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wingnuts. Nobody thinks Obama is the messiah....as a christian I am really offended by people suggesting Obama supporters think that.
I know its hard for you people to handle having a positive smart person for once after 8 years of Bush, but I promise there was a time when America had good smart presidents with a positive message for America in the past.
Quote:
"We must all hang together, or surely we will all hang"
America is a Democracy not a Theocracy
We have Separation of Church and State for a reason
our founding fathers created America on that VERY Idea...
people tend to forget that.
But hey, don't forget even John McCain said Obama was a Good Christian, Good Family Man
and would make a Good President.
If you actually think there is separation of church and state in the US government you are kidding yourself. Do you think any candidate would have any chance at all if he/she were a self admitted atheist? Would any non Christian have any hope of being elected? I think not.
I am looking for your thoughts, from a Christian perspective (non-Christians are welcome to comment, also) if you feel that Obama somehow ties into the end times. On a daily basis it seems, I have either talked to someone personally or heard evangelicals stating that people should vote for McCain because if they don't this will trigger the end time events. I already know how some Christians who are not as politically motivated and moreso spiritually motivated feel about this and wanted to bring this issue to the Presidential Election forum. Do you, as a Christian, support McCain, or Obama, and what is your reasoning behind this? Do you feel Obama will take us into the end times? Thanks.
I am a crhistian, and I would not want to give obama that much credit to say that he could be the one to trigger the end times events. He is a wicked guy, that could easily destroy the USA as we know it, but I dont believe he will trigger the end time events.
If you actually think there is separation of church and state in the US government you are kidding yourself. Do you think any candidate would have any chance at all if he/she were a self admitted atheist? Would any non Christian have any hope of being elected? I think not.
Pete Stark of California identifies himself as an atheist and there are a small handful who identify themselves as non-theist, but yeah, call yourself an atheist and you are pretty much doomed out of the box.
I am looking for your thoughts, from a Christian perspective (non-Christians are welcome to comment, also) if you feel that Obama somehow ties into the end times. On a daily basis it seems, I have either talked to someone personally or heard evangelicals stating that people should vote for McCain because if they don't this will trigger the end time events. I already know how some Christians who are not as politically motivated and moreso spiritually motivated feel about this and wanted to bring this issue to the Presidential Election forum. Do you, as a Christian, support McCain, or Obama, and what is your reasoning behind this? Do you feel Obama will take us into the end times? Thanks.
I'm no Bible scholar by any stretch of the imagination, But I do believe in Jesus Christ and the Scriptures. I am convinced that the timing for anti-christ's appearance is spot on due to the rebirth of the state of Israel in 1948 and IMHO more specifically due to the reunification of Jerusalem after the six-day war in 1967 to include Mt. Moriah, the Temple Mount, "Jerusalem shall be trodden down with Gentiles until the time of the Gentiles is complete."
The math works out nearly perfectly for this to be the case according to the 42 month/time, times and half a time period using the Roman calender having 365.24 day years (time). 3.5 times 365.24 equals 1278 days/years. Using 1967 as the end of the "time of the Gentiles", 1967 - 1278 = 689 which gets us back to the time of the construction of the Muslim shrine, the Dome of the Rock (a type of "abomination that makes desolate" at the least).
"At this hallowed site, known in Arabic as Haram al Sharif, the 9th Caliph, Abd al-Malik, built the great Dome of the Rock between 687 and 691."
While I'm not sure of the significance, using 1948 as our critical point and the Hebrew calendar having 360 days/yr, the math works out similarly, 1948 - 1260 = 688. I'm inclined to believe the second set of numbers is a second numerical witness, since the testimony of two was considered to be true in Israel. I'm still working on that.
The obvious question then is since this is no longer the "time of the Gentiles", What time is it we find ourselves in?
Believers generally agree, the end time.
Furthermore, since only one generation is believed to be present in the end time, "this generation shall not pass away until all is complete" the end will come in that time frame (generally 40-70/yrs).
I'm personally not that sure about all the scripture that apply to the starting point of the time of the end. I have a lot to learn about the Bible still. Most believers I've talked to use 1948 as the starting point of the time of the end. If that is correct, a child born in 1948 would be 60 yr old this year. If 1967 is used, correctly or not, a child born in 1967 would be 41 yrs old this year.
I have more to say on the subject but have to go to work now. I may start a thread later on the subject. Please feel free to DM me if you have any questions for me about anything I've stated here.
religion is a divider of man. Religion is man made and therefore corruptible...religion is the end of times. The Destroyer of life as we know it.
Well, I think you put it a little strong, especially the "religion is the end of times" bit. Religion is (in my humble opinion) a very mixed bag. . . 3/4 fear, and all of those things that go with fear (divisiveness, war, etc.), and about 1/4 an opportunity, for those with really open minds, to realize that "reality" goes far beyond ourselves, what we know, etc. Religion, at it's best, says that we are all one, deeply and irretrieveable connected, that we "grow" out of the world as we know it (think about this. . . a really fine explaination of the connection of science and religion), rather than being seperate from it.
Religion is, without a doubt, NEEDED by many that can find no other way to exist than through a hope of a better world beyond this one. . . after all, learning to be OK with what IS, seeing the beauty,in fact the ultimate perfection of WHAT IS, is really beyone the capacity of many, if not most. Also, it is very "complicated", and many people just don't want to bother with philisophical thought. . . so much easier to kick back with a beer and the T.V.
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