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Old 01-12-2011, 11:54 AM
 
Location: US, California - federalist
2,794 posts, read 3,681,281 times
Reputation: 484

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Did you watch the video I posted? If so, you would realize it isn’t an issue of visas. It’s greed, period. They want cheap labor, and nothing else will suffice. Changing laws will not change their mindset.
The issue is a dearth of market friendliness in work visas; otherwise we would not have an illegal problem for you to be concerned with.
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Old 01-12-2011, 11:55 AM
 
Location: Maryland
15,171 posts, read 18,583,589 times
Reputation: 3044
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielpalos View Post
The issue is a dearth of market friendliness in work visas; otherwise we would not have an illegal problem for you to be concerned with.
You still don’t get it.
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Old 01-12-2011, 11:57 AM
 
Location: The Ranch in Olam Haba
23,707 posts, read 30,800,092 times
Reputation: 9985
Quote:
Did you watch the video I posted? If so, you would realize it isn’t an issue of visas. It’s greed, period. They want cheap labor, and nothing else will suffice. Changing laws will not change their mindset.
This video has nothing to do with illegals. It has to do with H1B visas. It allows you to hire outside of the country below the prevailing wage and not pay american payroll taxes. It treats employees like contract employees. You're fired, you're deported and no unemloyment to be paid.

The law needs to be changed so its not profitable to hire people from outside the country. This visa program was supposed to fill a need when there was no american to fill it. Its changed over the years to allow big holes to grow in the laws. If there is a true need, then it should cost more and not less to hire under H1B.

Last edited by Pruzhany; 01-12-2011 at 12:06 PM..
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Old 01-12-2011, 12:06 PM
 
Location: San Diego
50,479 posts, read 47,219,800 times
Reputation: 34132
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilVA View Post
Per the 2nd quote, its just excuses. There are numerous legal residents sitting on the entitlement ride. They can get partial unemployment and they know it. Under welfare there is an incentive to go to work. Under UI there is not. So here we have millions of legal residents not willing to work these jobs.

If the farmers have no legal residents who are able to work and we take away illegals then whats left? (Maybe we should fix NAFTA (those jobs went to China & India)).Another industry leaves the country. Remember we live in a country based on Capitalism and not Socialism/Communism.



This visa program is built to fail. The process needs to be streamlined We can go into this direction if they put it on a level playing ground that American citizens follow. How about we remove free housing to start?
The part of the equation that isn't being tried is to raise wages right? If they (businesses) can't get by without offering a decent wage then they should lobby for subsidies or consider a different type of farming.

I had to do it when wheat tanked many many years ago.
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Old 01-12-2011, 12:11 PM
 
Location: US, California - federalist
2,794 posts, read 3,681,281 times
Reputation: 484
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
You still don’t get it.
I got it and I understand the nature of the problem; it is not what you believe it to be.
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Old 01-12-2011, 12:14 PM
 
Location: US, California - federalist
2,794 posts, read 3,681,281 times
Reputation: 484
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilVA View Post
The law needs to be changed so its not profitable to hire people from outside the country. This visa program was supposed to fill a need when there was no american to fill it. Its changed over the years to allow big holes to grow in the laws. If there is a true need, then it should cost more and not less to hire under H1B.
How does that solve our illegal problem on a permanent basis through Commerce instead of the coercive use of force of the State? A more, market friendly work visa could render our illegal problem moot.
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Old 01-12-2011, 12:14 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,171 posts, read 18,583,589 times
Reputation: 3044
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilVA View Post
This video has nothing to do with illegals. It has to do with H1B visas. It allows you to hire outside of the country below the prevailing wage and not pay american payroll taxes. It treats employees like contract employees. You're fired, you're deported and no unemloyment to be paid.

The law needs to be changed so its not profitable to hire people from outside the country. This visa program was supposed to fill a need when there was no american to fill it. Its changed over the years to allow big holes to grow in the laws. If there is a true need, then it should cost more and not less to hire under H1B.

Greed compels companies to deliberately disqualify U.S. citizens in favor of foreign H-1B workers willing to accept less pay, and greed is the impetus for the employment of illegal aliens. The claim that there are not enough U.S. citizens or legal residents willing to work in the agriculture industry is as bogus as the claim that there are not enough qualified IT workers.

This scam has been exposed, and companies have been fined for using H-1B visas to hire janitorial staff, restaurant employees, and myriad other worker classifications that do not meet the H-1B requirements.
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Old 01-12-2011, 12:17 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,171 posts, read 18,583,589 times
Reputation: 3044
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielpalos View Post
I got it and I understand the nature of the problem; it is not what you believe it to be.
If you actually believe in the integrity of the corporate elite, there isn’t much I can say to dissuade you.
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Old 01-12-2011, 12:59 PM
 
Location: The Ranch in Olam Haba
23,707 posts, read 30,800,092 times
Reputation: 9985
Quote:
The part of the equation that isn't being tried is to raise wages right? If they (businesses) can't get by without offering a decent wage then they should lobby for subsidies
So you want to raise the wages so the farmer goes into the red. Then you want the govt to subsidize the farmer so he is back in the black (an entitlement). ok then where should the money be taken from to subsidize the farmer??

Quote:
A more, market friendly work visa could render our illegal problem moot.
Correct. But read the current version of the H2A visa. Its not.

Old H-2A Program, pre-Bush Administration Changes (http://www.fwjustice.org/guestworker-programs/h-2a/pre-2009-h-2a-program - broken link)

Quote:
This scam has been exposed, and companies have been fined for using H-1B visas to hire janitorial staff, restaurant employees, and myriad other worker classifications that do not meet the H-1B requirements.
But the fines are nothing compared to profit to be made. The fines need to exceed the violations of H1B.

Columbus, OH H1B Visa Attorney :: Penalties & Violations :: Cleveland Work Visa Lawyer
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Old 01-12-2011, 01:23 PM
 
Location: US, California - federalist
2,794 posts, read 3,681,281 times
Reputation: 484
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
If you actually believe in the integrity of the corporate elite, there isn’t much I can say to dissuade you.
Consider the point of view that greed can be good, under any form of capital based market system. It can provide motivation for a profit motive. Is it their fault that we have ineffective public policies and pay taxes, and pay our elected representatives to government to do a good job; while not getting the good results we hope for? Usually, and in the private sector, people are paid to do a good job.
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