Reinstate "The Draft" - (Not what you think) (wages, soldier)

[Chance and Change]

Originally Posted by lilyflower3191981

I am in my 20s, and I am a member of generation Y. Unfortunately or fortunately, I am the product of my environment, and we grew up in an environment your generation and the generation beforehand built..

I know this whole thread is not about military draft, but I do wonder, for a girl who has seen what my brother has sacrificed in the Marine Corps, what kind of reaction should I be giving to people who tell her, "Your brother doesn't mean sh*t. He volunteered to serve, We already show gratitude through his paycheck. Now if it comes to WWII veterans, that might be different. Those are the greatest generations, those are the true heroes." Yes, people's attitude has changed my perspective in life. I learned making sacrifices don't mean anything anymore. Everybody is just looking out for themselves, and no one else. It doesn't matter how many young soldiers and Marine died in the wars, they can never be good enough, because the WWII veterans are the only true heroes.

No one seems to mention on the positives or strengths of my generation; they all think we’re ignorant idiots obsessed with celebrities and popularity, with no concept of what’s happened in the past or what happens in the present. All anyone wants is to point out how we’re all apparently bad at math compared to big bad China. How can we possibly compete in the global markets?

A draft won’t change anything about how much we care about politics. A draft to the job corps, mandatory national service won't make anybody more responsible either. I think the real hope for us is that somebody please tell us that we don't have to be just like our parents, our grandparents.

We love new technologies, we like to work on projects, rather than dead end jobs. we want to embrace our own individuality, we don't want to follow certain rules, we want to be different, is it really a bad thing?

What do you think would make young people really care about what happens in this country? well, please start letting us know that we don't have to be like the older generation. Reassuring us that difference is good, difference change things. The good old days are gone, is it really a bad thing?

Thank you for posting, you are very aware and what you address is very important.
First off, I'd dismiss the thought that WWII is the only group who should be lauded with regard. I think any and every group of Americans who provide service are equally of regard to be lauded with high praise.

If I were you, I'd not accept nor engage any who want to tell you that WWII veterans are the only group to be respected. that is a utter disrespect to the people who have served in this nation over the many decades since that time and any time before that time.

What I would tell them, is that is the group who has the current day resources to promote themselves above all others. But remember, promotion is not always truth. We know that from the commercials played on the media.
We don't or won't discount them any more than any others, because all who serve and all who have faced war and the ravages of war are to be given full respect and regard. Past, Present and Future. PERIOD !!!

I'm not for those who grandstand at the expense of others. Please reality, this baby boom generation that created many things, truthfully; It is the same baby boom generation who has pushed and promoted greed and everything that has ripped this system to threads and ran it through spike and crash cycles for decades. We see this very day, the greed of the generation has lead to an imbalance beyond belief. It has led to a hardship on the young people, to the point, industry is gone, communities which were just built in the 1950's and 1960's and 1970's has been in many cases run down, left to fall down, and we have allowed the creative craftsmanship of the Craftsman era to simply deterioate. Go and look at pictures of Detroit's Landscape if you want a true picture of the ravages of the baby boom era. It is almost unthinkable the things this generation of baby boomers destroyed or let decay beyond belief.

I think the best means to give your generation the platform to unify and take a lead, is to have an organization which can being young people together in organizational structure, with good programming, where they can not only engage, but inspire and develop the programs which will lead to the rebuilding of this nation.


When I speak of Civic Corp, this is not about giving service and being shunned by others, its an avenue for young people to bring their ideas, gain skill, build better ideas and push for a better system, and yes, responsibility within the investment of self always leads to concern about the political atomsphere in which one lives. It will by the act and fact of individual improve patrotic awarness to insure the polticians are in office for the betterment of the nation and not themselves.

As you said, your generation enjoy and embrace Projects, This is precisely what the Civic Corp is about, Projects and Project organizations and project coordination, development, implementation and operations of these areas where projects promote our future.

Currently, your generation is the generation which understand how to better use the technology which is in the spectrum today. They understand better how to advance the technical aspects which promote improved development and effeciency in systems. Your generation has a far broader capacity to deal with individuals, and not be driven by secular divisions, be it race or gender.

The learning curve of your generation is higher than any generation ever to come before it. Advancements in many areas has made this so. You don't have to start from scrath, nor do you need to fell any less than, because you can start at a higher level in the performance and productivity chain.

Your generation does not look through old eyes, reminiscing about a pre-industrial system of life. One which we will never return to. It is the vision of the young people. But we need organizations which bring them together, This is a benefit of the Civic Corp. Not unlike a University Campus, because it brings young people together. But everyone does not have accessibility to the live on campus have a community within the campus. Many kids never expereicne anything which affords them the benefits of "organizational unity". The Civic Corp is far from Military things.
In the Civil Corp, there will be classes and training workshops.. I'm not talking about just throwing young people into a group and turning them into working minions. NOPE... They will be trained, it is and can and will function with a great bit of hands on reality, not unlike On the Job Training, but they will become knowledgable and skilled, and their roles will reflect their advancement in their skills and capability. This is why I suggest 4 yrs, as well as I suggest some form of certification valuation which will put them on direct par with people who go to University. This also includes squashing this class and caste craziness we have driven ourselves into.
currently, we have become a mad society, that has lost respect for vocational and technical skill sets. But reality tells us true, this system of University where many think they will become administrators, is a dying breed and cycle of process.
it is as you said, a generation that will become _ Project Based in how they do thing, what things they engage themselves in doing, and the roles they perform within the projects development, flow and ultimate performance.

Again, I would greatly emphasis this. Let no one impress upon you any madness of dis-respecting the service your brother gave, nor let them place any measurements upon his servce and performance against the generation before him. In all service people follow orders, and some act above and beyond the call of duty as the situations calls. No less of those situations arose for the current generations of service vetrans. They fought in a very different type of war under some very different and equally as deadly challenges. Therefore by all manner and means, be proud, feel proud and insure that you convey to your brother the pride which is his to embrace for his service.

If you note, I previously spoke of those who grandstand as if they use it to put others down. I don't regard those types as being of the awarness to respect the full spectrum and challge which is real unto many. Nor do they often hold rememberances of the many who helped them along the way.

You do not have to be like the generations before you, nor are you like them, you are uniquely members of the current world and what is within the generational change that has made the world as we know it today. It is your generations which will shape what is to be the future. what tomorrow brings and it is your generation, which will fix many of the problems we either created or the things we have broken, as well as it is your generations which will bring the new things we have never thought of, as well as things we have not believed to be possible.

My whole premise for the post, of "Civil Corp", is because we have a responsibility to create a system where "ALL" young people can have a means to become part of the organization growth and development of this country.
Not to be left out bevause they could not go to a high priced University, not to be left out because our system wants a downsized military, not to be left out because greed has destroyed the corporate industrial opportunity. But to have and create and organization where they can embrace the prjects, build the system, improve on the existing system, remove the blight and rebuild something new, something different and something better.

I think given these chances, your generation will build with a sense and sensibility about "inclusion", which will emcompass those younger than yourself, and it will build to make a better system which cares for those older and those who become the senior citizens of your generation. I think it is our responsibility to have a Civil Corp which can give all people the same avenues of opportunity which in some cases is far too often structured for the well to do, the wealthy and the economically priviledged.

I don't see the younger generation being concerned about how big of a mansion they can have, but more about how good of a life and how good of an environment they can create where peace and good will can spread and be shared by all.

[Chance and Change]

"We love new technologies, we like to work on projects, rather than dead end jobs. we want to embrace our own individuality, we don't want to follow certain rules, we want to be different, is it really a bad thing?"

To get these things, it takes organizational structure and unity within organization, thus comes forth teams, teambuilding and many things which bring collective growth.

Currently, we have youth with good ideas and good thoughts about new things, but they have not platform, no means to connect, not structure which provides support and no organizations which have a foundational mandate to promote progress throught the younger generation.
Only the mega corporations now have those means, and all kids can't get into them. Nor can the get on the campuses which they can meet and build teams and expand through teamwork.

The point and aim of the Civic Corp is a vehicles and platform for all the things you dream to asire to achieve. This is where you build new things, develop new rules, modify old rules and pursue to change the dynamic of the paradigm, this the shift and paradigm chance which comes forth will be the future young people shape into being.

I've always promoted change, I've never worked at a company or organization where I did not push for cutting edge change and development, better delegation, more improvements in skill enhancement and regard for the individual capability.

[Chance and Change]

Optional programming: Institute an additional 2 yrs to the Basic Education Model. which can still function like a Civil Corp in the structure of available Federal Departments whom have OJT programming included with Classroom instructions. this will give individuals a skill development sector directly connected to the Basic Education Model. Therefore all students get a working skill, and then they can choose to go to higher education, or into the work environment.
But they will have skills capable of being utilized within the Government sectors, as well as some will be usable directly in the private sectors, and some may become independent contractors of a specific skill level. Which may lead some to establish functioning business that can employ others.

Since one person said it cost $5k a year per student, then we are only talking about an addition 10K per student, but they also have a program which included OJT which can be either paid or volunteer structured. So they gain the classroom technical info, but they also gain pratical and usable experience. This can benefit the extendion programming of Vocational and Technical Training, because they can start at a higher level of performance beased training, and some may go on to university to specialize in a field with focus to become masters in a field.

Then we won't have people being called Master of anything, who have not had some hands on real world skills training and In the Field work performance. Then a Masters degree will have enough substance to be considered as such. Rather than a extra year or two of professor dribble with no actual real work experience,yet we label them as a master and given them a degree claiming such.

By some means our system is in need of changes, but change which affords each individual a broad base of preperation for entering the world of independent responsible living.
We still get the benefit of Civic Responsibility and Civic related self investment. While achieving a higher qualified youth population.

[thatguydownsouth]

The problem with this situation is youre going to increase the payroll of the US govt by a factor of 10 as well as have to provide healthcare, education, retirement etc to far more people. Who the hell is going to pay for that?

[Chance and Change]

Originally Posted by thatguydownsouth

The problem with this situation is youre going to increase the payroll of the US govt by a factor of 10 as well as have to provide healthcare, education, retirement etc to far more people. Who the hell is going to pay for that?

In my view, you are worried about the wrong things. It might be interesting to go out and take a look around and figure out what do you really care about. If you come back, and your biggest concern is about the money aspect of the moment, then you will have answered the priority of your concerns.

I however, think different, I think of what is the future, and what the investment is to make it better is less of an issue.
We borrowed TRILLIONS TO FIGHT A MANUFACTURED WAR... and the cost of the neglect in this nation as well as the support for corporate criminal conduct has cost us much, which includes the 40+ Trillion that simply vanished off the face of the earth, except someone knows where much of went and the rest of it is.
maybe you are unaware that the 8 Years of President Bush Administration is still costing us 10's and 100's of billions that become Trillions. and what did we get for it, except a lot of Americans with war medical issues they can't get service to address, an economy is which is still struggling trying to find out how to keep itself from violently wobbling, while a generation of young people become despaired for options and opportunity.

For all that War Efforts, we certainly did not get the Iraqi Oil, but we sure got on the bandwagon of paying OPEC 500% more for Oil.
We got ourselves an obligation to rebuild a great amount of things In Iraq and Afghanistan as well as expense for damages that may be filed against us for the next 10-15 yrs by the citizens we displaced, maimed and/or killed as being collateral damages. Yes, all those are the least talked about expense we are left to bear.
We got banks and insurance companies and investment houses who gained a free ride to loot us even more and then pay themselves a bonus for doing so. We resulted to have a mass of jobless and homeless people and vets returning within not viable jobs to rebuild their lives.
We have Trillions hidden offshore and we don't know how to get it back. All the while, the Swiss and every other place that hide money, get to use it to make life for their people easy.

We got the expense of allowing streets to deteriorate more, and then we even got the extra gain of cities filing bankruptcy, while the number of private BILLIONAIRES grow, they not only have billions, they now have and control 100's of billions. yet, some have a issue with equipping the young with skills and ability to fix the mess this baby boom and their first generational offspring's created. Now those kids of that offspring group are left with nothing.
The least we can give them is vehicles and avenues to change things and fix some of the messes we made; by helping them with their skill development and experience gaining abilities via program structure which aid them to become better than we were..

All the young hear is a bunch of whining and crying baby boomers who screwed up things in the first place and then taught their offspring's how to screw it up even more with their material minded grooming, crying about 'My Tax Dollars".

This is the whining-est generational group ever to grace the American landscape, filled with pre and post Jim Crow ideology, along with 1950's illusion and 1960's run wild and call it freedom, and the 1970's "me'ism" and the hoard everything 1980's delusions of wealth chasing without regard for anything but self consumption. this same group became the 1990's seek a new slave pool and outsource everything, and bust unions and destroy workers rights, because they lusted so much for the 'seek a slave", type training which their elders folklore spread of delusion and illusions of getting something for themselves by the hard labor of others. When they could no longer do it in this country, because Civil Rights Laws made it possible for women and minorities to join Unions, they busted the Unions, When it was no longer a options to work people at less than what others made, it became a drive to outsource anything and everything. Now its about over inflated the stock, decrease the quality of product and offer no service, and outsource anything and turn the American people into clerks who sell imported goods while the same greed driven group wants to make 3000% profit for doing nothing. It's the exact same ideology of Plantation Owner Mentality. that mentality was about Indenturing the poor whites and enslaving or mass depriving the minorities of options and opportunity, which was done in modern times, by outsourcing the industry. It proved to be a guaranteed means to insure economic inequality remained a constant for poor whites, women and minorities.

We now have a young generation who can change that cycle of madness, but many lust for yeaster- years so strongly, they will do anything to defeat any idea which might give the young of this generation a structure and process to gain the skills and capabilities needed to change the paradigm.

It has to be done through vocation and skill training, because University have not changed their business training mentality for 400-500 yrs. That mentality was to train people to seek a slave and indenturing of people. We see it everyday, with the CEO grooming, paying themselves like slave owners and give themselves a bonus for every dollar they take away from the people who actually do the work

When President Obama said, Let's Rebuild From The Bottom Up", many almost gave themselves a heart attack, with the mere thought that women, poor whites and minorities may have someone rooting for a system where they could gain economic equilibrium. Now, it is: How dare anyone propose any idea that may be a vehicle for the women, poor whites and minorities to gain skills and experience which might uplift them in the economic spectrum and they learn how to change the system to support the people of America and the American nation as being one where equality in the economic spectrum might pursue a goal of some type of parity.

So the very thought of a Civic Corp which could provide these options, become a severely sore spot to those who have not interest in the future nor the generation which is under duress at this very day and time.

[Chance and Change]

I would pose the questions. Do you feel we need change in this nation at this very time for American Young People, Children and Seniors ?

If you say, Yes, do you think it will come at no expense?
If you say, NO, do you think we can continue in the manner we are going?

Whether you say Yes or No. What do you think is the best course for us as a nation of American People?

If you say, "get a job", how do you suppose it is to be created and who is going to create it? (if you remember, for 8 Years of the President Bush Administration, the wealthy said over and over, GIVE US ANOTHER TAX BREAK AND WE WILL IMPROVE THINGS", The end result that we got for all those tax breaks, was a collapsed economy, mass looting and the same Wealthy asking for a Bail Out. Once they got it, they froze lending, denied credit by any and every means, and returned to 'business as usual" with even higher pay for themselves, bigger bonuses, and more and more over inflated stock fiction, as if the Casino Games were waving a banner, saying "crap tables and roulette wheel is open again".

We heard a loud cry about student loans, and still students are gouged not only by exaggerated prices imposed from the University, but that is then compounded to rule out the poor by the addition of interest rates and criteria games to insure the working poor and the dire poor find even more challenges to get through those doors.
This was further made to be disenchanting by the previous working poor who had already gained their degree with wide eyed hopes, only to be told, there is no industry to hire you.
Those who did get hired if they were not from the connected group that already has wealth connectivity, were met at the employment door with low wage offers and faux titles that fed the ego, when the pay check would not pay the rent and buy food at the same time. Then they found out, along with that, you have the debt of your educational loan which is a mandated expense.

There again, I come to the point to propose the idea and a conceptual programming of creating a Civil Corp as described in the initial subject and expressions of this blogs premise.

[Chance and Change]

We as a nation are being left behind, by our own greed, avarice and the negativism toward building to support our youth population.
Here, Canada is pushing forward: https://uwaterloo.ca/about/what-we-stand

Sadly, we know what needs to be done, but we continue to do nothing, and fight against any idea that might well help us do something progressive and positive.
We sit idle while American University continue to push the cost up. If the kids get lower interest, the University Raise Tuition. If the University lowers tuition the interest rate spikes up. (These Banking System and its policies have such influence and saturated controls until it creates a climate designed to indenture the students by any and every means it can devise to operate or influence and Universities are working hand in hand with the financial system, to insure the hardship and disparity continues to bring and pose challenge to our youth.)

Industry gives money to University, still they raise their cost, the government gives money to University, still they raise their cost. The sports programs bring in 100's of millions, PER SPORT, still they raise cost. Many today are more interested in their sports program and its income generation, they market themselves by the hype around their sports programs and their cost are structured to go along with the sports programming modeling aims. If any sports player is noted, the booster groups will insure if they don't get drafted in Pro Sports, they will get a high level corporate of business position job, based on their participation in the University Sports programs. We have long lost our way, our value and our respect for the benefit of providing educational skill and technical training to all our youth.

The criminality of the business model of University has become something of a assault machine against the youth whom are within the category of the poor. "The Poor", now is comprised and designed to be comprised of women, poor whites and minorities". These current University business models now, will only select and by criteria programming, only support a "token" % of "The Poor", simply to keep federal investigation at bay, and keep federal monies rolling in.
Decades ago, people used the skill training they gained in Military to become business owners or skilled craftsman one their term was up.
Today, we don't have a draft which allows them to gain these skills and vocations.

We see it, many know it, and most close a blind eye and seek to deny the realism which is ever-present. All the while we have a process of squandering our youth, by leaving too many in a non win spin.
We see them wandering about, instead of thinking how to structure something to help them, our choice is to stand to the side and criticize them, condemn them and pretend they don't exist. We even have the haughtiness to look at them and say" why don't they get a job", or "why don't they go to school"; all the while ignoring the impediments which confront them on a daily basis. We even promote the concept that of "no degree" then "no job". so how and where are they suppose to gain employment.

We get on the credit report kick, which means No student loans, for those who tired to work and found debt was impossible to overcome, now they are not so eligible for the quality of loan they would need to get the skills which could benefit them. We allow many to wander in hunger, despair and destitution, until desperation pushes them to the edge, and they result with a felony. Providing yet another created situations where they are made ineligible. [ this was a system employed post slavery and well into the expanse of segregation, to insure there would be no vehicles to gain economic parity for minorities, as well it provided a ready made system which had lock-out programming, followed by ready made reasoning to generate cause to attach negative labeling to further promote shut out system design mechanism] Now days, the same system is used, but it is used against "The Poor" - who is not comprised of women, poor whites and minorities. all subjected to the similar and like 'shut out' programming. We as a nation have not learned to change, nor have we learned the downtrend this system has brought to bringing down America. the ultimate tool which was created so few could slip through the cracks, was one to "outsource any and all production across every industry".
We currently live with the result. the sadder part is, we know it, then we try and deny it, see see it and pretend it is not so, then we support it and claim we are for individuals pulling themselves up. When the rope is already greased to insure they slide right back down. What good is it to send down a greased rope to a man trapped in a hole. is it only to create the illusionary pretense of helping, only to be able to say, I tried. When the real aim was to insure they did not arise out of the hole.

The plan to keep the poor being poor is working. We are of many who by silence support this, along with the fact we are of many who by voice support this. Then we complain about the state of affairs of the youth.

Again, I say, we have the power to change the dynamics. We have the platform and the structure and the know how, to create a Draft based Civic skill and technological know how training program, which also engages the many civic service needs which we must improve if we are to become a better nation, repair the broken elements in this nation and equip our youth for the future.
If we value the future which will become theirs.

Unless, we want to push them to imagery of the dynamics of some of the new crazed shows type of environment like what is seen in the "walking dead" and many other shows which seem to promote a devastated landscape and live style.
Because we are very good at creating shows with show devastation or greed in excess, all while knowing people will and people do emulate this stuff to create just what the media is presenting.

A Civic Corp could rival and exceed what the aims and programming of the Waterloo University is doing. But, we as Americans seem to have no idea how far we are falling behind in every category, except greed chasing, being Avarice driven, and anguished in our thoughts about anything which might help and benefit others, and the whole of this nation.

It's quite long past the time, that we awaken from this avarice based stupor.

We have so much in this nation in which a Civil Corp can contribute and improve, while they come out with high level skills, excellent vocational background training and a higher regard for the civil pride in a nation their efforts help to rebuild and improve.

This is where the "Can Do" Spirit is to come through and form a better future for out American young. a Civic Corp designed with Programming which propels America to the forefront with solidity and stability for and through the 21st Century. Rebuilding America through our people.

[Chance and Change]

The Civic Corp would be on the Ground and Read to Go in the Arkansas and Oklahoma area.

Tornadoes kill 16 in Arkansas, 1 in Oklahoma

It is hopeful people re-think their position and come to terms to support the value points of what is Civic Corp.

[thatguydownsouth]

I think you have a one man thread now.

[loose cannon]

I am fully in accordance with this idea and think it should be expanded to old slackers like me who fluffed off in our younger years but are now aching to make a difference.