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One little 7-yr-old girl told my stepdaughter that she was going straight to Hell because she had said "a bad word" and that God hates sinners. I'd say the indoctrination was complete
I would say that is a bit extreme.
We haven't noticed it being that over the top, but maybe we live in an area that has more transplants. I will admit I have been invited to church several times, I have gotten strange looks when I telll people that we don't attend church and aren't attempting to pick one, but once another little girl told my daughter that she was lucky that she wasn't forced to go to church every week. But I don't know that it is any better or worse than any other area in the south.
For us we are not a church going, bible thumping, or holy roller type of family, but I belive in "something." Just last night I told my son that he had God given gifts, I believe that there is something beyond living 50-100 years on this planet, but I don't know what. I don't know that I truly believe in evolution or little green men that planted us here, I don't know that I believe God created the planet in 6 days either....so just call me spiritual and confused
I don't believe that going to church will make me a better person or not going to church will damn me to hell. I believe in being the best person I can be, doing my best to help my neighbors and raise a good family. I attended Catholic school half my life and my daughter did for one year, but I am not sure I subscribe to all of the beliefs and/or ceremony. I have tried my best to explain to my children that all people believe different things, even at church, they are welcome to form their own beliefs as they get older and can form an understanding of what "evidence" exsists in both directions, I have attempted to explain to them they types of beliefs others have in all directions. So far we haven't encountered anyone damning us to hell or avoiding us for those beliefs.
As a family we have experienced many things that can't be explained logically. How can you explain that my very religious grandmother(who was my biggest support system with my son) passed away and my son said his first words three days later? or walked on my birthday the following year-with no indication that he would(no rail walking or standing and falling type of stuff, just woke up after a very long atypical night of sleep and walked like he had always been doing it). Is it God? karma? spirits? coincidence?(a little much for this one) I know I also get mad when people attribute everything that has happened in our family to God, I know what we went through and I don't believe the results would have been the same if I stuffed him in a closet and waited for God. So, I don't know. I guess I believe that if there is a God, he/she helps those who help themselves. I will likely not know anything definitively until it is too late to explain it to anyone
One little 7-yr-old girl told my stepdaughter that she was going straight to Hell because she had said "a bad word" and that God hates sinners. I'd say the indoctrination was complete
I have a similar experience.
Its a function of introducing children to concepts they are not ready for. Kids of that age have no real understanding of the concept of hell nor sin... but many parents seem to insist that they should.
One little 7-yr-old girl told my stepdaughter that she was going straight to Hell because she had said "a bad word" and that God hates sinners. I'd say the indoctrination was complete
I have an aunt that believes if you cut your hair or wear pants you are going to hell. however, her husband gambles but that is ok. I am not saying gambling is wrong because I don't think it is, but, I would say comparing the two it is worser to gamble than cut your hair. alot of stuff that people say regarding religious belief is just man made. as far as just accepting religion and not question it I looked at and have listened to other things like evolution and I came to the conclusion that I think god exists.
We are a non-religious, homeschooling family in Decatur. We have had some rough times meeting other families and are usually judged because we don't go to church. Does anyone know of or would like to help start a group for secular families to provide the networking and social aspects of church without the religion?
Did you ever consider that the reason you might have a tough time meeting other families is that you do not attend 2 of things that many families attend--------church and school events?
Perhaps it has nothing to do with people judging you.
Did you ever consider that the reason you might have a tough time meeting oher families is that you do not attend 2 of things that many families attend--------church and school events?
Perhaps it has nothing to do with people judging you.
A fair and reasonable question.
However, I can definitively say, I know several people who were perfectly friendly and sociable with me until they found out I'm an atheist.
A girl I knew in college actually had no idea what the word meant. We met in class, had been getting along, eating lunch together and she had introduced me to a number of people she knew. I was new in town and one day she invited me to her church. I said, "No thanks, I'm an atheist." She responded... "so... you don't go to church?" Not going to church was understood. Not believing in God was unheard of. I had to explain it.
She subsequently talked to her preacher about me and I began to get the feeling that she was avoiding me. Where she was eager to chat and even go eat lunch in the past - she would now give a very short "Hello" followed by some reason she had to get away or couldn't stop to talk. I thought nothing of it at first.
Eventually, I got the hint and stopped talking to her. A year later I saw her at a party and asked whatever happened to her - did I pizz her off or something. She came out and told me that she "wasn't supposed to talk to me". That we had different beliefs, and she was afraid that I'd "draw her away from God". She flatly told me that she talked to her preacher and he said that she should avoid me. That I would say things that sounded good, but all I would be doing is tempting her and sowing doubt. So she said she couldn't talk to me anymore.
Its disheartening, but not really surprising. I mean, there's still a large number of people who believe an atheist shouldn't hold public office.
Another example is a conversation I had with a friend and his friend at a restaurant. My friend is a baptist preacher and wanted my opinion on his planned sermon for the fourth of july - knowing my beliefs. The sermon basically argued the whole "this is a Christian nation; Christian principles" theme. I gave him a polite retort arguing for enlightenment prinicples and deism; we discussed these things often. His friend however, seemed spoiling for a fight and irritated by everything I said. Everything I said met with a snide remark and hostility - eventually turning the entire conversation into an argument that boiled down to his believing that everything I say amounts to my telling him he is wrong. He grew increasingly frustrated and eventually insulted me outright. I fired back, and the whole thing nearly became a physical fight. My most distinct memory isn't the hostile nitwit, but my friend the preacher, who sat and grinned as things got ugly, as if something was funny.
Despite a couple years history of friendly discussion of religion, we never talked again.
My wife, who grew up southern baptist tells me "they're taught to ignore you, to avoid you. That you're a bad influence. The preacher always says 'The Devil has a silver tongue' and he 'knows the bible better than you'". To many religious people, I am the Devil come to tempt them.
I've even had one person tell me I lacked morals because morality is derived from God. Who wants to befriend the guy with no morals?
For some people, the religous issues are in fact barriers to socialization. Even when religion is not the topic, awareness often makes its presence felt. Heck, I know Republicans who cannot be good friends with Democrats! Its no different with religion. Many people feel threatened or extremely frustrated by opposing beliefs - even when they are not much discussed, but simply known. The hostility I've felt is certainly real.
Last edited by DvlsAdvc8; 02-09-2010 at 11:07 AM..
Interestingly, we have good friends who we just never discuss religion. We are on the opposite side of things but we enjoy each other's company. I will say that as a Christian one of the hardest things I have to deal with is other people who claim to be Christian and their actions/words. Sometimes I think that if it were up to their example, I wouldn't want to be a Christian either. I admit that we can be our own worse enemy in how we treat others, etc. But as I have matured I realize that ultimately, it is God who will judge. Not me or anybody else. All I can be responsible for is my own actions. Even then, I fail badly and that is where my personal beliefs come in. The God that I believe is real is one of forgiveness because I need it! I mess up alot. So please forgive those that are rude, immature, and possibly downright wrong. Many people think alot of things are in the Bible that aren't there. Don't judge all by a few. And if we can all just respect one another's belief's without belittling each other, then our society would be so much better off.
For some people, the religous issues are in fact barriers to socialization. Even when religion is not the topic, awareness often makes its presence felt. Heck, I know Republicans who cannot be good friends with Democrats! Its no different with religion. Many people feel threatened or extremely frustrated by opposing beliefs - even when they are not much discussed, but simply known. The hostility I've felt is certainly real.
Personally I enjoy speaking with people that have opposing beliefs, there may be facts or arguments that I am overlooking, I have had some of my opinions change and I am willing to admit that I am wrong if I am convinced of it. The world is made up of different belief systems and all of those beliefs come from somwhere, I like to know the why. To me the most irritating people are the ones that have no reason or their reason is "because my family is....." or "because I was raised to....." I liken that to the old recipes that people still use that indicate cutting things in half because ovens used to be smaller but even now with larger ovens the traditions are passed down to cut them in half.
As an Atheist I have not "indoctrinated" my daughter in to anything but free thought...possibly more so than some who might readily wear that as a badge. Because it will be my daughter's own decision as her mind matures.
I prefer to keep such ideologies to myself unless questioned or challenged, and I believe that religion should be a private matter.
My daughter has not been taught that there is no God, but that I do not believe in God. She has been told that her mother does not worship any deities, does not put faith in any greater power. And that other people do, and believe many things...including members of her extended family.
It will be interesting to witness the level of tolerance as she ages, both hers and her peers. I am uncertain how it will shape her youthful relationships, but there is a subtle Christian presence in her school.
I know several people who were perfectly friendly and sociable with me until they found out I'm an atheist.
A girl I knew in college...She flatly told me that she talked to her preacher and he said that she should avoid me. That I would say things that sounded good, but all I would be doing is tempting her and sowing doubt. So she said she couldn't talk to me anymore.
My friend is a baptist preacher...Despite a couple years history of friendly discussion of religion, we never talked again.
My wife, who grew up southern baptist tells me "they're taught to ignore you, to avoid you. That you're a bad influence."
The hostility I've felt is certainly real.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 33458
It will be interesting to witness the level of tolerance as she ages, both hers and her peers. I am uncertain how it will shape her youthful relationships, but there is a subtle Christian presence in her school.
What are you going to do if you kid's friends' parents are uncomfortable with their kids playing with your kid?
Two of my kids hitch rides with their friends to church on Sundays. We let them do it because for us it is like free babysitting - we can have a more peaceful Sunday morning. But I am very uncomfortable with it. Both my six year old and my eight year old are starting to become brainwashed. I am 80% certain that if I told those parents that I am uncomfortable with my kids going to their church that those parents would have their kids avoid my kids, like described above. I'm sort of in a jam - have my kids lose their best friends or suck it up and let my kids keep getting brainwashed. The neighbors really like taking them - they probably score points with their pastors or something - or maybe they think god will more likely get them into heaven.
"I have never seen the slightest scientific proof of the religious ideas of heaven and hell, of future life for individuals, or of a personal God. I do not believe that any type of religion should ever be introduced into the public schools of the United States. So far as religion of the day is concerned, it is a damned fake... Religion is all bunk."
- Thomas Edison
What are you going to do if you kid's friends' parents are uncomfortable with their kids playing with your kid?
Two of my kids hitch rides with their friends to church on Sundays. We let them do it because for us it is like free babysitting - we can have a more peaceful Sunday morning. But I am very uncomfortable with it. Both my six year old and my eight year old are starting to become brainwashed. I am 80% certain that if I told those parents that I am uncomfortable with my kids going to their church that those parents would have their kids avoid my kids, like described above. I'm sort of in a jam - have my kids lose their best friends or suck it up and let my kids keep getting brainwashed. The neighbors really like taking them - they probably score points with their pastors or something - or maybe they think god will more likely get them into heaven.
"I have never seen the slightest scientific proof of the religious ideas of heaven and hell, of future life for individuals, or of a personal God. I do not believe that any type of religion should ever be introduced into the public schools of the United States. So far as religion of the day is concerned, it is a damned fake... Religion is all bunk."
- Thomas Edison
I think it's interesting how you dislike the Christian message except for when it benefits you in your life, Charles. I remember you talked about Christian preschools on this forum at one time, as well. The fact is, you are the parent, and it's up to you to decide if your child is going to associate with those big bad Christians that brainwash their children...oh, and give you and your wife free babysitting. How awful of them to offer to give your children a ride so you can have some free time on a Sunday morning. It must all be a part of the plan
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