Opportunity Corridor question (Cleveland, Euclid, Cleveland Heights: cul-de-sac, how much, house)

[1watertiger]

Originally Posted by jbcmh81

I don't get it, either. UC seems to be doing great from everything I've seen, and it's doing so without the OC. This seems to be one of those times when an urban neighborhood gets popular enough that the car loving suburbanites take notice and then realize it doesn't match their lifestyle choices, so they start demanding it adapt to what they want instead of appreciating the urban characteristics that made it popular to begin with. I've seen this same thing in Columbus.

Columbus does not have miles and miles of wasteland/abandonment.
The redline runs thru this area and hopefully spurs the TOD along with the areas of the opportunity corridor.
It's the areas only chance for near future rebuilding

[Kamms]

Originally Posted by jbcmh81

And a road that functions as a way for people in cars to speed through the bad areas as fast as possible is the best way to fix the problem? This seems to basically be a bypass. Can you name a single highway or major roadway ever built in the urban core of any city that actually helped revitalize adjacent urban areas? And TOD doesn't happen where there is no transit. Cars are not within the realm of TOD.

Cleveland had TOD with Tower City, the city's rail hub; been there lately? Another great example of TOD is Cleveland's Casino.

Cleveland needs to work on its population demographics.

[Kamms]

Originally Posted by jbcmh81

There has been virtually zero urban movement in most of the last 60 years until much more recently. TOD is a much more recent concept and it is more than just putting in a transit line and hoping something happens. The Red Line route has more potential for it than the OC though, without question. Your goal doesn't actually have anything to do with improving anything beyond shaving a few minutes off a commute, however.

Cleveland had a great TOD project in 1990. Tower City Center. In 2014 the Casino opened with indoor access to all rail lines. Guess what?

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by Kamms

Cleveland had TOD with Tower City, the city's rail hub; been there lately? Another great example of TOD is Cleveland's Casino.

Cleveland needs to work on its population demographics.

Okay... great... This has nothing to do with what I asked, though.

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by Kamms

Cleveland had a great TOD project in 1990. Tower City Center. In 2014 the Casino opened with indoor access to all rail lines. Guess what?

I have no idea what your point is, honestly. TOD as a concept is recent, but that does not mean that it did not exist before someone realized that fixed transit lines spurred nearby development, especially compared to roads.

[Kamms]

Originally Posted by jbcmh81

I have no idea what your point is, honestly. TOD as a concept is recent, but that does not mean that it did not exist before someone realized that fixed transit lines spurred nearby development, especially compared to roads.

I have no idea what your point is, honestly.

[bjimmy24]

I know it's not a highway, but I think history is vital to understanding why we are where we are. Large capacity big government projects that market themselves as progress often make things worse.

Here's how highways killed a dense, thriving metropolis of nearly 1 million in the 1950s.

New images reveal true impact of freeways on Cleveland's neighborhoods

[Kamms]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

I know it's not a highway, but I think history is vital to understanding why we are where we are. Large capacity big government projects that market themselves as progress often make things worse.

Here's how highways killed a dense, thriving metropolis of nearly 1 million in the 1950s.

New images reveal true impact of freeways on Cleveland's neighborhoods

Of course cutting freeways and highways through cities caused displacement.

The OC is not being built in a densely populated area. Have you seen the E 79th Street Red Line Station and its surroundings?

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by Kamms

Of course cutting freeways and highways through cities caused displacement.

The OC is not being built in a densely populated area. Have you seen the E 79th Street Red Line Station and its surroundings?

I certainly have. For all it's hyped here for being so urban and connected, the east side red line outside of UC and Little Italy is in downright desolate areas.

I'm just very skeptical of government projects that promise to revive anything. Usually the opposite happens.

[Clevelander17]

Originally Posted by Kamms

The OC is not being built in a densely populated area.

Which is exactly why there's no urgency to turnaround/fix whatever exists of that "neighborhood." And why any claims of the necessity of the OC as a purpose to reach this end are bunk.