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There are a lot of good points here concerning both Hogg and Ingram but this situation is only the result of the wider problem.
My question, will this extreme polarization ever go away? Or are we stuck like this until something like another Great Depression or World War comes where these silly cultural tiffs cease to matter?
Maybe both sides have gone too far. I don't really think the right is a bunch of gun huggers and religious cultists. Some are; most are not. Most are more toward the middle. Also, I don't think the left is a bunch of extreme socialists trying to "steal" other people's money and worrying about transgender issues.
If you got rid of the stupid fringes, I would hope that most people could agree on some sensible gun laws, maybe stricter in some states and looser in others. People could agree to keep religion separate from politics. People could agree on a national health plan--even the religious right sees the need for health insurance because they join health sharing ministries. Transgender issues were not even on my radar a few years ago. Honestly, I don't care about it and I don't know enough about it to even know what I think.
When we get national health care, we need to make it fair. And there need to be limits as to what it covers. And when we ever get politicians who can navigate the middle ground and gain our support, they need to put a stop to the hate topics. I do not want to be pitted against other Americans, getting so sick of this fighting. Get a moderate candidate. Few wanted Hillary and few wanted Trump either. Just give us someone normal to vote for next time.
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Or is it that those on the fringes just yell the loudest?
There really seems to be no room for moderates or compromise in today's society.
Compromise is viewed as a sign of weakness. If you don't get everything you want for some people you lost or failed.
I have also notice that more and more people hold a binary view of the world. There's no gray there's only black and white, good and bad and what seems to be constant thing on these threads, right and left.
In some ways this is the biggest reason why people can't understand others who don't share their opinions and beliefs. Someone thinks that they know all of the answers to society's ills and if we simply do this the problem will cease to exist.
If that was the case than their solutions would be implemented easily with no unforeseen consequences.
I have to wonder if society will ever return to moderacy or will people continue to egotistically look at those with different beliefs as the enemy?
This is just a byproduct of the Internet and its echo-chambers. Never before have we had this Internet in our homes that makes it possible to find completely like minds and shut out all others. This is very new and we can see the effects of intolerance of others because one can find confirmation in their beliefs so easily without having to interact with others.
You can find anything on the Internet from great places to the very darkest places. The Internet is also the reason for school shootings. Again, it is possible for some kid to bury themselves in the darkest of places with such convenience and they will end up feeling completely hopeless. That is the key to what I am saying, convenience.
Gone are front porch conversations. Gone are night clubs and places to meet others because that would mean you need to sift through a bunch of non-like minds, which gives perspective. It is what it is, but maybe people will get smarter. Personally, I have shut it all down for the most part and just live a more real life than what the Internet can provide.
People in general are easily manipulated by what they follow as their sources of information... CNN, Fox, online blogs, etc. The media especially tend to portray things in the extreme stirring up the human mind to take a position (against a perceived enemy one). It's all a fiction, but most of us don't realize it.
Thats exactly how they manipulate public opinion on a wide variety of issues.
Look at back in the decades past, when interracial and homosexual relationships were still very taboo, the mass media, network tv and hollywood were instrumental in changing public opinion on those things, so now, majority of people just accept these things.
Its a very slow and methodical process, but its extremely effective!
This is just a byproduct of the Internet and its echo-chambers. Never before have we had this Internet in our homes that makes it possible to find completely like minds and shut out all others. This is very new and we can see the effects of intolerance of others because one can find confirmation in their beliefs so easily without having to interact with others.
You can find anything on the Internet from great places to the very darkest places. The Internet is also the reason for school shootings. Again, it is possible for some kid to bury themselves in the darkest of places with such convenience and they will end up feeling completely hopeless. That is the key to what I am saying, convenience.
Gone are front porch conversations. Gone are night clubs and places to meet others because that would mean you need to sift through a bunch of non-like minds, which gives perspective. It is what it is, but maybe people will get smarter. Personally, I have shut it all down for the most part and just live a more real life than what the Internet can provide.
Exactly, it is far too easy to find your stance online and disregard the otherside. I mean look at the threads about David Hogg being a potty mouth yet Trump says it, no problem. Or when specific companies are targeted in boycotts due to whatever reason NFL, NRA, etc. People only defend boycotts when they fit their stance.
1. People have always been extreme, you hear about it more because the internet gives a voice to everyone and it is easy to find some idiot liberal or conservative saying something stupid for other to hold up and say "SEE!"
You have groups and people have a tendency to want to pile into groups for safety and to protect their confirmation bias. Then group think starts to take over and many have a difficult time getting out of that thought pattern. Easier to speak what the group says than it is to figure it out on your own or do some real research on the issue.
2. The internet has allowed people to reinforce confirmation bias by creating rabbit holes of all kinds. You want to read how Muslims, blacks, jews or evangicals will destroy the world? There are sites for that. Jesus is coming tomorrow? sites for that. World is coming to an end soon? Sites for that. This gets compounded by, quite frankly stupid people, who think that some random blog or site they read that confirms their bias is "research". Most of America would likely fail a logic exam and it shows. Most have **** poor reasoning skills as a population. Most have very strong opinions about topics they know absolutely nothing about and couldn't care less to actually educate themselves on oustide of remembering a headline they happen to agree with or the group speak they parrot from whatever news source they prefer. Dunning Kruger.
3. Our political system is flawed. Our primary elections are heavily tilted towards extremes because they are held at different times and the extremes tend to vote. Run offs without party limitations would be a much better way to handle things but most of the country uses a party based primary where only party members vote and those folks tend to align more to the relative extremes. Thus to get through the primary you already have to be fairly polarized in many areas.
4. Americans have a religious fervor over party and this is one of the bigger problems. You could equate many folk's zeal for their R or D almost as much as their choice in Religion. Perhaps even more so since most of them don't actually go to church or pay much more than lips service to their actual religion. It becomes very difficult to break out of such zeal and what you end up with is cycles of people getting excited and showing up for elections and then staying home. You end up with it being less about policy and more about petty single issue items often used as justification for a vote despite those items never actually changing.
Exactly, it is far too easy to find your stance online and disregard the otherside. I mean look at the threads about David Hogg being a potty mouth yet Trump says it, no problem. Or when specific companies are targeted in boycotts due to whatever reason NFL, NRA, etc. People only defend boycotts when they fit their stance.
I don't think specific examples are necessary. I think everyone knows what is going on people. If you are on one side you will see the flaws in the other while ignoring your own sides transgressions.
I remember it was understood that most people didn't look at others and wonder are they Liberal or Conservative. They seen people as people trying to get through life the best they could. And people weren't attached to politicians as they once were.
The fact that the majority of Americans function in anomic swarms is the norm...the old political parties and social institutions are crumbled antiques of importance essentially to the old and elderly, but otherwise virtually meaningless now. To those who came of age in the Eighties or were born after there is no extreme, there is just the daily red-hot surge of mindless righteousness giving your hormones a good goosing. Life in a wasp swarm. Not extreme for wasps in swarms, just the way it is.
1. People have always been extreme, you hear about it more because the internet gives a voice to everyone and it is easy to find some idiot liberal or conservative saying something stupid for other to hold up and say "SEE!"
I don't agree that people have always been extreme as the norm. Most people were much more moderate years ago because they interacted with so many different kinds of people. I think this new extreme style is growing due to the Internet's echo-chambers.
I am getting older and feel odd about how extreme people are these days. Of course the extremes tend to shout the loudest, so I don't feel the extremes even make up 50% of the population yet. It probably will grow to that unless people become smarter. I find people with extreme views pretty dim to be honest.
The fact that the majority of Americans function in anomic swarms is the norm...the old political parties and social institutions are crumbled antiques of importance essentially to the old and elderly, but otherwise virtually meaningless now. To those who came of age in the Eighties or were born after there is no extreme, there is just the daily red-hot surge of mindless righteousness giving your hormones a good goosing. Life in a wasp swarm. Not extreme for wasps in swarms, just the way it is.
Do you mean (or can anyone clarify) that the people who came of age in the 80s or later are more extreme?
They would be more extreme due to social media? Because of the echo chamber effect.
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