is worse off but a lot of it is localized in certain neighborhoods. In terms of affordability, both are similar. Deals to be had. Overall, 2 wonderful historic and cultured people and places
Every big metro area has its gheto neighborhoods and suburbs so to point out Gary Indiana is not such a big deal. Philly has bad areas and suburbs such as Chester. Otherwise, I mostly agree with what is stated.
I don't know about that. In my experience Chicago neighborhoods tend to be pretty sleepy (unless there are some special events going on). Wicker Park maybe... sometimes. That's about it. I would love to see a YouTube video of a random day in a Chicago neighborhood outside of downtown showing the kind of vibrancy/pedestrian traffic you are suggesting.
Gold Coast, Old Town, West Loop, Lakeview, Wicker Park, Lincoln Park, Bucktown, Logan Square…. Sleepy!?!?
Gold Coast, Old Town, West Loop, Lakeview, Wicker Park, Lincoln Park, Bucktown, Logan Square…. Sleepy!?!?
Only on CD, folks.
I said "outside of downtown". Gold Coast (Viagra Triangle, Rush St, etc) I would still consider downtown. Old Town -- by which I assume you mean the stretch of Wells north of Division -- is also kinda downtown or at least an extension of it, being adjacent to Division (which is often considered the northern border of Downtown Chicago).
As far as the other neighborhoods you listed (with the exception of Wicker Park, as previously noted), I'd say yes I would consider them pretty sleepy in terms of foot traffic. I have visited these neighborhoods in peak summer season and found mostly empty streets. Packed bars and restaurants aplenty - yes, but minimal foot traffic outside. I've certainly never seen anything "to rival other cities' downtowns" in any of those neighborhoods.
I'd be delighted to be proven wrong though. Maybe every time I've visited I caught them on off days? There are plenty of walking/exploring type of videos on YouTube nowadays. Please post one showing hopping foot traffic in any of these neighborhoods and I would happily eat my words.
Last edited by Fitzrovian; 06-16-2022 at 04:14 AM..
Two of my favorite cities in the country. There are somewhat comparable in that they are big, real urban cities that are a little overshadowed by NYC, LA, maybe even SF or DC in national prominence.
For Chicago- Bigger. While it isn't a huge city like NYC or London, it does feel like you are in a BIG city in a what that no other US city really does. Tons to do. Better shopping, nightlife, restaurants, museums, theater, etc. More developed neighborhoods- Chicago has tons of commercial corridors throughout the city. Places like Wicker Park, Lakeview/Lincoln Park have foot traffic and vibrancy to rival many city downtowns. You really can find everything you need right in your own neighborhood. Higher national prominence- The skyscrapers, the pizza, Navy Pier, Mich Ave, the the Riverwalk, the Bean, the L, Wrigley Field, etc. Bigger corporate presence- tons of fortune 500 companies, investment firms, tech companies, advertising/professional services firms have have offices in Chicago. Philly has a fine economy. But, it seems a little more Comcast,Eds/Meds, and stuff in the suburbs. Cleaner, polished- Chicago has had a ton of investment in its downtown for many many years now. The Lakefront- that's a really unique aspect of the city. Riverfronts are nice, but they aren't as spectacular. Coastal cities are generally not right on the coast.
For Philly- Weather- Philly's winters, springs, and falls are warmer and the summers aren't that much worse. Location- Ocean to the east, Mountains to the west, NYC to the north and DC to the south. Topography and vegetation- Chicago's Lakefront tops Philly's riverfront. But, Philly has hills and stream valleys right in the city that create opportunities for hiking. The forested, hilly Piedmont region that starts right in Philly is more scenic than Chicago's flat, prairie land setting. Character/local culture- this is subjective and controversial. But, I find Philly to be more unique culturally. Chicago's white population has a very middle America feel, with lots of big 10 grads from the midwest suburbs. Philly has a very old money east coast WASP, ethnic Italian/Jewish east coast feel. More hipster/artists in the core. Chicago is a bigger immigrant hub, but Philly's smaller size seems to make it feel a little more like a melting pot. Chinatown is right downtown, the Italian market could be the Latino market. Lots of old school restaurants, mom and pop bodega type places. More historic, urban built environment- Chicago has world renowned architecture. But, Philly has a very human scaled environment with narrow streets filled with colonial rowhouses, browstones and ornate highrises. It's like a cross between lower Manhattan, Brooklyn and London. Chicago's neighborhoods have a leafier, lower lot occupancy feel, which maybe more attractive to live. But, Philly has very hip tight brick urban feel that's only found few cities.
Fair and accurate assessment.
My only gripe is that I don't know that I'd agree Chicago has better nightlife or restaurant scene. Philadelphia packs a huge punch in both departments. There are so many rankings out there for restaurant scenes that it is hard/impossible to compare on any sort of "objective" measure. Both cities are fantastic and probably have more high quality and distinct restaurant experiences than any average person would fully explore in even a decade. I will say our BYOB scene adds an extra flair of fun for affordable nights out.
Another point in Chicago's favor that just came to mind is transit. Again, it is actually closer than some may think, but the subway system in Chicago is much more comprehensive and well connected to most neighborhoods. In Philadelphia, you've gotta live along one of the two major routes, MSL (east-west until the River Wards) or BSL (north-south) for practical subway access. If you do not, you are reliant on commuter rail (great when it actually shows up! but typically have ridiculously infrequent stop schedules), trolley (which are decent once they get underground), or bus. Chicago has subway lines all throughout the city and much better accessibility. On the flip side, our regional rail system really outdoes Chicago's. Car-free living is actually feasible in some of our inner-ring, urban-lite towns.
I said "outside of downtown". Gold Coast (Viagra Triangle, Rush St, etc) I would still consider downtown. Old Town -- by which I assume you mean the stretch of Wells north of Division -- is also kinda downtown or at least an extension of it, being adjacent to Division (which is often considered the northern border of Downtown Chicago).
As far as the other neighborhoods you listed (with the exception of Wicker Park, as previously noted), I'd say yes I would consider them pretty sleepy in terms of foot traffic. I have visited these neighborhoods in peak summer season and found mostly empty streets. Packed bars and restaurants aplenty - yes, but minimal foot traffic outside. I've certainly never seen anything "to rival other cities' downtowns" in any of those neighborhoods.
I'd be delighted to be proven wrong though. Maybe every time I've visited I caught them on off days? There are plenty of walking/exploring type of videos on YouTube nowadays. Please post one showing hopping foot traffic in any of these neighborhoods and I would happily eat my words.
Outside of downtown- Lakeview, Lincoln Park, Wicker Park (you mentioned), Ravenswood, Logan Square, Bucktown, Andersonville and others.
Can you show some YouTube videos of neighborhoods outside of downtown in NYC or other cities to demonstrate what you mean in terms of bustling foot traffic to provide a reference point?
In pre-pandemic days, you would find lots of foot traffic on spring/summer weekends and in the mornings during the work weeks.
I would like for you to post YouTube videos of NYC and other city neighborhoods outside of downtown, so I can see what you are looking for.
My only gripe is that I don't know that I'd agree Chicago has better nightlife or restaurant scene. Philadelphia packs a huge punch in both departments. There are so many rankings out there for restaurant scenes that it is hard/impossible to compare on any sort of "objective" measure. Both cities are fantastic and probably have more high quality and distinct restaurant experiences than any average person would fully explore in even a decade. I will say our BYOB scene adds an extra flair of fun for affordable nights out.
Another point in Chicago's favor that just came to mind is transit. Again, it is actually closer than some may think, but the subway system in Chicago is much more comprehensive and well connected to most neighborhoods. In Philadelphia, you've gotta live along one of the two major routes, MSL (east-west until the River Wards) or BSL (north-south) for practical subway access. If you do not, you are reliant on commuter rail (great when it actually shows up! but typically have ridiculously infrequent stop schedules), trolley (which are decent once they get underground), or bus. Chicago has subway lines all throughout the city and much better accessibility. On the flip side, our regional rail system really outdoes Chicago's. Car-free living is actually feasible in some of our inner-ring, urban-lite towns.
However: I'm gonna ding both you and jpdivola for just glossing right over the Black parts of both.
Bronzeville. 52d Street. Cottage Grove Avenue. "TSOP" (Gamble & Huff hit factory). Coltrane. Ebony. Broad/Erie/Germantown ("Creed"). Barack Obama. Yadda yadda. Those figure in at all?
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