[Raiderman]

Originally Posted by LV10101

Raiderman...I understand what you are saying but you have to take all the areas bordering the gated neighborhood to get fiar statistics. The neighborhood that you specified is smaller than Legacy and is to the South, which is going to be better than the neighborhoods to the East/West and North. Furthermore as I pointed out crime is still higher in that neighborhood you used.

We can say LVCC is not a common gated neighborhood but it does show crime is lower within the LVCC than in the neighborhood surrounding LVCC, the whole point I am trying to make. To really show the difference in crime you would want to take a gated neighborhood in an overall bad neighborhood to prove the point gates deter crime.

Again as I mentioned earlier there are plenty of studies and groups who believe gated communities are a crime deterrent...I think it is obvious. I guess we can debate this forever but the crime stats show less crime in gated neighborhoods than the neighborhoods bordering the gated area.

So you are saying it is fair to compare a neighborhood with only SFHs with commercial areas and apartment complexes, but not other SFHs? How far do you have to expand the perimeter of the search area to prove your point? If we go 1.5 mi around Legacy, you can include a couple casinos, too..

[von949]

Just look up Nellis and Craig. Or Nellis and LVB or Cheyenne and LVB.

[LV10101]

Originally Posted by Raiderman

So you are saying it is fair to compare a neighborhood with only SFHs with commercial areas and apartment complexes, but not other SFHs? How far do you have to expand the perimeter of the search area to prove your point? If we go 1.5 mi around Legacy, you can include a couple casinos, too..

Raiderman...I went a few blocks out in every direction from Legacy, not sure how that isn't fair? I'm also not sure why including apartments isn't fair, people live in them. Also only two of those crimes I listed outside the gates were on commercial property. Also I didn't go out any further than .5 of a mile from Legacy...again not sure how that isn't a fair comparison.

You can have your opinion and I will have mine, based on crime data.

[lvoc]

Originally Posted by LV10101

Can you give me the crime statistics you found for both of these areas...from what crime mapper is showing crime is low in both areas and if both are gated what is your point???

Furthermore no matter if you are in a gated community or not the neighbors can still be a problem.

Again talking about deterrents and crime it is obvious there is less crime in gated communities.

You understand how this works? Since June 1,2014 The Villas has had 37 incidents and was also a major contributor to crime in the immediate area particularly the commercial area across Cheyenne. . Mar-a-lago has had 5 and the entire surrounding area around both ...none of which is gated. Has had a few dozen. I suspect that close to half the crimes in Desert Shores comes from the Villas...which are perhaps 10% or less of the population and area.

[von949]

What's the night and day of Manzanita condominiums on Craig rd?

[LV10101]

lvoc...so you picked one gated community with an obvious crime problem and use that as the norm? If you look at the majority of gated communities in Las Vegas and Henderson you will see the crime is lower inside the gates.

This topic is getting to or past the point of usefulness. If you want to continue to debate the crime rates or deterrent effectiveness of gated communities please do so but the crime statistics are clear.

[lvoc]

Originally Posted by LV10101

lvoc...so you picked one gated community with an obvious crime problem and use that as the norm? If you look at the majority of gated communities in Las Vegas and Henderson you will see the crime is lower inside the gates.

This topic is getting to or past the point of usefulness. If you want to continue to debate the crime rates or deterrent effectiveness of gated communities please do so but the crime statistics are clear.

I know a whole lot abut this area. Been tracking crime statistics for a long time. I in no way ever hinted that I considered the Vlllas as representative of anything except cut throat wrong a$$ real estate. I also however doubt that gates actually provide much deterrent. it is the people on the inside of the gate that determine how it all works out.

At one end you got TPC with real and hard nosed security and a set of very well off people who like it...and a Sheldon Aldeson who can personally fund it to whatever level he chooses. At the other end you got Villas at Desert Shores or the Nellis communities. On the ungated side you got Sun City Summerlin which is probably lower crime than anywhere except perhaps TPC. A rolling patrol and old ladies watching over the hood provides immense security.

Your simply backing a losing hand. If gated feels good go for it. If you are not a believer don't.

[von949]

No, let's keep going. The lurkers are loving this thread.

[LV10101]

lvoc...Again you are not comparing the non-gated neighborhood right outside the gated neighborhood. The whole idea is the neighborhood the gated community is located in. Comparing a Nellis neighborhood to a Summerlin neighborhood doesn't make sense in many ways.

Also you are stating the "Nellis Gated Communities, believing they have higher crime is NOT correct. Since you fail to give me actual crime numbers I found them myself.

The gated neighborhood that's bordered by Mt Hood Street to the East / Stone Hollow Ave to the South / Toiyabe Street to the West and Nellis AFB to the North, here are their crime stats;
From August 10, 2014 until today:
Burglaries: 2
Vandalism: 3
Motor Vehicle Theft: 2
Disturbing the Peace: 2
Compared to the same amount of land (non-gated) to the East (during the same time frame):
Burglaries: 9
Motor Vehicle Theft: 3
Disturbing the Peace: 6
Assault: 1

The gated neighborhood that's bordered by E Judson to the South / Nellis Blvd to the West / Carey Ave Ave to the North / Betty Ln to the East:
Burglaries: 5
Robbery: 1
Disturbing the Peace: 5
Vandalism: 1
Assault: 1
Compared to the same amount of land (non-gated) to the South (during the same time frame):
Burglaries: 8
Motor Vehicle Theft: 9
Disturbing the Peace: 15
Assault: 8
Robbery: 9

So there's two gates neighborhoods I randomly picked and they both have less crime than the non-gated neighborhood next to them.

The statistics are majority in favor for a gated neighborhood based on lower crime within the gates. I'm not going to continue to debate this. If you feel good about your non-gated community so be it but don't make believe gated areas have just as much crime as non-gated.

[lvoc]

Originally Posted by LV10101

lvoc...Again you are not comparing the non-gated neighborhood right outside the gated neighborhood. The whole idea is the neighborhood the gated community is located in. Comparing a Nellis neighborhood to a Summerlin neighborhood doesn't make sense in many ways.

Also you are stating the "Nellis Gated Communities, believing they have higher crime is NOT correct. Since you fail to give me actual crime numbers I found them myself.

The gated neighborhood that's bordered by Mt Hood Street to the East / Stone Hollow Ave to the South / Toiyabe Street to the West and Nellis AFB to the North, here are their crime stats;
From August 10, 2014 until today:
Burglaries: 2
Vandalism: 3
Motor Vehicle Theft: 2
Disturbing the Peace: 2
Compared to the same amount of land (non-gated) to the East (during the same time frame):
Burglaries: 9
Motor Vehicle Theft: 3
Disturbing the Peace: 6
Assault: 1

The gated neighborhood that's bordered by E Judson to the South / Nellis Blvd to the West / Carey Ave Ave to the North / Betty Ln to the East:
Burglaries: 5
Robbery: 1
Disturbing the Peace: 5
Vandalism: 1
Assault: 1
Compared to the same amount of land (non-gated) to the South (during the same time frame):
Burglaries: 8
Motor Vehicle Theft: 9
Disturbing the Peace: 15
Assault: 8
Robbery: 9

So there's two gates neighborhoods I randomly picked and they both have less crime than the non-gated neighborhood next to them.

The statistics are majority in favor for a gated neighborhood based on lower crime within the gates. I'm not going to continue to debate this. If you feel good about your non-gated community so be it but don't make believe gated areas have just as much crime as non-gated.

Sorry but you have not refuted anything. Try the Villas again. 37 crimes since june 1. Try anyplace around there and find a tract that is not substantially better. The real problem is the socioeconomic demographic which inhabits the Villas.

And that is the problem even next to Nellis. I suspect the gated tracts have a better socioeconomic profile than the non gated.

And there is Sun City Summerlin. Which easily outscores almost any gated neighborhood. Again it is who lives there not how the area is fenced.