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Sustainable construction: I know the Willy St. Co-op market has a cob wall out back, which was partly put in as a demo of how that kind of construction works and holds up in the Midwest. I'm sure they'd have contact information for other people with similar interests. I live in Upstate NY now (where the climate is similar) and have some friends with very similar building goals to you. I think they're leaning towards strawbale. So it's definitely do-able.
Rainbarrels won't get a second look, especially in the near east/Willy st. neighborhood that MidwesternBookWorm mentioned, though if the season is wet you'll want to be careful of hosting mosquito hatching grounds. West Nile virus shows up from time to time in the area, which is an extra reason for caution.
I never had someone knock on my door, but I lived in apartment buildings. I occasionally saw young Mormon missionaries on the bus, but that's about it. There are plenty of religious people of all stripes in town, but getting witnessed at is incredibly rare.
All in all, I think that Madison sounds like a perfect location for you and your family, politically, climate-wise, and in terms of interests. It's not an exceptionally cloudy region (a typical winter day is clear, dry, and COLD), but there's a good balance. Congrats on the job, and welcome!
Thank you for the no preaching plaque info...that will be money well spent. I always feel so bad having to ignore people at the door or allow them to talk only to ask them to leave me alone. *sigh* I want to be friendly but then again, I think it is really rude to just go knocking on doors to save souls or sell souls or what have you...
It's funny you mention upstate NY having a similar climate, as the hubby applied for a job there in the fingerlakes region (we haven't heard back from them yet though, Madison was his first offer to come in that we have considered).
Strawbale does tend to work better in climates that experience snow, it is amazing for insulation and soundproofing. The only concern for it is to make sure there is no moisture that leaks inside of it, otherwise, your house walls would mold and start rotting - never a good thing - though it happens with traditional wood houses all the time (and no one thinks much of it).
In reply to the other poster about the packed earth homes, I'm curious as to why they would be costly? From all cost estimates, it appears that sustainable construction ranks right up there in cost as traditional, except it is MUCH more energy and resource efficient. We also are very lucky to have some hookups, I had a buddy from high school who is an architect and dabs in sustainable homes, and my hubby is a physicist with a lot of electrical engineering background - and he is working on alternative energy generation. Whatever home we eventually manage to build, I definitely plan on helping others and inspiring them to build their own as well.
Sorry, I ramble about environmental things...people around here roll their eyes at me when I start taking cloth diapers and mud homes. *sigh* One more reason I do not belong in OC, CA.
I was VERY happy to see you have a Trader Joe's in Madison! That is my favorite place to shop...we live synthetic free in our house...that store is my staple food supply. Whole Foods, Sprouts, and Henry's are alright - but you cannot trust everything they sell, I've never found a bad ingredient on a trader joe's food item (now household and bath is another story, but I can still buy those things online just as always and offset the carbon print for shipping).
It is going to be so nice to have rain, we've had all of 10 inches here in the past 5 years probably. It is horrible. And these people are so wasteful too, they leave their sprinklers on, watering the concrete, for hours in the middle of the day. And it is ALL grass, that they don't even use or play in, such a waste. I'm hoping to create a landscape where we can grow our food and also make it look nice - plus I want to be able to have our little boys be able to play in it! I'm actually getting VERY excited at the prospect of having a new canvas to paint on (figuratively speaking, although I guess the walls in the house could be taken literally)! LOL
I went to Madison on google maps and took the little street guy and randomly dropped him in neighborhoods to see what they looked like. I really did NOT like the western surburbia with the cookie cutter houses in rows. Yuck. I also did not like directly east of the isthmus, the neighborhoods looked rundown. Of course, I really liked all the trees and hilly look to the places just west of the University, of course, $350k is just a tad out of our price range, LOL. My hubby was offered a post doc position at UW (a lot less than they are offering him to work here in CA - about half as much...but who cares about money as long as you can raise your family in a place that goes with your values and beliefs). The mortgage calculator says we have to stay under $250k.
With that in mind, can anyone give me some specific streets/neighborhoods to look at. I read the linked threads to areas of Madison and what they are each like, I definitely do not want to be in a "keeping up with the jones" neighborhood, but I also don't want to be living in the run down area where you don't want to walk outside at night with your babies. We'd like to buy off the bat, but that is just because we have spent our lives in condos at this point and I AM DYING TO PAINT A WALL SOMETHING OTHER THAN WHITE! I need some red, or blue, or brown...and ya just can't paint rentals. I think we're going to try to get a very short term rental (3-6 months) in a house when we move there, then explore the areas to determine where we would fit best. Any suggestions on where to locate available rentals? Or suggestions for areas to look at or avoid for rental houses? Also, how much does rent on a 3 bedroom house run there (I'm hoping you say less than we're paying now - $1600/month for 900 sq ft - 2 bd)
His position should be for 3 years, and if he isn't hired on permanantly after that, he hopes to start his own business there. Does anyone know how entrepreneur friendly it is there? I haven't read up on WI business laws? Do they have good tax exemptions, etc?
I personally have a dream of opening a eco-shoppe...and if Madison is on the same lines as the other cities I love (San Fran, Austin, and Albuquerque[not the actual place but the art/eco-culture there])...then we might both be able to fulfill our dreams in one place.
A few other questions....in summer, do they chemical spray the air for mosquito abatement there?
Do they salt or gravel the roads in winter? *I'm thinking undercarriage rust*
For those who have lived there, where is your favorite place in the area? *can be a park, restaurant, nature area, anything*
Also, I'd like to drag the google guy onto the map in some neighborhoods with affordable, nice homes with actual character (not cookie cutter). Can anyone give me some sample addresses or streets so I can input them in to check it out? I really like Oak Drive, but something tells me that the people who live in that neighorhood might not be the folks we'd get along with - I probably picked the republican pocket - that seems to be my luck and even more reason I need some guidance :-)
Lastly...you are all helping SO much and I really appreciate it more than I can thank you for! Sending good vibes your way!
Amber
I'm grinning, because your enthusiasm and interest are downright infectious! I'm so glad that you're so eager for this move; all too often, jobs pull people in directions they don't want to go, and it sounds like for you, this is just the opposite.
Since you mention an interest in earth berm homes, I thought you might be interested in this thread from the Tennessee forum: //www.city-data.com/forum/tenne...tennessee.html. The author is a friend I've met through the fora here, and the experiences that she and her husband have had in designing and building their off-grid earth-berm home in the Tennessee mountains are quite compelling. I'll warn you, though, don't start reading unless you have several hours to spare; it goes on for a good long while!
If you like Trader Joe's, be sure to plan a visit to the Willy Street Co-op while you're in town as well. Of the two, I prefer the co-op for most things, and they are pretty militant about their ingredients as well. Of course, that's partially also because the co-op is a lot closer to me than Trader Joe's is, and I feel at home there. I know some folks don't much care for some of the co-op's clientele. There was a very revealing quote in a newspaper article a few years back, before Trader Joe's went into its current location and while the neighborhood was still debating what kind of store they wanted. One nameless resident expressed a desire for "something like Willy Street Co-op, only without the riff-raff."
I noticed your comment that the offer your husband got from the UW was at about half the salary as what he was offered in California, but I'm betting that you won't find yourself sacrificing nearly as much as you might think. Madison's cost of living is pretty high for Wisconsin, but even Madison can't hold a candle to California. You may wind up living a whole lot better here than you expect to.
Neighborhoods... that could be a small encyclopedia. Don't let appearances put you off; the region that I find the most family-friendly and the most welcoming (the Willy Street/Jenifer Street/Atwood Avenue neighborhood) might at first glance seem shabby, but those unpretentious exteriors can hide lovely homes inside. And the people are what truly make the neighborhood, not the bricks and mortar.
For starters, you may wish to spend some time here: Community & Neighborhoods - Residents - City of Madison, Wisconsin, familiarizing yourself with some of the areas of town. There are well over 100 neighborhood associations in Madison, and I think you could get a good idea of what the different areas would hold.
You likely will have no problem finding a 3-bedroom place to rent for somewhere in the $1,100 to $1,200 range, possibly less. And I absolutely concur that renting is *the best* way to start out in a community with which you are not familiar; we rented for our first 6 or 7 months in Madison, and made a much, much wiser choice when we did buy a home than we would have buying immediately. The only potential problem you may encounter is that it can be challenging to find as short a lease term as you describe; most landlords either will not consider anything less than 12 months, or will charge a premium rent for a shorter period. You may wish to look for a sub-lease somewhere, basically finishing out the final few months of someone else's lease, if you are very certain that you'll be ready to buy within a few months.
Your questions about businesses are rather more complex than they first appear. To begin with, there are ALWAYS new businesses starting up here, and entrepreneurs are very common. And a decent number of people here prefer to buy from a local business in favor of the big-box stores -- although the big boxes certainly do a good business, too.
At the same time, it's also probably wise to comment that Madison's City Council has a reputation for talking any new proposal half to death before they decide on it, and they also have a certain reputation for trying to interfere in personal and business lives to an extreme. One of the local papers ran an April Fool's Day piece a few years back that claimed the city council had passed an ordinance outlawing that hallowed Wisconsin tradition, the Friday fish fry, because it caused obesity among citizens, and the sad thing is that I knew people who found the spoof entirely believable. So do plan to spend some time exploring local ordinances (and potential competition from other businesses) before leaping into your own business.
Other questions: chemicals have been used in summers for gypsy moths. Mosquitoes are pretty much just a fact of life here, and I am not aware that the city has ever really tried an eradication program. If we have one of those 10-inch rainfalls, the skeeters get REALLY bad for a few weeks afterward and everyone gripes, but eventually they diminish again.
Winter: yes, salt is a fact of life here. The city uses sand on a lot of side streets, but the main drags get salt, and by late January, you frequently can't tell the color of the car next to you from the accumulation of salt on its paint. Plan to go to the car wash weekly, and always ask for the undercarriage flush from about late October through early April.
My favorite place would be a whole separate post of its own, because there are so many of them! I've monopolized the conversation long enough, so I'll let a few other folks chime in first.
Do try to manage a visit here before making the final decision; reading posts in a forum like this one is a great way to do preliminary research, but there's no substitute for getting your feet on the ground here and trying the place on for size. If you can swing a couple of days up here to just look around, I think it would be very worthwhile.
Good luck, and I hope to see you at the Farmers' Market soon!
Mommy, another good way to familiarize yourself is to spend some time on zillow.com and our local real estate companies websites. You can access arial and street side views on zillow. After you narrow down some neighborhoods of interest, you can look to your hearts content inside actual homes in your price range and desired location.
Thank you, great minds think alike! I've spent the last 3 nights (about 5 hours nightly) on google dropping the streetview guy, finding neighborhoods I liked the look of, and then zillowing them to see what those houses are worth (and if any neighboring ones are for sale), then linking the the local selling realtors websites and doing searches. I'm creating a file of saved images with addresses so I'll be able to point a realtor in the right direction as to what we are looking for. :-) I've got a list of addresses right now of areas I like the LOOK of...maybe I should post those and anyone who is bored can look them up and give me their 2 cents on the areas, if familiar :-) I'm very excited at what I'm finding...what a wonderful city Madison appears to be!
I was raised in Madison, travelled the world and worked in five countries on three continents only to return to Madison five years ago to start a business and raise a family here. I love it! I never knew what I was missing until I got back. Madison is just a great town. Not nearly as liberal politically as it was when I was growing up here, but it's better than a lot of places. The weather is harsh but I've lived in Asia where there were no seasons and I prefer the marking of time with the passing seasons. Hope this helps!
We're accepting the job position sooo....see y'all around Madison! Thanks for ALL of your help and wisdom!!! If you think of anything else, please don't hesitate to email!
Milwaukee...have you ever been to CA? Los Angeles? Orange County? (no, just flying through LAX doesn't count)
To live in this lovely nation of ours, you must have money to feed yourself, your family, and provide shelter. You move where the jobs are. I guess you missed it where I said we have been offered a job there! :-) Although it is true we were offered a job here in OC too...but here are some reasons why that would be a cold day in hell to accept it. LA is full of self-righteous, hypocritical, uncaring, and lazy people who are only looking for others to blame for their extreme shortcomings and lack of responisbility in this world. It is my personal HELL and has been for well over 20 years.
I am EAGER to move to a place in this world where people care about more than just themselves, where there are seasons, and where greater meaning in life can be found than "how much my mercedes cost" and "like, oh my god, do you want to go to the beach and bake ourselves and get skin cancer"...it is just not for us. I think if you took the time to read through all the posts, and IF you actually visited here...you would agree LA is definitely not the best place for us.
IMO...this place is best left for superficial and greedy people who are unconcerned with any matters that do not directly affect their bottom line or outward appearance. As a native here, I've asked hundreds of people who live here why they live here...and the only thing they can ever come up with is "I LOVE THE WEATHER!"....sometimes they also mention the beach. Our beaches are closed so many days out of the year due to raw sewage...of course they only close 1/2 mile and you know what...at that 1/2 mile point, the ocean is full of children playing in the water...it is as if the dynamics of fluid movement and current escape them. And the weather is horrendous...to us at least...you have to be dressed in so many layers to not be freezing in the morning when it is damp and cold (sometimes down near freezing)...but by noon it is hot (think 80s-100s)...and then it gets cold all over again, the winds kick up and down sporadically...it is a mess if you want to leave the house for more than an hour with babies (who cannot regulate their own body temps). I spend half of the outting undressing and redressing them...it would be so much easier to just have a frozen half of the year and warmer half...it is like permanant spring here...it is a mess.
On the allergen front, everything blooms YEAR round...so if you have allergies, you are in for it. Not to mention, there are no native plants left in these parts any longer, nope, just a myriad of mixed plants from all over the world....all blooming....all with different pollens...oh and did I mention they LOVE to kill all the bees here and destroy hives? So that pollen is just all over the place...
I've tried and tried to think of a reason to stay here...excess money doesn't drive us or the doubled paycheck might work...we don't like the weather...the people are as close to satan incarnate as I can imagine...and we really REALLY like to breathe...the smog kinda prevents that here. I looked at the pollution levels in WI and they aren't so hot either, but they aren't banned by the EPA because they are so continuously horrible. Case in point?
Why would anyone want to live in Madison over LA?
BETTER PEOPLE, FRESHER AIR, SEASONS, & A JOB THAT COULD CHANGE THE WORLD :-)
Oh geez....yup right there...I'm sure you can see my annoyances with this place now and my hope that somewhere in this world, hopefully in Madison, there are less self-absorbed mutants than here :-)
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