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I belong to another board, mostly news and current events. Periodically we are beset upon by trolls who attack others for sake of either creating a ruckus and destroying the board, or who are so bitter that they have to spread the bitterness like a contagious disease.
I've followed your posts since coming to the board and have found them interesting, insightful and well written. Don't let a troll with an agenda get your goat.
I agree. JrProfess, don't let someone who is angry with the situation they are in steer you away from the rest of us who appreciate an actual conversation.
In another thread you admit to taking out your anger on the board. You're frustrated by your situation, that's understandable. Lose the anger, let's 'talk'. Not to insult you, but the hostility drips from your post and honestly, it makes you look like jealous -- you probably aren't, but it reads that way, sorry. You went to college, have the debt and a sheepskin. Did someone tell you that you were going to make the big bucks right out of school? We all have to pay our dues. It stinks.
No .. no one told me I'd be making big bucks out of school. I didn't expect too and I don't expect to be living in a McMansion, large house or waterfront property. But, like that other poster said .. something that really equates to what income I mkae would be nice.. how about 2000 squ feet instead of 1000 sq ft.
You bet I'm angry.. and it's about time that LI'r's GET angry .. angry at the pathetic situation we live in. Pick up the paper and read how special districts are spending $3000 to landscape their property with a stupid waterfall and other school districts are hidign money from taxpayers and claim to need more while the families on this island can't survive on $100K a year! It's pathetic. So yes.. I am EXTREMELY angry.. I'm angry at the direction the place I was born and raised has gone too. Perhaps that anger and frustration drips through.. that's good.. because then people will get it!
You can make a point without having to attack the other point. This isn't a debate in school; this is reality. You can write whatever you want at me, and it won't bother me. I did what I had to do to make it where I am without complaining when things were hard, times tough and money tight. I would hug my little one when I was getting down and remember why I was struggling. Debates are about attacking each others view and countering that.. You feel that LI is great..I'm showing others how it's not. . I also said you and others have a right to feel that it's so great.. but they need to give a CLEAR picture of why they feel it's so great. In your case, you've lived here a long time.. in a different time where you're house was a lot less and you are sitting on equity.. but if you had to buy your house at todays prices you probably wouldn't be a ble too.. and then you'd see why you're waterfront home is now upper middle class as far as prices are concerned. Maybe you're not and haven't been.. but your house is now. It's VERY important that rather than just painting a rosey picture of LI the middle income family NEEDS to undertsand EXACTLY what they are walking into. I believe my post will show them JUST that.
I have a very good idea of what people sacrifice to stay here; I've had to do without a lot to get to where I am. It was a temporary problem that has since passed. Please show me in my post where I 'lumped' you in with the idiots who abused their home's equity. I never, ever wrote that. Please go back and review it. You are upset about your circumstances and are taking things a tad too personally. The problem is no longer temporary. Yeah.. my parents made sacrafices too because LI was expensive.. but it has gotten WAY out of hand. This isn't about a temporary sacrafice.. what this is is already sacraficing, covering ONLY basic bills and as the rate of the cost of living constantly increases here at a faster pace than salaries there is nothing temporary about that! Secondly I never said in my posts that you lumped me into that category.. what angers me is that you lumped EVERYONE into that category.. and only take me OUT of that equation because I got so angry. Your statemetn was as plain as the nose on your face .. you said they, meaning those that are struggling or those that are in this ARM mess... need to have their Mcmansions , luxury cars and big screen tv's . YOU generalized.. instead of acknowledging the fact that it is hard to make it here you blame that fact on the fact that people who are in my position are in that position out of consumer greed and that couldn't be further from the truth. Yes, i take that very personally .. becasue I SEE how hard others like myself struggle to live here and what they sacrafice to be here and for you or anyone to say and assume that it's because of what statement you made is just plain wrong.
Having a waterview from my home does not mean I have an upper class income. Anyone who works hard can have almost everything they want -- as long as they can afford it -- but not at the expense of ruining something for others. Making an illegal (illegal - against the law) apartment in a single family home is picking away at the character of a neighborhood of single family homes. When the day comes and you own your own single family home (be it here or elsewhere) you will understand what those of us who oppose illegal apartments are writing. First.. I own my single family home.. so the day has arrived. I certainly do not begrudge my neighbor, who rents out a protion of their house to help make ends meet. How does it take away from the character of the neighborhood.. you wouldn't even notice if you didn't look hard enough. I've also been one of those renters.. how did I destroy the feel of the neighborhood.. because there was 1 extra car in the street!! yeah.. it destroys the look of the neighborhood if the tennant is a slob, is noisy or a house is overcrowded.. but again, most people renting out their house do it with one tennant or a young couple (no kids) living in their basement or upstairs apartment. Usually these people are single or right ouf of college. My single girlfriend lives in one and my other friend, with two kids, also rents out their basement apartment. It doesn't detract from the neighborhood at all. That is a myth. And you dont' find that in homes in the more upper class or upper middle class neighborhoods like a Roslyn say. You find it in Middle class neighborhoods.. becasue that's what people have to do to survive here. If you say " well then don't buy your house if you have to rent it out to survive" you'll find mots of your homes in your middle class neighborhoods empty! And what's really funny.. these people so worried about the character of the neighborhood are more worried about something that won't really and hasn't really affected the character of their neighborhood, but are okay wiht banks throwing families out of their homes in the foreclosures waive. Talk about ruining a neighborhoods character. A boarded up foreclosed home is the WORSE damage taht can be done to any block and quickly drives down the value of the neighbors house. There so quick to say "let the banks foreclose" rather than stand behind the fact that the government is trying to find a solution to a huge crisis facing these people and the economy as a hole. Yeah.. a lot of mistakes were made on all sides..but now it needs to be fixed in a way that doesn't destroy neighborhoods. It's like they want to cut off their nose to spite their face. The only reason I don't rent out my upsairs is becasue I need the space to run my business that I run from my home (and no I don't have a consumer in and out of my house type business)
As for the family "struggling' on $100K:
$100K per year after taxes might be about $6200/month.
Let's say this couple finds a house for $400K. w/ $8K taxes They negotiate it to $375K, putting down 25K and setting aside $10K for closing. a 30 year mortgage @ 5.75% is $2043/mo, taxes $667/month and insurance about $125/month for a total of $2,835. That leaves the $100K couple with $3365 after paying the mortgage & escrow. That's liveable. They opt for an occasional pizza instead of dining out, don't buy the deluxe Cable package, lease a modest car. Forget credit cards. The mortgage interest will make for a nice tax deduction. At tax return time -- use it to buy furniture. AGain.. you don't know.. because you're not that couple. Your forgetting somethign.. Car insurance.. is the person self employed.. cause then there's health insurance (and if he's not a portion of his 100K salary will be taken out for health insurance.. though small ). Then there's heating the house.. My small Levitt house with the thermostat constantly on between 60 - 65 (we wear sweaters to conserve heat) with a NEW efficient boiler cost me $340 in the month of December alone!! Electric. $175/month alone. If you have two cars you could be paying about $300 or more a month.. and you NEED 2 cars in a house especially if both parents are working. And car insurance, health insurance is more expensive in this area than in others. Then groceries.. you can spend about $100 - 150 / week if you are a family of 2 adults and 1 small child (cause small children don't eat much) .. more if you have more kids. You can get the basic cable package with the phone for about $100/month. Let's just say that my BASIC bills (and bills are NOT out of line or accessive) is about $6500 - $7000/month. I spoke with a housing counselor and my budget is NOT out of line.. what is are the housing costs I'm paying.. again.. Cost of living!!! There's also gas.. how much do you need to drive to get to work? If you commute there's the LIRR.. i have no idea what the monthly tickets are up to but they are pretty dang pricey.. and then there's always other things that pop up when you have little ones. See how quickly basic life eats away at that $6200/month. I don't make 100K a year.. but I make between 80 - 90. That's a nice salary.. but it's not enough here. That poster who makes 100K makes it working 2 jobs (cause perhaps on 1 job he'd be making what I make.. maybe a little less). He works those two jobs taking time away from his kids JUST to survive. NOt everyone in every type of job can work a job that pays $80K or more! What happens to those people..should the rent? Where? There aren't enough rentals to go around. this is why the middle class on LI is dissappearing. You are probably a lot older than me and so your circumstances were different. .. but take the job you do at what salary you'd start at doing it today.. then figure out what your house would cost on the market today and then tell me how you would be living?
I know of several families (2 kids in one, 3 in the other) where the income is under $90K. They live near the water, big old houses. And yet they live here and wouldn't change a thing. Our income isn't much higher. So much for the Upper Class classification! That's great for them. I'd like to know..a s well as the others out there, what their secret is. When did they buy their home, etc. If their kids are in H.S, then they purchased a long time ago and fall into your category. Take their salaries today and figure it with a mortgage on what their house is worht today, etc. Watch their kids not be able to find a place to live out of H.S besides with their parents. Their kids will have a hard time like the rest of us born and bread..unless the parents leave them the home and the kids spend their life livign with their parents.
When we bought my home we wanted a disaster north of 25A with taxes under 5K. It took over a year, but we spread the word and drove through the area every week looking for FSBOs and meeting RE agents. We stuck to our guns and got it. Behind me, the man pays $10K. Across from me they pay $12K. The lesson is buy OLD = low taxes. Buy fixer upper. The waterview is a perk I wasn't expecting. Many families took a lot of time looking for homes.. only to find out how little they get for their money.. don't think these people didn't do exactly that. They ended up moving BACKWARDS from where their parents were to afford a house.. a much smaller house. I bought a fixer upper.. most young couples bought a fixer upper.. my taxes on my levitt hosue are about $7000 a year and climbing.. that is for a SMALL levitt house. Again..your hinting at the fact that those struggling bought new large houses in your statement.. if that's whaty ou meant or not, that's not how you came across. Most home sales on LI are resales. Mine was a dump that needed to be gutted and still cost me over $350K.. then add in the money I put in in work!! OUCH! How long ago did you buy your house? Because I bet then $5K was pretty pricey taxes.
While waiting to buy, we lived in a 400 sq ft cottage; 3 people and several large dogs. DH & I both worked, DS was in daycare. It was a family sacrifice. We carpooled to work, which for me meant 2 hours more on my day. We saved on gas. We worked weekends and family watched my child then. It was hard. I cried and missed my DS but knew that when all was said and done, he would have a room of his own in our own house. How do you know a couple today hasn't made similar sacrafices? They have and are continueing too.. yet either purchasing STILL eludes them or they have purchased and watched their little nest egg get eaten away by teh outrageous cost of living.
I was't looking to impress anyone. I was looking to be happy. %$*!# the Joneses. AGain.. are you assuming that all who are struggling are out to impress.. I don't think families living in a a "starter home" who are struggling are looking to impress anyone with their modest homes!! I mean come on you make it sound like we're all living in McMansions .. each one trying to be bigger than the next. That is just not true and if you are assuming that that assumption is unfair and is an insult to the struggling family. Perhaps if you drive through Roslyn Country club that can be truel.. but then again.. those people are the rich of LI! Not hte middle class.
What do I like/enjoy about LI? I love the town I live in. Love it. Love the smell of salt air, the rocky beaches, the old homes, the hills, my friends, my community, the historical society, the local park, the walk to my boat. I love a trip to the south shore beaches and surf casting; my car club. I love and enjoy these things. If I moved elsewhere, I couldn't duplicate what I have here. I love these things too.. but at what cost? My sanity! My time wiht my children and my husband.. who we never see because he works non stop to keep it all afloat. It's nice to have beaches and little villages to enjoy.. but what good are they if in order to live here you have to work all teh time which leaves no time to actually stop and smell the fresh salty air or stroll through that little village and visit the historic society. Allthose things are great.. but people need to understand what they will be sacraficing for those little "perks". i didn't have the advantage of being able to look at what LI has to offer than make hte decision "do I want to live here" and "what will I sacrafice to live here". I've grown up here and it has come to the piont that.. this is nice.. but is it worth my health (becaus stress can kill you), my marriage (because finances and not spending quality time can kill a marriage) and my children's financial future (because again "livealble" is nice..but what about having money to put away for college education and retirement.. we forgot to factor that into the mix). AGain.. I've said it before.. IF YOU MAKE 6 FIGURES OR MORE YOU PROBABLY CAN LIVE HERE.. MAYBE NOT ENTIRELY COMFORTABLY.. BUT DO KNOW THAT IT IS VERY EXPENSIVE AND KNOW WHAT THAT RELATES TOO AS COST BEYOND MONETARY. You'll enjoy it if you're not struggling to survive here.. but if you have to struggle to enjoy what LI offers, it's so not worth it. There are beautiful places elsewhere in the country that are near beautiful bodies of water, or have historic societies and quaint towns/ villages .. that have a lot of fun recreation things to offer, as wellas good education for your children at about 1/3 the taxes and you'll get more house for your money. Your hard earned money will travel much further elsewhere. If NYC proximity is what you want, then it's the price you have to pay (it's kind of funny.. everyone talks aobut the proximity to NYC but unless you work in NYC how many of us actually go into the city on a regular enough basis to make it worth the heavy price tag?)
What do I dislike about LI? Congestion in the overdeveloped areas, the malls, the people who feel like they are entitled to everything, bad politics, and the fact that big box stores are taking over (but this is not limited to LI.)
My taxes don't bother me as I bought a house with low taxes and with improvements, they still are low. No McMansion here. Remember that the taxes are overinflated because home values have escalated and school taxes have soared. Everyone wants the best for junior, government mandates programs and doesn't fund them, contracts for teachers, admin and support staff pass every year. BOOM! UP goes the taxes. Over 65% of my tax bill is school taxes. Someone with an illegal apartment which is occupied by a family with 1 or more children is not paying their fair share to the school district. That's theft of services. Most homes on LI are NOT McMansions .. but are resale homes.. older homes. I know this for a fact. As for overinflated because overinflated housing prices.. well your right there, but you're also wrong. First, taxes will NEVER go down despite the reasoning that prices are comign down so so should your taxes. And here's why. If you remember in Nassau county (don't know about Suffolk) the assesment process was outdated... and so a lot of people had severely UNDERVALUED homes.. So.. nassau fixed that by revamping the assesment proccess. This, in turn, would hvae been a HUGE hit to families as their homes value now was jumped up an enormous amount from the new system (before the boom.. right before the boom actually). SO.. they passed this thing that they capped what % your home taxes can be taxed too. So while a lot of peoples property climbed in the boom there assesed value didn't climb and were still valued LESS than what it had sold for on the market. Mine is an example. I paid $390 for my home the bank appraised it at $450K. Of course I lost value, but basically where the county assesment has now reached will match where my home is market value today (as the prices come down and their assesment climbs up). SO.. I was still paying my $7000 taxes a year at a value that was still significantly less than what it's market value was. So there will be no tax relief there.
Affordability on LI is a multifaceted issue and won't be an easy fix. Constructing multifamily housing in areas zoned for such is a start. AGain.. the not in my backyard issue.. and that would require building of bigger schools so there is not the overcrowding factor.. which.. guess what.. will lead to higher taxes (as if they can go much higher)
Rome wasn't built in a day and this problem won't be solved over night.
Most of the illegal renters onLI are not people with kids.. it's people with kids who go and buy a home (because it's not really a good idea to rent out the basement of a home with kids) and then convert their basement tto rent out otthe single guy./ single girl or young couple that doesn't hvae kids.. There are a few exceptions.. but hten where do you expect that family to live? Maybe they dont' have a very high paying job to afford a legal rental.. or perhaps they are trying to get a cheaper rental to save up the ridiculous amount of money it takes to own a home here.
Yeah.. Rome wasn't built in aday.. but I've been here my whole life and haven't seen it getting better.. only worse! The attitude most LI'rs have is going to keep change from coming.. in order to get taxes in line the SD 's need to be mainstreamed and trimmed..will never happen!! Specila districts eliminnated.. will never happen.. alteast not in my lifetime.. and i don't want to waste my life fighting for a change that will not come and just continue to struggle.
Maybe the change will come when the middle class people, like myself, who have had enough leave and then people look around and things get really bad. Businesses have already gotten the idea about cost of l and have gone to greener ( and more affordable) pastures. Maybe that will wake people up.
Look.. I never insulted any person on this board. I may be angry but i have a right to be as does all the other struggling families here. It's not personal against you or the other guy or anyone.. but it is an emotional issue. AND this board is here so people can look at what life is really like on LI. I'm here to tell them that .. yeah. .there are parks, beaches, perks.. etc..but here is the cost of all that. They better know what they are getting into becaues if the don't they could live to regret their decision. But, if they make it anyway despite what I have to say.. and people will and that's fine, atleast they went in informed.
I am currently involved in a project which is an effort to turn a series of buildings in my area (which are slated for demo) into a multi family affordable rental dwelling. (Tristansmom probably didn't expect to read that from me) The group that I am working with is taking steps with local politicians to obtain grants to get the ball rolling. We do realize that there aren't many options for young people starting out on LI. We don't want illegal rentals in our neighborhoods, so we are attempting to create a grassroots solution. If we are successful, this could be a model for other communities.
I commend your intentions.. I really do and i'm not surprised.. however. watch how difficult it will be to get communities into it.. they'll love the idea utnil they find out it will be in their backyard.... becasue they dont' want to"ruin the character" of their neighborhood.
I do hope it works though.. LI desperately needs it. As for me, I won't be waiting around for it to happen becasue as I do , my son is growing faster than a weed!
Why can't everyone that wants a tenant just have it done right and get an apartment accs done and be legal...
Then there would be no problem, go to the town and do it right just file the paper work and get it done...
Only if it were that simple. It takes work a lot of work to get it done legally. I have done it. And if you are doing in an attempt to "make ends meet" the taxes may defeat the whole purpose.
Only if it were that simple. It takes work a lot of work to get it done legally. I have done it. And if you are doing in an attempt to "make ends meet" the taxes may defeat the whole purpose.
On the other hand, if it's done illegally, you could be putting lives in danger with faulty wiring, overloaded circuits, etc.
Also, if you're getting income every month from an apartment, you should be paying income tax on that as well as the extra property taxes since your tenants are using public services (schools, garbage collection, police, etc) that taxes pay for.
Do it legally and no one can report you and then the 1st few pages of people saying oh a nosey neighbor ratted..... that's like saying you want to cut people up in your basement and you only got caught because a nosey neighbor ratted you out...
C'mon, don't break the law, if everyone broke the law it would be a mess, that's why they're there.
I don't see how it's ok to rent illegally, but robbing a bank to keep up with higher costs makes it wrong...there both the same, both are breaking the law.
But both help with the higher costs
Example, so everyone on the block gets illegal rentals going and then there are umpteen cars all over and sanitation goes up because there all throwing out more and it just keeps going.up.. and then my taxes jump 3 fold and you got someone helping you and that is part of the problem of why we are paying more...
umm, Tristansmom, could you please make your posts a little shorter, it gets real old having to scroll through all of your posts to get to the next one. Thanks!
Do it legally and no one can report you and then the 1st few pages of people saying oh a nosey neighbor ratted..... that's like saying you want to cut people up in your basement and you only got caught because a nosey neighbor ratted you out...
C'mon, don't break the law, if everyone broke the law it would be a mess, that's why they're there.
I don't see how it's ok to rent illegally, but robbing a bank to keep up with higher costs makes it wrong...there both the same, both are breaking the law.
But both help with the higher costs
Example, so everyone on the block gets illegal rentals going and then there are umpteen cars all over and sanitation goes up because there all throwing out more and it just keeps going.up.. and then my taxes jump 3 fold and you got someone helping you and that is part of the problem of why we are paying more...
I was not saying it was right. I am just saying it may defeat the purpose of the person renting part of the house in the first place.
Also even if everyone did it legally you would still have the car problem.
Lastly renting illegally is not the same as robbing a bank. You can make your point (and I do see it) without making silly claims. By your standard j-walking, murder, and speeding are all equal because they are all breaking the law. All laws are not equal.
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please shorten your posts
