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Old 08-23-2007, 10:24 PM
 
358 posts, read 916,722 times
Reputation: 136

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzedforhim View Post
Giz? Ilovejazz? Anyone? Bueller....Bueller?
One of the great divisors between Judaism and Christian/Islam is that Judaism is not preoccupied with the afterlife with the zeal of Christianity and Islam. Regardless of rhetoric, no one on earths knows what will happen when we die. Each religion has its own theories. But none of us knows for certain. Judaism has its theories, just as other religions. But even then, not all rabbis agree on exactly the same theories. Jews are primarily concerned with living quality lives here on earth and making it a better place. Hashem gave us 613 mitzvot and the more we follow the laws, the better the earth will be for all of us. If we take care of the earth that G-d gave us, then G-d will take care of us when we die.

 
Old 08-23-2007, 10:57 PM
 
Location: In the Redwoods
30,360 posts, read 51,970,126 times
Reputation: 23808
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilovejazz View Post
One of the great divisors between Judaism and Christian/Islam is that Judaism is not preoccupied with the afterlife with the zeal of Christianity and Islam. Regardless of rhetoric, no one on earths knows what will happen when we die. Each religion has its own theories. But none of us knows for certain. Judaism has its theories, just as other religions. But even then, not all rabbis agree on exactly the same theories. Jews are primarily concerned with living quality lives here on earth and making it a better place. Hashem gave us 613 mitzvot and the more we follow the laws, the better the earth will be for all of us. If we take care of the earth that G-d gave us, then G-d will take care of us when we die.
YES - Well said! I guess that's why I've had trouble answering Jazzedforhim's questions, since I simply haven't considered the issue much. We don't focus on death and the afterlife (compared to other religions), so luckily it's not something that sits heavily on my mind. Though, as a self-proclaimed "Agnostic Jew", I probably do fear death more than your average believer. Deep topic, huh?
 
Old 08-23-2007, 11:03 PM
 
Location: In the Redwoods
30,360 posts, read 51,970,126 times
Reputation: 23808
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilovejazz View Post
Do you think most eight-day-old infants will remember it?
That's my overall theory on this topic - might as well do it while he's still too young to remember! My brother was circumcised in a traditional Bris at 8 days old, and doesn't remember a darned thing... I've never heard him mention or discuss the issue (thankfully! ), which is probably an indication that he's fine with it. While it's not a common practice worldwide, it is in the US, so I'd assume he prefers looking like other boys. I can't say much more as a woman without children, but if I do ever have a son, I will absolutely have him circumcised.
 
Old 08-24-2007, 08:49 AM
 
443 posts, read 1,542,029 times
Reputation: 233
Quote:
Originally Posted by gizmo980 View Post
That's my overall theory on this topic - might as well do it while he's still too young to remember! My brother was circumcised in a traditional Bris at 8 days old, and doesn't remember a darned thing... I've never heard him mention or discuss the issue (thankfully! ), which is probably an indication that he's fine with it. While it's not a common practice worldwide, it is in the US, so I'd assume he prefers looking like other boys. I can't say much more as a woman without children, but if I do ever have a son, I will absolutely have him circumcised.
What are your thoughts on female circumcision?
 
Old 08-24-2007, 09:59 AM
 
Location: Happy wherever I am - Florida now
3,360 posts, read 12,273,142 times
Reputation: 3909
Female circumcision is a barbaric practice, which unlike male circumcision has nothing to do with a person's health and would never be condoned by any jew.

It is another attempt by men to control women as it takes all pleasure out of sexual relations and reduces women to mere breeding stock. Female relatives are complicit in the undertaking I suppose in order to save girls lives. Their own families will and do kill them if they become accused of relations with other than their husband.

The two practices as well as the mindsets are diametrically opposed.
 
Old 08-24-2007, 11:54 AM
 
443 posts, read 1,542,029 times
Reputation: 233
Having undergone the removal of my own foreskin at age 14, I can assure you it is one of the most agonizing experiences a man could go through.

I will never force that pain on my defenseless sons.
 
Old 08-24-2007, 01:54 PM
 
150 posts, read 393,233 times
Reputation: 142
I wrote a lengthy paper on female genital MUTILATION, not circumcision. I refuse to use that watered down term, although many academics use it in their feeble attempts to rationalize it through a cultural relativity paradigm...The World Health Organization, as well as most indigenous groups trying to stop the practices use my term as well. An interesting side note, it has become a Muslim practice, even though the Koran does not state it as such. Nevertheless, it is written that the prophet Mohammed stated it was "good that women be circumcized", therefore the practice has been perpetuated. There are currently 150 million females, from infancy to adulthood who have been mutilated alive today. In Sudan almost 90% of females undergo female genital mutilation. And yes, the elder women do it in the belief that it will allow their daughters to be married, which is a reality, and the girls have it done for the same belief and they have internalized this concept of purity. They believe the "uncircumcized" female body is a gaping opening that is dirty and smelly, etc. This despite the fact that after mutilation many women and girls have lifelong infections, fistulas, etc. I could go on, but I won't. It is by far one of the most egregious cases of misogynistic patriarchy on the planet.
 
Old 08-24-2007, 05:56 PM
 
Location: Northern California
1,587 posts, read 3,912,250 times
Reputation: 541
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilovejazz View Post
One of the great divisors between Judaism and Christian/Islam is that Judaism is not preoccupied with the afterlife with the zeal of Christianity and Islam. Regardless of rhetoric, no one on earths knows what will happen when we die. Each religion has its own theories. But none of us knows for certain. Judaism has its theories, just as other religions. But even then, not all rabbis agree on exactly the same theories. Jews are primarily concerned with living quality lives here on earth and making it a better place. Hashem gave us 613 mitzvot and the more we follow the laws, the better the earth will be for all of us. If we take care of the earth that G-d gave us, then G-d will take care of us when we die.
I'm not overly obsessed with it, I was just trying to understand what the Jewish religion's stand was on it. It's all good.
 
Old 08-24-2007, 05:57 PM
 
Location: Northern California
1,587 posts, read 3,912,250 times
Reputation: 541
Quote:
Originally Posted by gizmo980 View Post
That's my overall theory on this topic - might as well do it while he's still too young to remember! My brother was circumcised in a traditional Bris at 8 days old, and doesn't remember a darned thing... I've never heard him mention or discuss the issue (thankfully! ), which is probably an indication that he's fine with it. While it's not a common practice worldwide, it is in the US, so I'd assume he prefers looking like other boys. I can't say much more as a woman without children, but if I do ever have a son, I will absolutely have him circumcised.
My son was three days old.
 
Old 08-24-2007, 06:00 PM
 
Location: Northern California
1,587 posts, read 3,912,250 times
Reputation: 541
Quote:
Originally Posted by stellar View Post
I wrote a lengthy paper on female genital MUTILATION, not circumcision. I refuse to use that watered down term, although many academics use it in their feeble attempts to rationalize it through a cultural relativity paradigm...The World Health Organization, as well as most indigenous groups trying to stop the practices use my term as well. An interesting side note, it has become a Muslim practice, even though the Koran does not state it as such. Nevertheless, it is written that the prophet Mohammed stated it was "good that women be circumcized", therefore the practice has been perpetuated. There are currently 150 million females, from infancy to adulthood who have been mutilated alive today. In Sudan almost 90% of females undergo female genital mutilation. And yes, the elder women do it in the belief that it will allow their daughters to be married, which is a reality, and the girls have it done for the same belief and they have internalized this concept of purity. They believe the "uncircumcized" female body is a gaping opening that is dirty and smelly, etc. This despite the fact that after mutilation many women and girls have lifelong infections, fistulas, etc. I could go on, but I won't. It is by far one of the most egregious cases of misogynistic patriarchy on the planet.
Never heard of it. Hmmm....going to have to google that one.
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