[BBMW]

I don't know the answer to this. Maybe someone does, but...

Were they explicitly buying the homeless tickets to SF, or were they saying they'd get them a ticket anywhere, and the vagrants, knowing SF is as friendly a place to be homeless as anywhere, and better than most, just choosing to go there themselves? If the latter is the case, who's really causing the problem?

Also, where the local authorities putting the arm on the vagrants to take the ticket, or were the vagrants happy to leave the 110 degree heat and not particularly homeless friendly environment?

Originally Posted by Raiderman

Other than being bussed from California, I can't recall any other states actively shipping homeless and mentally ill to Nevada. I think that is the difference. Each person is free to move about the country, but being transported by an agency funded by taxpayer money is another story.

[Datafeed]

Originally Posted by BBMW

I don't know the answer to this. Maybe someone does, but...

Were they explicitly buying the homeless tickets to SF, or were they saying they'd get them a ticket anywhere, and the vagrants, knowing SF is as friendly a place to be homeless as anywhere, and better than most, just choosing to go there themselves? If the latter is the case, who's really causing the problem?

Also, where the local authorities putting the arm on the vagrants to take the ticket, or were the vagrants happy to leave the 110 degree heat and not particularly homeless friendly environment?

Wow. Not only do you really miss the point but you will never be mistaken for an attorney.

First: The people were not simply homeless, they were being treated in facility designed to treat illness. The medical facility has the obligation to treat the sick--within reason--and not discharge them prematurely. Teh fact that you refer to them as homeless or mentally ill is confusing you. Think of them as post op breast cancer patients instead of bums. SO, say your sister has surgery but her insurance is deemed insufficient so they dump her in AZ a few days after surgery. Would you find the medical provider legally negligent or in violation of the Hippocratic oath?

Two: Known or should have known will likely be the determinant;i.e, would the medical facility know or should they have known (according to industry standard) that the patient was discharged prematurely-who may not be able to make such a decision--and would require immediate medical care upon crossing state lines?

Note the text from the article cited: "Herrera said an investigation by his office had identified 24 patients who had been bused to San Francisco over the past five years, 20 of whom Herrera said required emergency treatment upon arrival."

Scoop, if this is true, the doctors did know:

"The Bee undertook its investigation after one of those patients, James Flavy Coy Brown, turned up suicidal and confused at a Sacramento homeless services complex after a 15-hour bus ride from Las Vegas to the capital city. Brown said he knew no one in Sacramento and that Rawson-Neal doctors advised him to dial 911 once he arrived in the city.

Three, why are they suing the State of Nevada? Is Rawson Neal a state hopsital?

[von949]

Originally Posted by ScoopLV

Isn't that, in essence, what other states are doing about it?

Every state except Utah. Utah is probably the best place for a homeless person that wants to get their life together.


(Just as long as they do not mind a minor involvement in the LDS church.)

[NLVgal]

Originally Posted by von949

Every state except Utah. Utah is probably the best place for a homeless person that wants to get their life together.


(Just as long as they do not mind a minor involvement in the LDS church.)

Pretty sure that Salt Lake was one of the cities giving bus tickets to Vegas out for free to the homeless population.

[von949]

Originally Posted by Datafeed

Just asking for your best guess. No stats like this exist.

Re vets. I spent ten years downrange in war zones and I can tell you civilian life sucks. It's largely meaningless unless you are really family focused or doing something important.

One of the XE Security guys on my last contract was SOF and an awesome dude. he came back..young dude no family...blew through his 800 a day security money on clubs, whores, and coke...tried selling insurance....a warrior selling insurance...lol....and ended up being forced to work loss prevention at marshalls. His hooker bottle rate gf was always beating on him. One day he pushed her away, she fell, and my dude has a DV charge and gets fired from because he was locked up and didnt call me for bail.

a few months later he is at seagal suites with 13.00 in his account. He got evicted and I let him crash in my pad as i was in NYC anyway. he got his clearance suspended because of the DV charge so he cant go back downrange anymore. I loaned him the money to enroll is culinary school and the SOB is now like an Assistant Pastry Chef. he likes it.

His story ended well;many others do not.

i am still having adjustment problems and almost got kicked out of Columbia this past semester..the professor was a punk though. I was a contractor and got my hand blown off and got a seven figure settlement and some more loot--private insurance by the way...but my money has bought me a great support network...coming back broke with no family...yeah, bad things can happen.

It definitely is a hell of an adjustment from active duty to civilian life. I'm going through it now. Having a civilian boss for the first time in 15 years is a huge adjustment. It's a good thing I have huge family support and found a new career that pays a lot more than when I was in the military. I'm in the reserves now so I get my fix one weekend each month now. Lol

[von949]

Originally Posted by NLVgal

Pretty sure that Salt Lake was one of the cities giving bus tickets to Vegas out for free to the homeless population.

Didn't know that. Oh well.

[Merrily Gather]

Utah is ending homelessness by giving people homes

Utah added it all up including ER visits and jail time and figured out it's cheaper to give them homes and a social worker. Now other States are looking into following Utah's model.

How is the recovery program for addicts in Las Vegas? Is Alcoholics Anonymous and Narcotics Anonymous strong? 12 Step Programs work but I imagine there's temptation everywhere which makes it more difficult when I read things on this message board like you can drink for free for 24 hours a day in Las Vegas.

Also we have to take into consideration not everybody that is homeless wants help. For some it's a lifestyle choice. While others don't want to be homeless and it's difficult to rise out of their circumstances. There aren't enough jobs for everyone. Every State has a percentage of unemployed and underemployed and not everyone qualifies for benefits. Especially when the government wants to cut benefits such as food stamps and unemployment wages after a certain period of time.

There are alternative sustainable solutions but even then the government gets involved in that because those that own everything want to be in control. I'm talking about the experimental housing efforts that started by architects in New Mexico 30 years ago where land is designated for these homes that are made completely from sustainable recyclable materials around us that we waste and it costs us nothing. But no we can't allow people to go build sustainable homes in the deserts and live off the grid, because that might catch on and we all have to live by a certain cookie cutter standard and pay the utilities and consume things.

Their website: Earthship Biotecture

Full length documentary on it:

Garbage Warrior - Full Length Documentary - YouTube

In some cities in the Pacific Northwest they have homeless camps such as the tent city in Seattle. They're basically shanty towns. Some are long term and some are short term encampments specifically for veterans. In other cities they build gypsy style huts made of wood for the homeless in addition to multiple homeless and warming shelters.

Much of the reason for the increase in homelessness across the nation is due to the economic crash in 2007 where many people lost their jobs and the income inequality gap widened. That's also why we saw the backlash with the occupy movement sweep the nation against the bailout for the banks. A lot of homeless were part of those camps. Some long term homeless and some newly homeless. Many people lost their homes and livelihoods and haven't quite recovered. To cope with it they resorted to drugs and alcohol and fell into addiction.

[ScoopLV]

Originally Posted by Merry Lee Gather

Utah is ending homelessness by giving people homes

Utah added it all up including ER visits and jail time and figured out it's cheaper to give them homes and a social worker. Now other States are looking into following Utah's model.

Great link. Thanks. I'm sharing this with my political junkie friends elsewhere online. From the article:

In 2005, Utah figured out that the annual cost of E.R. visits and jail stays for homeless people was about $16,670 per person, compared to $11,000 to provide each homeless person with an apartment and a social worker.


This is Nordic model for homelessness. They already did the math, and it's simply cheaper to give the homeless a place to live. Does that satisfy our perverse "Scarlet Letter" stone-the-witches mentality? No. And that's why it won't happen in Las Vegas. Although I wish it would.

[tijlover]

Originally Posted by ev780

In a city with endless entry level service jobs, maybe, just maybe, the fault lies with the individual and not the rest of us? You can leave my taxes low and those on the streets can get a job if they want one. Just giving them money with no accountability is the wrong thing to do. Just my more conservative opinion.

Ever tried getting one of these entry-level jobs, being homeless? Today, even for one of these low-paying jobs there'll, invariably, be any number of hoops to jump thru to get one!

Back in 1972, briefly being homeless in Denver, it was a snap to go from homelessness to being employed!
Applied at a nursing home as a nursing assistant, was put to work the next day! Didn't even have the money for a uniform, no problem!

Just try that today! Today? You need to get your CNA license via schooling, and back then, it wasn't required. What else? You need a CPR card ($40), didn't need that back then! Also? You need to go have a back ground check, and tested for drugs! Didn't need that back then!

I've all but given up trying to find work, via Craigslist, for my Mexican Handyman/carpenter roommate!
He lost his truck during the Great Recession, and every job, without fail, says: Reliable transportation, car or preferably a truck! And he only has a bike! Without me, he'd be on the streets!

[Datafeed]

Originally Posted by von949

It definitely is a hell of an adjustment from active duty to civilian life. I'm going through it now. Having a civilian boss for the first time in 15 years is a huge adjustment. It's a good thing I have huge family support and found a new career that pays a lot more than when I was in the military. I'm in the reserves now so I get my fix one weekend each month now. Lol

AF life at Nellis ain't hard. I am talking about being downrange and in it. I had little trouble adjusting when I got out of the Navy. The boredom came from working in Beji, Banghdad, Kandahar, and Helmand..heck...my time at BIAP at BAF were kinda a joke as a systems analyst.

There is a big difference from being a FOBBIT sipping lattes and going to the TGIF at KAF than going outside the wire on a daily basis taking fire and returning it.