Closest train to NYC from Lehigh Valley (Philadelphia, Washington: hotels, neighborhood)
Lehigh ValleyAllentown-Bethlehem-Easton
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The second issue was, as PacoMartin mentioned, Pulaski Skyway. Although the road was clear for us, we saw on the other side a wreck blocking one of the two lanes. The other side quickly turned into a parking lot. I wouldn't want to risk getting stuck on that bridge for an hour.
So although this trip worked out fine for us, I think I'll try Harrison, Maplewood, or Summit next time.
The Pulaski Skyway was completed about 5 years after the Model T went out of production, so the dominant car on the road was the model A. It is just risky. It could be fine one minute and a nightmare the next. You can point out that modern roads sometimes come to a standstill, but there are usually more options for clearing accidents.
The Harrison option should be more attractive in about 2 years. The reason is that the World Trade Center is now on it's 3rd temporary station since 9-11 at the World Trade Center. If all goes according to plan in 2 years the Downtown Transportation Center will be completed. The transition will be all underground to any one of 12 subway lines will mean you can easily move on to Chinatown, Little Italy, Penn Station, Times Square, Battery Park, Herald Square, etc. The fare is scheduled to go from $2 to $2.50 each way.
As far as driving through the Lincoln or Holland Tunnel into the city, I would use the following criteria. Parking is very scarce and expensive in downtown Manhattan, so I would not use the Holland Tunnel unless you know you have a space. The Lincoln Tunnel may make sense if you have enough people, and everything is within walking distance of a parking space.
Generally speaking a PATH train runs 24 hours, about 150 times per day. A normal subway is the same price and runs 24 hours, usually about 240 times per day. I sort of feel if you've reached a PATH station you are in the urban core, and even better connected than on Staten Island.
Speaking of, the 25 minutes 5 mile Staten Island Ferry is FREE. Now it will cost you tolls and parking to go that way, but to many people that is a scenic way to come into Manhattan with nice views of the Upper Bay, the Statue of Liberty, Governor's and Ellis Island. If you want the leisurely commute, you can go that way. If I plug it into Google Maps it is about 10 miles further than driving to Harrison, and the Interstates are a lot less busy.
I think I mentioned my reason in the OP, I just don't drive in NYC. The drivers there don't signal, they ride your bumper and they swerve in and out of lanes at will. It's like a HS parking lot with all permit drivers. Even with a GPS, it's disconcerting and extremely stressful. I am fine navigating, and do that. This may not make sense to someone that is familiar with the area, but that's just how it is. Everyone has something that they find extremely distasteful doing, and for me, driving in NYC and Boston are two of them. I LIKE riding the train and doing that turns the whole trip into an enjoyable outing as opposed to a stomach turning chore.
I kind of remember feeling that way when I was a teenager, but the driving there is something you adjust to rather quickly. There's a rhythm to it. It has nothing to do with the people being especially bad drivers. It's not a big deal if someone chooses to take various mass transit options and park in Jersey somewhere once a year or so, but anyone who does - or wants to - go into NYC from Pa with more frequency would be doing themselves a favor by learning how to deal with it.
I kind of remember feeling that way when I was a teenager, but the driving there is something you adjust to rather quickly. There's a rhythm to it. It has nothing to do with the people being especially bad drivers. It's not a big deal if someone chooses to take various mass transit options and park in Jersey somewhere once a year or so, but anyone who does - or wants to - go into NYC from Pa with more frequency would be doing themselves a favor by learning how to deal with it.
I would much rather drive in NYC than in Boston. At least in NYC you usually know where you are, and the one way streets are easier to figure out. NYC drivers may be aggressive, but Boston drivers seem to believe that making eye contact is a sign of weakness.
Buses are $43.05 round trip or $31.75 round trip if you go 5 times in 30 days. The buses take advantage of the Bus Lanes through the tunnels for most of the rush hours. Bridge tolls are $12 in cash ($9.50 in EZ-Pass) and you could pay as much as $6.50 depending on which roads you drive on in NJ. Throw in the price of 6-8 gallons of gas + parking costs, and it is usually easier for 1 person to take a bus.
I've just read many news articles and blogs complaining that parking downtown is almost impossible unless you are an employee of the City of New York.
I kind of remember feeling that way when I was a teenager, but the driving there is something you adjust to rather quickly. There's a rhythm to it. It has nothing to do with the people being especially bad drivers. It's not a big deal if someone chooses to take various mass transit options and park in Jersey somewhere once a year or so, but anyone who does - or wants to - go into NYC from Pa with more frequency would be doing themselves a favor by learning how to deal with it.
I agree that if you want to drive into NYC then you should absolutely figure that out, but I don't want to drive in NYC. When we go into the city, it's generally an all day 12 hour thing. The last thing I want to do is drive 2 hours with one hour being in city traffic after spending the whole day running around, just so I can say that I can. And I disagree about the bad drivers. People that don't use turn signals and weave in and out of traffic ARE bad drivers and that seems to be the norm there.
It's been my experience that people who grow up in an environment of dense and chaotic traffic (i.e. large cities) tend to have less formal, polite driving styles than people who grow up elsewhere. Some people characterize this difference as bad vs. good driving; others think of it just as a difference of regional style. I happen to think that you don't really know what bad driving is until you've been to Africa (e.g. Cairo, Lagos), but I think we can agree that it's perfectly valid to be uncomfortable driving in a region whose style is more aggressive than your own and to want to avoid that when practicable.
Last edited by alexiskai; 06-25-2012 at 05:51 PM..
It's been my experience that people who grow up in an environment of dense and chaotic traffic (i.e. large cities) tend to have less formal, polite driving styles than people who grow up elsewhere. Some people characterize this difference as bad vs. good driving; others think of it just as a difference of regional style. I happen to think that you don't really know what bad driving is until you've been to Africa (e.g. Cairo, Lagos), but I think we can agree that it's perfectly valid to be uncomfortable driving in a region whose style is more aggressive than your own and to want to avoid that when practicable.
Good point. I have seen scarier driving in China where many drivers were new to it and in the rural areas it involved swerving around water buffaloes pulling carts! I was very glad that we were not allowed to drive there!
It's been my experience that people who grow up in an environment of dense and chaotic traffic (i.e. large cities) tend to have less formal, polite driving styles than people who grow up elsewhere.
In 1908 the first trains from NJ under the Hudson began carrying passengers after Teddy Roosevelt threw a switch in the WhiteHouse. Population of Manhattan was 2,331,542 in 1910. Train passengers peaked in 1927 when the Holland Tunnel began carrying cars under the Hudson. Manhattan dropped to 1,428,285 residents in 1980 and has returned to 1,585,873 in 2011.
In October 2010 Gov. Chris Christie killed the multi-billion-dollar Hudson River commuter train tunnel, aborting the nation’s biggest public transit project as well as the state’s decades-long quest to double rail capacity to New York.
Sooner or later the 85 year old Holland Tunnel will require major work to continue to operate. While it is unlikely that Manhattan will return to it's population of 2.33 million a century ago, the 34 million vehicles that use the Holland Tunnel a year mean the city is at significant risk from terrorism attack. Theoretically, it is fairly easy to blow up a tunnel with a vehicle full of the right kind of explosive.
Vehicle traffic (both ways) through the Lincoln Tunnel is 40 million per year, and George Washington Bridge is over 100 million.
It's much harder to blow up a train tunnel since it is obviously much harder to board a train with hundreds of pounds of explosive.
Those of us who travel to Europe see how much more humane a city center can be with severely reduced automobile traffic and large pedestrian areas or people using public transportation.
I think you will see the day very soon, that it will be illegal to drive a vehicle with one occupant into Manhattan.
Well, we ended up going to NYC from........Summit! Yes, it may have been more costly, and I may indeed try Journal Square or Harrison in the future, but I really didn't want to drive much closer to the city. We ended up returning late at night, and I was glad not to have to drive any further then I did.
We did at first try Maplewood but there was absolutely NO parking for non-residents or for longer then four hours available anywhere. We circled and wound our way around the town to no avail. So then we decided to go to Summit, but look at Millburn on the way but there was no parking in Millburn. Summit did have a good size parking garage. The train ride was very pleasant. We had a good day in the big city. Saw the Jon Stewart show and then went to my favorite Italian restaurant afterwards. The "kids" were all very appreciative of the trip and the train was a money saver - for them anyway.
I didn't see this thread until after the fact, but Dover (up on I-80) and somewhere along the NJT Northeast Corridor Line, like Metropark, would have also been viable options for direct service to NY Penn Station. Summit is probably the best option though.
Not that it matters, but if I (still) lived in the Lehigh Valley, I'd probably use Trans-Bridge from Bethlehem or possibly Bieber Tourways from Hellertown (I-78/PA 412 park-and-ride lot) over driving to an NJT commuter rail station. The Port Authority Bus Terminal can be more confusing than Penn Station though.
I would much rather drive in NYC than in Boston. At least in NYC you usually know where you are, and the one way streets are easier to figure out. NYC drivers may be aggressive, but Boston drivers seem to believe that making eye contact is a sign of weakness.
Buses are $43.05 round trip or $31.75 round trip if you go 5 times in 30 days. The buses take advantage of the Bus Lanes through the tunnels for most of the rush hours. Bridge tolls are $12 in cash ($9.50 in EZ-Pass) and you could pay as much as $6.50 depending on which roads you drive on in NJ. Throw in the price of 6-8 gallons of gas + parking costs, and it is usually easier for 1 person to take a bus.
I've just read many news articles and blogs complaining that parking downtown is almost impossible unless you are an employee of the City of New York.
The Financial District is practically impossible, but north of there to maybe 23rd Street is mostly a matter of patience. During the day, the key is to find streets that are emptied of cars for street cleaning, and swoop in immediately when they open back up. Later on, loading and unloading zones that subsequently open up for regular parking are a godsend. Of course, the latter isn't all that good for overnight parking unless the reg is suspended on Sundays.
The Financial District is practically impossible, but north of there to maybe 23rd Street is mostly a matter of patience. During the day, the key is to find streets that are emptied of cars for street cleaning, and swoop in immediately when they open back up. Later on, loading and unloading zones that subsequently open up for regular parking are a godsend. Of course, the latter isn't all that good for overnight parking unless the reg is suspended on Sundays.
From an article in USA Today written in summer of 2011.
Midtown Manhattan median daily parking rates at $41,
Honolulu at $38 and
Boston at $34
Chicago $32;
downtown Manhattan and Los Angeles ($30);
San Francisco, San Diego and Philadelphia ($26); and
Seattle ($24).
So for my trip last month for 4 people that was $16 (4 * $4) for PATH trains, and $11 for parking. So the estimate would be $30 parking + $12 for Holland Tunnel.
I would be hard pressed to pay $18.50 per person for train from Summit.
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