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People flunk out of for-profits all the time; that's why their student loan default rates are so high. They aren't going to pass you if you don't turn in your work. For-profits have low retention and graduation rates because they are open enrollment and usually don't require placement testing to see if the student needs remediation. Too many of their students are not prepared to do college-level work and probably struggled in high school.
Many corporations won't even talk to those who "graduate" from DeVry.
If I could flunk out of DeVry I'd certainly never admit it. To do so would certify stupidity.
State universities offer much more than DeVry ever could. Especially in the technical fields. And in-state tuition is much cheaper. For those students needing remedial work, local community colleges offer a much better deal.
People flunk out of for-profits all the time; that's why their student loan default rates are so high. They aren't going to pass you if you don't turn in your work. For-profits have low retention and graduation rates because they are open enrollment and usually don't require placement testing to see if the student needs remediation. Too many of their students are not prepared to do college-level work and probably struggled in high school.
We have this ridiculous notion that everyone must attend college. Many might be better off with vocational training. Instead we waste lives along with billions of dollars.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Weichert
Many corporations won't even talk to those who "graduate" from DeVry.
If I could flunk out of DeVry I'd certainly never admit it. To do so would certify stupidity.
State universities offer much more than DeVry ever could. Especially in the technical fields. And in-state tuition is much cheaper. For those students needing remedial work, local community colleges offer a much better deal.
Everything you have said is exactly right. However I'd change your first word to "most"...
Many corporations won't even talk to those who "graduate" from DeVry.
If I could flunk out of DeVry I'd certainly never admit it. To do so would certify stupidity.
State universities offer much more than DeVry ever could. Especially in the technical fields. And in-state tuition is much cheaper. For those students needing remedial work, local community colleges offer a much better deal.
DeVry is not useless.
My mother works as a computer database programmer for prominent insurance companies and she has worked with boatloads of people who have degrees from DeVry, ITT Tech, etc. Often, they have liberal arts degrees from 4 year colleges and went back to get computer certification so they could work in that field. She made good $ and was never unemployed for a day for like 30+ years.
I would argue that a degree from DeVry in a technical field is more useful than a liberal arts degree from a top school in some ways.
Of course, a degree in Computer Science or Electrical Engineering from your state flagship is better, but then students have to complete four years of Calculus, and pretty much be full time, because you have to take classes during the day. Not everybody can do that.
My mother works as a computer database programmer for prominent insurance companies and she has worked with boatloads of people who have degrees from DeVry, ITT Tech, etc. Often, they have liberal arts degrees from 4 year colleges and went back to get computer certification so they could work in that field. She made good $ and was never unemployed for a day for like 30+ years.
I would argue that a degree from DeVry in a technical field is more useful than a liberal arts degree from a top school in some ways.
Of course, a degree in Computer Science or Electrical Engineering from your state flagship is better, but then students have to complete four years of Calculus, and pretty much be full time, because you have to take classes during the day. Not everybody can do that.
Lots of folks in the edu City-Data section aren't in IT. I do believe they know what they're talking about but it only applies in their profession. DeVry isn't going to do someone favors in the financial sector or any other sector that usually hires graduates from more prestigious schools. I suppose one should know their target audience before selecting a school. I'm sure I'm assuming too much. Most folks don't really understand accreditation and the different types. And I consider that basic information.
Speaking of IT hiring practices. Big difference in the hiring practices of companies that have IT departments vs. companies that are completely IT.
Just so my opinion is known I think DeVry puts students at a instance disadvantage in the job market. Even a small State school would be better.
Speaking of IT hiring practices. Big difference in the hiring practices of companies that have IT departments vs. companies that are completely IT.
Just so my opinion is known I think DeVry puts students at a instance disadvantage in the job market. Even a small State school would be better.
Of course, with a Computer related degree from DeVry, you're not going to be a software engineer at Google. But not everybody has those aspirations.
If you just want good money, doing mundane computer programming in an office park 15 minutes from your house, then DeVry offers that option.
As I mentioned before, I think the problem with four year state colleges is they don't offer night-time courses always and they have theoretical majors, such as Computer Science, which take a long time to complete and are arduous. I almost think in a way, some employers prefer a DeVry degree to a Comp Sci degree, because it's more technical, less theoretical.
At one point early in my career when I was unsure of my path, my mom actually suggested I go to DeVry to get a computer degree, and I have a STEM degree from a Top 25 school.
Of course, with a Computer related degree from DeVry, you're not going to be a software engineer at Google. But not everybody has those aspirations.
If you just want good money, doing mundane computer programming in an office park 15 minutes from your house, then DeVry offers that option.
As I mentioned before, I think the problem with four year state colleges is they don't offer night-time courses always and they have theoretical majors, such as Computer Science, which take a long time to complete and are arduous. I almost think in a way, some employers prefer a DeVry degree to a Comp Sci degree, because it's more technical, less theoretical.
At one point early in my career when I was unsure of my path, my mom actually suggested I go to DeVry to get a computer degree, and I have a STEM degree from a Top 25 school.
Why would a corporation hire someone who is only capable of doing the mundane today? Why not hire someone who has gone through a rigorous and arduous program given the availability these days of top students who have completed those kind of programs rather than a graduate of trash schools like DeVry whose academic standards are a joke. Frankly, I wouldn't hire someone who didn't aspire to be the best. Why hire dullards?
If you really do have a STEM degree from a top 25 school then you know very well that one doesn't take four years of calculus for a degree in CS or EE. Those introductory courses plus multivariate calculus, linear algebra and differential equations are completed in the first year or two for these degrees. And generally, many students take more math than that.
Why would a corporation hire someone who is only capable of doing the mundane today? Why not hire someone who has gone through a rigorous and arduous program given the availability these days of top students who have completed those kind of programs rather than a graduate of trash schools like DeVry whose academic standards are a joke. Frankly, I wouldn't hire someone who didn't aspire to be the best. Why hire dullards?
If you really do have a STEM degree from a top 25 school then you know very well that one doesn't take four years of calculus for a degree in CS or EE. Those introductory courses plus multivariate calculus, linear algebra and differential equations are completed in the first year or two for these degrees. And generally, many students take more math than that.
What are you talking about? 90% of jobs are mundane. Dullard has nothing to do with it.
If everybody a company hires wants to get to the top, eventually only a few of them will be. So, what are the others going to do? Leave or be bitter. A company needs chiefs and indians. If I was looking for an indian for my company, then I'll hire an indian. That is how things work in the real world. Also, having motivation and wanting to be at the top doesn't always mean that you're a good performer. I've met lots of people who had no desire to 'climb the ladder' who are really hard workers. Companies would be stupid to pass them up.
By your logic, why hire anybody to be a nurse if that person didn't want to go the route to become a doctor and the absolute best in their field?
I don't think a degree from Devry is useless. The school is regionally accredited. It might hurt you if you get a business degree from Devry, but the IT field is different. On the other hand, I still think it makes more sense to attend a cheaper, non-profit college.
While there may not have been many flexible options 10+ years ago, there are a lot of options now. There have been many online programs offered for years in information technology by non-profit colleges. You don't have to get a degree in computer science. I saw a study that said that the IT sector is the most open to online degrees.
I don't think a degree from Devry is useless. The school is regionally accredited. It might hurt you if you get a business degree from Devry, but the IT field is different. On the other hand, I still think it makes more sense to attend a cheaper, non-profit college.
While there may not have been many flexible options 10+ years ago, there are a lot of options now. There have been many online programs offered for years in information technology by non-profit colleges. You don't have to get a degree in computer science. I saw a study that said that the IT sector is the most open to online degrees.
Correct. How 'bout another story?
At the graduate school where I got my Masters, the salaries are all public. A woman who works there in a relatively pedestrian computing capacity earns slightly more after less than 8 years of service than at least one of the assistant professors there who got their pHd at an Ivy League University. She got her computer technical thingy degree at a DeVry equivalent. They are approximately the same age. Some of the associate professors who have been there a LONG time don't make that much more than her.
Of course, the professor will eventually surpass her. But it won't be by a significant amount for a while. And the computer tech has a MUCH easier and less stressful job.
Fair?
No. That's why I always argue that computer professionals are overpaid.
But it's also why you can get a degree from DeVry and snicker behind the back of someone who majored in History at Brown University, dropping 130K in the process.
Be serious. You are trying to compare a POS trade school like DeVry to Brown University?
I can assure you the snickers are reserved for those deluding themselves into going to DeVry and thinking that they are attending college. DeVry is known for what it is. Ripoff junk.
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