[MediocreButArrogant]

Originally Posted by LV10101

Interesting how someone takes one incident from a gated community and now attempts to make people believe gate communities are not as safe. I could find a ton of incidents outside my gated neighborhood to prove the opposite. Again believe what you want but the crime statistics are proof gated communities are a deterrent to crime...yes not crime proof but a deterrent.

You're reading something I did not write into what I posted. I did not share an opinion one way or the other in that post. Actually, my opinion, and what I see on crime maps is that manned gated communities have significantly fewer burglaries, and that unmanned gated communities have slightly fewer burglaries. The big step up in burglary reduction, and the one that is statistically significant to me comes with the guarded gate.

You may have tailed someone in at a resident's only gate but I would bet they have CCTV video of you doing so.

If you've ever poked your head inside the guard shack at RRCC you'd know that was the case. The point I was trying to make about the guards tracking down unauthorized visitors is that there is a big difference between unmanned automatic gates, and a gated community with security, to the point that they should be distinguished from one another and not lumped into the same category.

[LV10101]

Then why post one article about an incident in a gated community? It makes no sense if you agree that gated communities reduce crime to post one article about one incident inside a gated community. Guess what the President of the United States lives in a gated community and I can find a couple articles of people getting inside those gates. Yes gated communities are not crime proof but as I have said numerous times they are a crime deterrent. Yes things still happen but not as often as in a non-gated community.

Furthermore, I agree there is a difference between a guard gated and non-guard gated community, but again I was speaking to deterrents. Yes having a "guard" at the gate is an added deterrent but a gate alone is still a deterrent. Yes the CCTV video of you entering the residents only entry is not as good as having a "guard" there but it still acts as a deterrent and now they have your vehicle on video, hopefully if the camera is good enough and positioned correctly they have your license plate number as well.

If you look at the facts and crime statistics there is less crime in a gated community.

[vtvette]

The Blakely and Snyder report - one of the most definitive studies of gated communities ever performed:

http://www.popcenter.org/problems/bu...nyder_1998.pdf

Skip to page 14 for the conclusion: There is no discernible decrease in crime between gated and non-gated communities. Also cited are several in-depth studies performed by Ft.Lauderdale police which found there was no sustained drop in Auto Theft or Burglary in gated vs. non-gated communities. The majority of Police dislike gated (closed street) neighborhoods as they felt they in no way reduced crime and slow response time and inhibit Police patrols.

I also found several excellent doctoral thesis studies which concluded the exact same thing.

I'd love to see sources where gates reduce crime by any measurable difference.

[LV10101]

First, I never said it reduces crime by a "measurable difference". Again it's a DETERRENT. Second, I'm going based on Las Vegas crime reporting as of right now 2015...not a report from 1998, sorry. Third, I will give you one example...the Las Vegas Country Club. Please look at the crime on the inside of the Las Vegas Country Club and then look at the surrounding neighborhoods...sorry but it clearly is lower in the gated community.

Furthermore to say the majority of police dislike gated communities is a generalization, no matter 1998 or 2015.

Again it is a clear deterrent to crime, not sure what more I can say.

[von949]

What happens when a cop/ambulance/fire truck response to an emergency in a gated community that has a security gate(no guard) and there isn't anyone going in or out? At my last gated community, a cop once parked outside of the gate with flashing lights and extra loud blaring sirens till someone in the community opened the gate.

[LV10101]

von949...well I guess that cop that was parked at the gate needs some more training. Not only do all emergency responders have access codes to gated communities but the dispatcher also has these codes. Sorry you are grasping at straws in attempt to prove something the crime statistics say otherwise. Please go look at the amount of crime in the area surrounding the Las Vegas Country Club Estates then look at the almost non-existent crime within the gates of the Las Vegas Country Club Estates. If that doesn't prove to you that indeed gated communities are a deterrent I'm not sure what to tell you at this point.

[vtvette]

Originally Posted by LV10101

von949...well I guess that cop that was parked at the gate needs some more training. Not only do all emergency responders have access codes to gated communities but the dispatcher also has these codes.

Metro doesn't even respond to a traffic accident unless there is bodily injury or threat of bodily harm. Best of luck getting them to wait around while dispatch provides them with a code to a gate. Sorry, if it's anything other than an emergency call in a gated community you're on your own.

Originally Posted by LV10101

Sorry you are grasping at straws in attempt to prove something the crime statistics say otherwise.

What "crime statistics"??? PLEASE provide ACTUAL STATISTICS to prove your point! Can you provide a single case study or, example of factual research to prove your point?? Anyone can find a neighborhood here and there to prove a point one way or the other. We're talking gated vs. non-gated communities as a whole, not your particular community. You stated that a gate provides a deterrent to crime which is statistically not true. I can and will happily provide dozens of examples of in depth case studies that prove gates provide no added security compared to non-gated community.

Originally Posted by LV10101

I'm going based on Las Vegas crime reporting as of right now 2015...not a report from 1998, sorry.

Where is this crime report that proves as of 2015 gates provide a measurable deterrent against as compared to the report performed in 1998? I'd love to read it.

[von949]

Originally Posted by LV10101

von949...well I guess that cop that was parked at the gate needs some more training. Not only do all emergency responders have access codes to gated communities but the dispatcher also has these codes. Sorry you are grasping at straws in attempt to prove something the crime statistics say otherwise. Please go look at the amount of crime in the area surrounding the Las Vegas Country Club Estates then look at the almost non-existent crime within the gates of the Las Vegas Country Club Estates. If that doesn't prove to you that indeed gated communities are a deterrent I'm not sure what to tell you at this point.

Some properties change gate codes on a monthly basis or whenever compromised...or they just get stuck which my wife has seen plenty of times.(but anyway)

I am not grasping at anything. I already stated earlier that there are pros and cons of both situations. I have lived in gated communities before and could easily live in them again if we found something we liked. My personal preference is non-gated. But honestly it doesn't matter to me. I post both sides of just about everything we debate in this forum. Why? Because we have hundreds to thousands of people interested in these local topics that we discuss. My inbox fills up with questions or comments because of a what us is locals post.

Sometimes I am just a "proxy" for others who don't post often on this forum.

"What happens during emergencies? Do all emergency vehicles have a master code?"

I ask a question=You get defensive. And now I know why I receive comments or DMs instead of someone just posting openly on the forum.

[Raiderman]

Originally Posted by LV10101

First, I never said it reduces crime by a "measurable difference". Again it's a DETERRENT. Second, I'm going based on Las Vegas crime reporting as of right now 2015...not a report from 1998, sorry. Third, I will give you one example...the Las Vegas Country Club. Please look at the crime on the inside of the Las Vegas Country Club and then look at the surrounding neighborhoods...sorry but it clearly is lower in the gated community.

Furthermore to say the majority of police dislike gated communities is a generalization, no matter 1998 or 2015.

Again it is a clear deterrent to crime, not sure what more I can say.

Or you can compare the LVCC to my non-gated community, and I would guarantee you that my neighborhood is safer. In the past calendar year, we had 1 noise complaint, and one burglary within a 3 block radius of my house.

That is the fallacy of pointing out that one specific gated neighborhood is safer than another, therefore, all gated neighborhoods are safer than all others.

Is a guard at a gate a deterrent? I would assume so. Do guard-gated communities appear more affluent? Sure. Would burglars rather steal expensive things, thus making those homes more of a target? I would hazard a guess that is true. How many burglaries have there been in LVCC this past year? That is really the only crime that a guard-gated community should have a lower rate of, as assault, murder, etc, is most often committed by a person whom you know, often in your house, so a guard at a gate a quarter mile away will have no impact on that.

[LV10101]

Originally Posted by vtvette

Metro doesn't even respond to a traffic accident unless there is bodily injury or threat of bodily harm. Best of luck getting them to wait around while dispatch provides them with a code to a gate. Sorry, if it's anything other than an emergency call in a gated community you're on your own.



What "crime statistics"??? PLEASE provide ACTUAL STATISTICS to prove your point! Can you provide a single case study or, example of factual research to prove your point?? Anyone can find a neighborhood here and there to prove a point one way or the other. We're talking gated vs. non-gated communities as a whole, not your particular community. You stated that a gate provides a deterrent to crime which is statistically not true. I can and will happily provide dozens of examples of in depth case studies that prove gates provide no added security compared to non-gated community.



Where is this crime report that proves as of 2015 gates provide a measurable deterrent against as compared to the report performed in 1998? I'd love to read it.

I think I have made it clear that you can go on a crime mapper system and clearly see a difference in crime between gated and non-gated areas. I'm not just saying the Las Vegas Country Club...even if that is a clear example.

There are other examples of "gated" areas that are gated for a deterrent...many of the Las Vegas schools have fences and locked gates. These gates are used as a deterrent to keep people off of school property who do not belong there. There are many businesses that have gates/fences around their property...why if as you say it doesn't act as a deterrent?

I do security profiles of businesses often and the thought gates/fences don't act as a deterrent quite frankly is ridiculous. Please go ask any Metro Officer if they think a gated community is a deterrent.