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While it is possible to compare the number/percent of people willing to identify themselves as LGBTQ in surveys, along with comparing # of LGBTQ bars, bathhouses, community centers, etc., I just find this so difficult to measure. Obviously, Chicago and Oklahoma City are going to be on different levels. But for our major cities with progressive/"liberal" politics, it is very subjective and honestly very much a matter of circumstance for which one feels best to whom.
I personally have found gay bars I very much enjoy and very much do not enjoy in NYC, Philadelphia, Chicago, San Fransisco, Denver, Seattle, Baltimore, and even in smaller metros like Albuquerque and Buffalo, NY.
I've checked out the LGBT scene in D.C., and from what I've experienced thus far, it wasn't for me. I have a good friend who took me out to a few bars, and honestly he gets annoyed with the scene there. He described to me the VIDA gays, who are the prototype of self-centered type A gays. Not my vibe. Lol.
Last edited by Muinteoir; 08-01-2022 at 06:49 AM..
Reason: awkward wording
While it is possible to compare the number/percent of people willing to identify themselves as LGBTQ in surveys, along with comparing # of LGBTQ bars, bathhouses, community centers, etc., I just find this so difficult to measure. Obviously, Chicago and Oklahoma City are going to be on different levels. But for our major cities with progressive/"liberal" politics, it is very subjective and honestly very much a matter of circumstance for which one feels best to whom.
I personally have really found gay bars I very much enjoy and very much do not enjoy in NYC, Philadelphia, Chicago, San Fransisco, Denver, Seattle and Baltimore, and even in smaller metros like Albuquerque and Buffalo, NY.
I've checked out the LGBT scene in D.C., and from what I've experienced thus far, it wasn't for me. I have a good friend who took me out to a few bars, and honestly he gets annoyed with the scene there. He described to me the VIDA gays, who are the prototype of self-centered type A gays. Not my vibe. Lol.
How many times were you asked "So what do you do?" upon starting a conversation with a guy in a DC gay bar? Or how many times out of every 10?
(Not familiar with the meaning of the acronym VIDA. Care to enlighten me?)
While it is possible to compare the number/percent of people willing to identify themselves as LGBTQ in surveys, along with comparing # of LGBTQ bars, bathhouses, community centers, etc., I just find this so difficult to measure. Obviously, Chicago and Oklahoma City are going to be on different levels. But for our major cities with progressive/"liberal" politics, it is very subjective and honestly very much a matter of circumstance for which one feels best to whom.
I personally have found gay bars I very much enjoy and very much do not enjoy in NYC, Philadelphia, Chicago, San Fransisco, Denver, Seattle, Baltimore, and even in smaller metros like Albuquerque and Buffalo, NY.
I've checked out the LGBT scene in D.C., and from what I've experienced thus far, it wasn't for me. I have a good friend who took me out to a few bars, and honestly he gets annoyed with the scene there. He described to me the VIDA gays, who are the prototype of self-centered type A gays. Not my vibe. Lol.
I agree with this very much. I tend not to wade into these types of discussions often, but I also don’t have a taste for the hyper competitive, almost vapid nature that comes with the bars in major markets. To be fair I’ve met awesome friends in every city I’ve been in. My experience has always been that the organized social/bar scene of those places fosters an environment that discourages guys to be authentic, and was ripe with overcompensation. I felt that way even when I was living in Phoenix during college.
I understand why folks can be attracted to the sexy scenes and seemingly limitless options for these big markets. I know I’m not the only guy who prefers the smaller, yet well organized gay communities in small cities like the one I live in. For me it’s about the people i surround myself with more so than the built environment. I’d much rather get drunk over cards or a fire with friends, than stumble my way back to my place after an evening surrounded by a bunch people with their guard up. You can take your big sexy gay scenes in New York, San Fran, and DC. I’ll stick with the lower stress environments
(I’m also in my early 40s now so this could just be my old man-ness talking.)
I agree with this very much. I tend not to wade into these types of discussions often, but I also don’t have a taste for the hyper competitive, almost vapid nature that comes with the bars in major markets. To be fair I’ve met awesome friends in every city I’ve been in. My experience has always been that the organized social/bar scene of those places fosters an environment that discourages guys to be authentic, and was ripe with overcompensation. I felt that way even when I was living in Phoenix during college.
I understand why folks can be attracted to the sexy scenes and seemingly limitless options for these big markets. I know I’m not the only guy who prefers the smaller, yet well organized gay communities in small cities like the one I live in. For me it’s about the people i surround myself with more so than the built environment. I’d much rather get drunk over cards or a fire with friends, than stumble my way back to my place after an evening surrounded by a bunch people with their guard up. You can take your big sexy gay scenes in New York, San Fran, and DC. I’ll stick with the lower stress environments
(I’m also in my early 40s now so this could just be my old man-ness talking.)
That's all very fair. I think you can find the down-to-earth, full-of-personality type bars/people in most major cities, and you can find the spaces that feel competitive, hyper-manicured, and yes, vapid. The thing that was great coming to Philadelphia from Albuquerque was the dating options. I found my now partner of three years here. In Albuquerque, I felt I exhausted the dating pool in a month.
But yeah I feel you on your taste in scene. My early-mid twenties self thought that by 31 (my current age), I'd have all but sworn off drinking and adhered to a 10 PM curfew every weekend. Well, I was too quick to age myself. But, my taste in nightlife has definitely changed. I do like that Philadelphia has places us senior gays ---yes, thirty+ is senior in the gay community--- are included. Sounds like Louisville does too.
That's all very fair. I think you can find the down-to-earth, full-of-personality type bars/people in most major cities, and you can find the spaces that feel competitive, hyper-manicured, and yes, vapid. The thing that was great coming to Philadelphia from Albuquerque was the dating options. I found my now partner of three years here. In Albuquerque, I felt I exhausted the dating pool in a month.
But yeah I feel you on your taste in scene. My early-mid twenties self thought that by 31 (my current age), I'd have all but sworn off drinking and adhered to a 10 PM curfew every weekend. Well, I was too quick to age myself. But, my taste in nightlife has definitely changed. I do like that Philadelphia has places us senior gays ---yes, thirty+ is senior in the gay community--- are included. Sounds like Louisville does too.
Good post - I should have been more articulate in mine. You are absolutely right you can find good, down to earth people everywhere. Some of the best, most unassuming people I've ever met are my gay friends who live in places like San Francisco and New York.
I'm certainly not trying to judge those scenes or anyone who enjoys them, so much as to say I don't feel as comfortable in them myself. Even the smaller cities possess elements of the less flattering side of gay life. They just feel less competitive overall. I workout regularly, I eat right, I have a pretty good career, I'm decently educated(sans my propensity toward run-on sentences), I have traveled the world and I look pretty young for my age bracket. In Louisville I'm a 7-8. In Chicago I'm a solid 4. I probably wouldn't make the scale in New York lol.
I could live anywhere and find great people, make great friends and be happy. I've done it many times. When we are talking about "highly rated LGBT cities" my interpretation is that infers how intertwined is gay culture into it's fabric. I immediately think of drinking/partying/ emphasis on success/ physical appearance etc. The energy it takes to try and fit in those circles is exhausting to me. I suppose if my gay self had grown up in it I probably wouldn't notice it at all. I might even look down on the smaller cities that don't offer as much, as I've so often been on the "Oh you live in...." side of those conversations. I do also think about things like size of dating pool, and general cultural tolerance. I do understand the draw.
Louisville is an interesting city to me. It doesn't really belong in this conversation as it will never be anywhere near the same league as city like Philly or the cities being discussed here. What is surprising is how well executed and deep rooted the community is. It really hits above it's weight. It's bar scene is smaller, there are only 4 bars in the gayborhood, and a only few more scattered around the metro. It's got a few gay sports leagues that are very visible and active year round. It has three different pride festivals, one downtown, one on the Indiana side of the river, and then another in September in the Highlands. All are pretty well funded and receive quite a bit of support from local corporate partners. The pride parade lasted over an hour and was quite intricate, I did not expect that for a smaller metro. It always has gay visitors from Indy or Cincy in town for the weekend. In theory they should be attracting gays from Louisville given their sizes.
The most surprising part for me since moving here is just how tolerant folks are. I have a friend who moved here from Grand Rapids not to long after I did. He's male, but has a very gender fluid form of expression. Paints his nails, has long hair, and adds elements of crossdressing in his style. People in Louisville don't bat an eye at it. In Grand Rapids folks don't really care what you do, but they still get that quiet "Michigan nice" about them when someone different comes around. You can tell when they are not used to seeing something. This area has always been kind of known for attracting unique folks with unique styles, and even in the suburbs they don't really seem to notice or be phased by those who don't pass for cultural norms. It's just kind of ingrained in that bourbon/drinking culture I think. That's not to say I'd encourage him to sneak too much deeper into Kentucky lol.
It’s not a top gay city, but I wouldn’t at all be shocked to see it on a list of surprising gay cities.
I've had better luck in smaller cities. I had a very vibrant social life in Charlotte and St. Louis. I met my ex in a Nashville grocery store of all places. Chicago was way too racially motivated for my taste and I was amazed at how that leaked into the gay scene.
I agree with comments made about Louisville KY. Very open minded population when it comes to their LGBTQ community. Surprisingly fun city.
TI do like that Philadelphia has places us senior gays ---yes, thirty+ is senior in the gay community--- are included. Sounds like Louisville does too.
Just wait until you're old enough to join the Silver Foxes — the 55+ support and discussion group at the William Way Community Center. (I crossed that threshold eight years ago, but have yet to attend a meeting, as my own social circles tend towards the transit-geeky and train-geeky, and that's definitely a niche scene — but one in which one can find plenty of gay men.)
AIDS wiped out a slice of my gay male generation, but the younger Boomers got the safer-sex message (and the drug cocktails when they came along), so as a result, you will find 50+ gay men out in our Gayborhood bars, in particular UBar and around the piano at Tavern on Camac.
UBar I like a lot because it's not a "scene" as much as it is a "third place" — the place "where everybody knows your name / and they're always glad you came." People there meet to socialize as much as, or maybe even more than, to meet Mr. Right or even Mr. Right Now.
I'm sure such bars exist in the top-tier Meccas, too, but I have a sneaking suspicion that they may be more prominent in cities with smaller gay communities than in those with larger ones.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjlo
Good post - I should have been more articulate in mine. You are absolutely right you can find good, down to earth people everywhere. Some of the best, most unassuming people I've ever met are my gay friends who live in places like San Francisco and New York.
I'm certainly not trying to judge those scenes or anyone who enjoys them, so much as to say I don't feel as comfortable in them myself. Even the smaller cities possess elements of the less flattering side of gay life. They just feel less competitive overall. I workout regularly, I eat right, I have a pretty good career, I'm decently educated(sans my propensity toward run-on sentences), I have traveled the world and I look pretty young for my age bracket. In Louisville I'm a 7-8. In Chicago I'm a solid 4. I probably wouldn't make the scale in New York lol.
I could live anywhere and find great people, make great friends and be happy. I've done it many times. When we are talking about "highly rated LGBT cities" my interpretation is that infers how intertwined is gay culture into it's fabric. I immediately think of drinking/partying/ emphasis on success/ physical appearance etc. The energy it takes to try and fit in those circles is exhausting to me. I suppose if my gay self had grown up in it I probably wouldn't notice it at all. I might even look down on the smaller cities that don't offer as much, as I've so often been on the "Oh you live in...." side of those conversations. I do also think about things like size of dating pool, and general cultural tolerance. I do understand the draw.
Louisville is an interesting city to me. It doesn't really belong in this conversation as it will never be anywhere near the same league as city like Philly or the cities being discussed here. What is surprising is how well executed and deep rooted the community is. It really hits above it's weight. It's bar scene is smaller, there are only 4 bars in the gayborhood, and a only few more scattered around the metro. It's got a few gay sports leagues that are very visible and active year round. It has three different pride festivals, one downtown, one on the Indiana side of the river, and then another in September in the Highlands. All are pretty well funded and receive quite a bit of support from local corporate partners. The pride parade lasted over an hour and was quite intricate, I did not expect that for a smaller metro. It always has gay visitors from Indy or Cincy in town for the weekend. In theory they should be attracting gays from Louisville given their sizes.
The most surprising part for me since moving here is just how tolerant folks are. I have a friend who moved here from Grand Rapids not to long after I did. He's male, but has a very gender fluid form of expression. Paints his nails, has long hair, and adds elements of crossdressing in his style. People in Louisville don't bat an eye at it. In Grand Rapids folks don't really care what you do, but they still get that quiet "Michigan nice" about them when someone different comes around. You can tell when they are not used to seeing something. This area has always been kind of known for attracting unique folks with unique styles, and even in the suburbs they don't really seem to notice or be phased by those who don't pass for cultural norms. It's just kind of ingrained in that bourbon/drinking culture I think. That's not to say I'd encourage him to sneak too much deeper into Kentucky lol.
It’s not a top gay city, but I wouldn’t at all be shocked to see it on a list of surprising gay cities.
I would say that Louisville is definitely in the same league with cities like St. Louis, Kansas City or Columbus. And ISTR it was the dismissing of the first of those as not really worthy of consideration that prompted you to jump in. In fact, I would place its nightlife ahead of St Louis' (which tends to be quieter than its cross-state rival). I don't know where Louisville's gayborhood is, but the one time I visited (to spend some time with a journalist friend of mine who grew up in Somerset and moved back for a while to be close to his family), we did head over to Bardstown Road, which has at least one gay dance club on it. I would put Bardstown Road on par with Westport in Kansas City and a little ahead of Columbus' Short North — all very lively places to be on the weekend (too lively, the city fathers in KC decided about Westport when I last visited. KC's gay bars and clubs ring Westport, but none of them lie in its heart).
There was a time when I wouldn't have considered moving Back Home or living in either of the other two cities. Those days are in my rear-view mirror now. Maybe I've changed, maybe they have — I suspect it's a little of both. And to the extent it's the latter, then these cities are definitely worth considering for those who want a less frenetic, more rooted gay scene. (One of the things that makes Philadelphia interesting is that, even though it's bigger and now attracts people from outside it — especially New Yorkers seeking housing they can afford — most of those living here now were born and raised in the region or somewhere nearby. That makes our gay scene as homegrown as those of the other mid-tier cities we're discussing.)
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g500
When I think of LGBTQ I think of the following cities, in order:
1. San Francisco
2. New York
3. Los Angeles
(gap)
4. Chicago
5. Boston
6. Seattle
7. Portland
8. Miami
9. Philadelphia
10. Washington, DC
Runners-up: Denver, Minneapolis, San Diego, Atlanta, Riverside/San Bernardino
Providence surpassed Boston (I've lived in both), there are twice as many gay bars in 3 blocks in Providence than all of Boston at this point. More gay sports leagues. That's just for starters. The bars/clubs here are full of people that come down from Boston as the only places left there are Pi Alley and Club Cafe, really. Maybe Cathedral is hanging on. Boston has lost Ramrod, Machine, Eagle, Fritz, Luxors, Napolean Club, Paradise, and more with nothing replacing them fairly quickly. PVD has at least five: Stable, Eagle, Dark Alley, Alley Cat and Mirabar. Plus bathhouses (2) that Boston doesn't. Pride seems more robust here too.
Last edited by timberline742; 08-02-2022 at 10:22 AM..
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