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Lead batteries are recycled..Right?? Isn't that why we pay a fee when buying a new one. And when we have used up old
batteries the scrap yard buy's em for like 10 a pop. Do they do that so they can throw in a landfill? Maybe I'm just naive
and don't know much about the subject.
Please enlighten me to why all lead batteries end up in landfills when people buy them and get a new one, and we pay a recycle cost at suppliers like Auto Zone and any other major Auto supply chain..
Lead batteries are recycled..Right?? Isn't that why we pay a fee when buying a new one. And when we have used up old
batteries the scrap yard buy's em for like 10 a pop. Do they do that so they can throw in a landfill? Maybe I'm just naive
and don't know much about the subject.
Please enlighten me to why all lead batteries end up in landfills when people buy them and get a new one, and we pay a recycle cost at suppliers like Auto Zone and any other major Auto supply chain..
Not all lead batteries end up in landfills. Recycling initiatives have reduced the numbers that would have wound up in landfills. Some still however still wind up in the landfills along with copper pipes and other valuable materials that could be recycled and stuff that shouldn't go in the landfill.
Recycling of batteries whether or not they contain mercury such as non rechargeable double AAs is still something that drastically lags. Same with recycling lithium ion batts in consumer goods. There is recycling of cell phones and other devices and the batteries in them do get recycled instead of going in the landfill.
It's babysteps and part of the issue is to get people into the habit. For instance one example used to reduce waste and encourage recycling was to get to not throw away their used inkjet carts and instead bring them in when they bought a new one. The catch to get people to do this was that the used inkjets were worth 2 dollars each.
Not all lead batteries end up in landfills. Recycling initiatives have reduced the numbers that would have wound up in landfills. Some still however still wind up in the landfills along with copper pipes and other valuable materials that could be recycled and stuff that shouldn't go in the landfill.
Recycling of batteries whether or not they contain mercury such as non rechargeable double AAs is still something that drastically lags. Same with recycling lithium ion batts in consumer goods. There is recycling of cell phones and other devices and the batteries in them do get recycled instead of going in the landfill.
It's babysteps and part of the issue is to get people into the habit. For instance one example used to reduce waste and encourage recycling was to get to not throw away their used inkjet carts and instead bring them in when they bought a new one. The catch to get people to do this was that the used inkjets were worth 2 dollars each.
Thanks for the reply. I do think as a country we r getting better at recycling as a whole, if it may be ink jet
carts or lithium batteries for a cordless drill. The options r out there for people to recycle all of these goods,
and with this knowledge going forward i think we will see much less junk in the landfills as the younger
generation is keen on recycling in general..
Lead-acid battery recycling is a major profit center for Exide and other large battery manufacturers. What they don't recycle is lithium based batteries with very few exceptions.
When high capacity lithium based batteries begin to pile up, the same people screaming now about recycling will be screaming then too except they'll all forget the hook they swallowed when someone told them the time wasn't right to ask about specifics.
Wow, we're now awash in a veritable tsunami of negativity and "black hat" criticism, which as we discussed in another thread is all past-based, that somehow got unleashed by a single press release about Tesla's plans to build a new battery factory.
There are no details yet. They haven't even selected a state to build it in, but yet somehow we're supposed to think it's all bad, and can do no good?
Sorry, that's not really forward thinking, and it simply inhibits progress.
What say we find out what they're actually planning before we tear it all apart? For all anyone knows, Elon Musk and his crew may already be ahead of you on this, as he's been ahead of so many others on so many things.
I am with you OpenD on this. Seems like some people would have us still riding horses into work everyday, because gas was a bad idea. I remember quote from the first "Ford" of the Ford family before the automobile or "horseless carriage" was invented. It went something like this, I don't have the energy to look up the exact quote. He said if I asked people what they wanted, they would have told me a faster/stronger horse. In a nutshell, it took thinking outside the box to get the automobile.
Second, your worry about all these batteries and people or companies not wanting to recycle them problem has an easy solution. It's called a law that says you cannot dispose of them in a landfill. Much in the same way you cannot (legally) throw out a lead acid battery in a landfill. You MUST bring it back to the store where you purchased a new one. If you don't have an exchange a hefty "core" charge is levied.
Just like diesel has all these regs to keep motors using it, cleaner. There will be some to keep battery cars dirty side under control as well. There will be a need for LiOn batteries for at least the next 20 years or so. Something will use that type of battery assuming a better tech. comes along. We still can get old style alkaline batteries as an example.
Another question I have and this plays into Tesla's plan. We as a society pay for road repairs partly by a GAS/Fuel taxes. How does that play into a battery car. Or even better, how do we deal with it for a plug-in hybrid. Right now it isn't a big deal, but put a million(s) of them on the road and certain areas will start to fell it. Including Gas stations.
I don't know what hat I am wearing at the moment, so OpenD will have to tell me... I never learned hat tricks in psychology.
I am with you OpenD on this. Seems like some people would have us still riding horses into work everyday, because gas was a bad idea. I remember quote from the first "Ford" of the Ford family before the automobile or "horseless carriage" was invented. It went something like this, I don't have the energy to look up the exact quote. He said if I asked people what they wanted, they would have told me a faster/stronger horse. In a nutshell, it took thinking outside the box to get the automobile.
Second, your worry about all these batteries and people or companies not wanting to recycle them problem has an easy solution. It's called a law that says you cannot dispose of them in a landfill. Much in the same way you cannot (legally) throw out a lead acid battery in a landfill. You MUST bring it back to the store where you purchased a new one. If you don't have an exchange a hefty "core" charge is levied.
Just like diesel has all these regs to keep motors using it, cleaner. There will be some to keep battery cars dirty side under control as well. There will be a need for LiOn batteries for at least the next 20 years or so. Something will use that type of battery assuming a better tech. comes along. We still can get old style alkaline batteries as an example.
Another question I have and this plays into Tesla's plan. We as a society pay for road repairs partly by a GAS/Fuel taxes. How does that play into a battery car. Or even better, how do we deal with it for a plug-in hybrid. Right now it isn't a big deal, but put a million(s) of them on the road and certain areas will start to fell it. Including Gas stations.
I don't know what hat I am wearing at the moment, so OpenD will have to tell me... I never learned hat tricks in psychology.
Gas taxes are not enough to pay for road repairs right now hence why the country's roads are rated at D. The issue is that roads are not built to last for decades before having to be replaced. An additional 170 billion annually is estimated to be needed to improve the condition and performance of the roads in this country. 2013 Report Card for America's Infrastructure | Roads
Last edited by d from birmingham; 03-01-2014 at 03:34 PM..
The cleanest option is to walk. Or ride a bike. Or use our already existing electrified vehicles that can carry hundreds of people each.
But as far as cars go, battery vehicles are infinitely better than gasoline or diesel.
Mack Knife is being purposely obtuse, so I'll ignore him except to respond the horrifying specter of recycling nontoxic li-ion batteries is trivial compared to the current problems with extracting and refining petroleum, transporting this highly volatile and flammable material, burning it in mass quantities in our cities, the regularly replaced engine lubrication oil, the lead batteries, etc, etc. Go visit Beijing for a day and tell me they're better off with gas.
Wow, we're now awash in a veritable tsunami of negativity and "black hat" criticism, which as we discussed in another thread is all past-based, that somehow got unleashed by a single press release about Tesla's plans to build a new battery factory.
There are no details yet. They haven't even selected a state to build it in, but yet somehow we're supposed to think it's all bad, and can do no good?
Sorry, that's not really forward thinking, and it simply inhibits progress.
What say we find out what they're actually planning before we tear it all apart? For all anyone knows, Elon Musk and his crew may already be ahead of you on this, as he's been ahead of so many others on so many things.
Sure, why not we just become part of the yes crowd and never ever take a contrary view to certain things.
Great, lets just shut down this entire forum or are the only kinds of forums now acceptable the ones where everyone agrees? I wonder how long that would last.
How does dissecting ideas inhibit progress and are you the one to decide what inhibits or fosters progress?
The lack of contrary views created the problems we have today. Shall we continue doing to same thing in the name of harmony?
Musk is not a god you know. He is very good at PR and seems to have some good ideas but come on, hyper loop? No one watched any sci-fi because nothing he came up with wasn't thought of before. He just happened to make a splash saying it and lots of people forgot how to think and believed it was his idea.
Why just the other day on a major network news broadcast, the anchor said in referring to the planned battery factory something like ...and this from the man who also gave us the hyper loop.
I was astounded. Anyone see it yet? Musk gave us the hyper loop?
Bottom line is that challenges to groupthink have always rattled the cages of followers. Oh no, dare not disagree or challenge, wait until they are finished because you know, only Musk knows what to do.
d & wooliemonster - Agreed. And I am not being a yes man. And sorry, but with my Arthritis, my biking and walking days are long gone - and I have limited to no access to mass transit. I;d have to walk 1.5 miles to the nearest Bus stop that comes one an hour during rush hours. I can't do the 1.5 mile walk anyways. Miami is ranked pretty low on that list - only above areas that have NONE.
D made my point - taking MORE away from gas taxes generated isn't going to make things better. Some areas have started increasing gas taxes. Not it affects me when I drive my diesel, but not when I drive my Volt. (We rarely use gas). Not sure whether they did it or how it worked out, but a city in Oregon was thinking of charging by the mile driven - interesting concept. But of course you know people will figure out how to deactivate the device that counts your miles or will odometer tamper. Maybe put this in registration fees? Problem is some areas of the country it is already ridiculous to register a vehicle, because they have personal property taxes on them every year. ($1200 a year for a newer vehicle - which means older, less efficient, and more polluting cars are much cheaper to keep on the road) I don't have the answers unfortunately, just the questions.
On Edit: Mack, I enjoy your contrarian point of view, even if most of it I don't agree with. I think it is good to know what and why the people that disagree with a battery factory and electric vehicles think. I, do, want to know your solution or proposal. Even if it is to just keep on plugging away in ICE cars.
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