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Today, I support socio-economic AA, not pigment based AA. This is how things have adjusted in the country anyway. Nobody wants you admitting Will Smith or Collin Powells kids and checking a box saying "hey we got enough blacks, diversity wins!" That freezes out the kids that worked hard and came up with a lot less while working 20 hours a week, no private tutors, no missed meals etc. There have been numerous articles about this over the years and I agree with them.
I am a hispanic immigrant and I agree with this too. I also think it should only include African Americans who are descendants of slaves or people who were here during segregation. Not hispanics, not any other immigrant even if they come from Africa. If they are unhappy with that, go back to your countries.
Like other people have said before in this board whites in America benefited from affirmative action during those years while smart blacks like Louis Fatio Pacheco who could read and write 4 languages and his father who was a skilled carpenter could only become "valuable and unusual commodities"
Why can't some of you just let these kids be great? Why holler about afirm. action?
Would it really be such an imposition to properly spell out affirmative?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTQ3000
We all need a reason why our little precious snowflake muffins did not get into an Ivy after spending $8,463,221 in private school education and $750,000 in extracurricular activities and SAT prep classes. "But, but, I was a great Tiger Mom!"
Yet others need to know why they were admitted only to MacDonald's Hamburger University(R) . . . only if there wasn't affirmative action, they would have gotten those spots at the Ivies by leapfrogged other supremely qualified white and Asian candidates. Life is so unfair.
Mick
To both of you, in my post above yours, I indicate that opposition to affirmative action is valid, yet it does not apply in this instance. The minority kids in this story all seem highly qualified.
People do not get upset over qualified minorities getting a job or into higher education. Instead they get upset when standards are lowered to allow non qualified ones in, and/or higher qualified white men get passed over as a result.
There is a big difference and one the liberals try to blur in an effort to demonetize anyone who does not agree with them. They know that a discussion on the ills of quotas/affirmative action is a losing debate for them, so they just wish to suppress debate by attacking the person whom has a different point of view.
The poster who assumed quotas were involved probably didn't read the story, and had a kneejerk reaction to the story emphasizing minority achievements. Ironically enough, that is one of the ills of affirmative action from a minorities perspective.
The ones that genuinely achieve success in education or a profession without any special treatment are assumed to have gotten there not on their own merit.
For example, a black friend of mine was a top student, and is now a successful Federal Prosecutor. We were having a few beers one day and he was going off about how he hated affirmative action. He didn't like the type of unqualified people who benefited from it and thought it discriminatory. However he mostly resented a program that cast suspicion on minorities because it allowed unqualified ones to get in positions they had no business in.
I couldn't disagree, and bought him another round for his enlightenment on the subject.
I am a hispanic immigrant and I agree with this too. I also think it should only include African Americans who are descendants of slaves or people who were here during segregation. Not hispanics, not any other immigrant even if they come from Africa. If they are unhappy with that, go back to your countries.
Like other people have said before in this board whites in America benefited from affirmative action during those years while smart blacks like Louis Fatio Pacheco who could read and write 4 languages and his father who was a skilled carpenter could only become "valuable and unusual commodities"
First of all, how does one determine/prove they are descended from slaves?
Does this also apply to whites who were brought over as slaves and/or indentured servants?
There would be a very high incentive to pretend to be, and few would be willing to challenge it for fear of being labeled racist. [Heck the new champion of the political left, Elisabeth "Pocahontas" Warren was caught having made such minority claims to advance her own interests]
An even more important question is how long do the generations of those who are descendants of slaves continue to get special treatment compared with others?
Lastly, (and maybe you mixed up your thoughts) whites have only suffered by affirmative action, not benefited from it. The program is specifically designed to allow less qualified minorities and women to get jobs and/or admission to higher education, than higher qualified white men.
R U 1 of those peeps
The point is that people like that (the twitter/texting types) are degrading our language/culture all because of laziness. The same with trying to make a point using a reference link to Wiki.
They only undermine themselves, in most cases without even realizing it.
R U 1 of those peeps
The point is that people like that (the twitter/texting types) are degrading our language/culture all because of laziness. The same with trying to make a point using a reference link to Wiki.
They only undermine themselves, in most cases without even realizing it.
I think you're thinking about it too hard. It's one thing to turn in a college essay or a proposal in that language, such that it is, but if you're on a message board or texting someone... who cares?
First of all, how does one determine/prove they are descended from slaves?
Records. If your family arrived before certain dates they were most likely slaves and for sure they were segregated.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vector1
Does this also apply to whites who were brought over as slaves and/or indentured servants?
No, whites were not slaved or segregated for centuries. However it should include Native Americans, I did forget about that group.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vector1
There would be a very high incentive to pretend to be, and few would be willing to challenge it for fear of being labeled racist. [Heck the new champion of the political left, Elisabeth "Pocahontas" Warren was caught having made such minority claims to advance her own interests]
No system is perfect but there's more data now days.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vector1
An even more important question is how long do the generations of those who are descendants of slaves continue to get special treatment compared with others?
Until Black poverty reaches normal levels. Hopefully the time will be shorter than the period blacks were slaved and segregated.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vector1
Lastly, (and maybe you mixed up your thoughts) whites have only suffered by affirmative action, not benefited from it. The program is specifically designed to allow less qualified minorities and women to get jobs and/or admission to higher education, than higher qualified white men.
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I see I wasn't very clear. When black people were property or free but not allowed to attend college because of segregation laws, that was white affirmative action. The laws favored the white men. The smart blacks had no chance to better themselves while the less intelligent whites could take those spots that the smart black people were more qualified for. In the meantime those white families have had time and resources to move up socially, accumulate assets and transfer those assets and knowledge to future generations. Black people haven't had time to catch up.
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