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While I really don't mind anybody speaking their native language in private situations, I think it is outright RUDE to start speaking a foreign language in a work environment where others cannot understand what you are saying. Are you trying to hide something? That is what it makes me think.
I prefer freedom of speech over comformism any day.
I will gladly fight for freedom of speech in this country.
I also prefer to have the freedom to accept the consequences of my actions, as long as we are in a free and democratic society.
Therefore, if I feel that Spanish in Miami is threatened in any way, I will fight tooth and nail to preserve it.
Honestly, we have not done enough in Miami to assure that Spanish takes its rightful place in the community.
I'd like to do a little what Montréal does, and have all OFFICIAL and PUBLIC signs in Spanish. Right now it's too inconsistent.
People are still afraid to speak Spanish in certain public situations for fear of upsetting the minority Anglos, and also to have Spanish-speaking rights taken away - because let's face it, we are lucky to have gotten this far regarding the Spanish language, but we are always living in the fear that Anglo Unilingualists are going to force us to learn English, and discriminate against us if we choose to speak Spanish (or Italian, French, Portuguese, whatever) in public or the workplace. Anglos are threatening to wipe out our existence! Luckily we are the majority and there's a certain comfort in strength in numbers. We fight a little underground now, even if by sheer numbers it seems we are mainstream, but I maintain that there is not enough official Spanish here.
We need more mainstream Spanish radio stations, TV stations, etc, and we need all public offices to provide all written materials in Spanish if requested. All city government meetings should be officially bilingual with the minutes recorded in both languages.
Miami should become an official bilingual city, that way we can officially admit to the world what we are, and quit trying to hide it.
Universities need to have large quantities of degrees taught in Spanish (like MBA programs taught entirely in Spanish, etc).
In Italy, one of the best business schools offers MBA in English. We need to develop at least 2-3 similar programs here for Spanish.
Finally, we are in danger of destroying the quality of the Spanish here in Miami if we continue to relegate Spanish to a second class seat. The more official our language policy is, the easier it will be to legislate policies that will work to not only preserve and protect Spanish, but it will also help improve Spanish for those of us who have grown up multilingual, but since we lived many years in the States, we don't always speak the language perfectly as someone who was born, raised, and educated in officially Spanish-speaking countries.
Puerto Rico's language policies should serve as a role model for us. They are part of the US, if they can do it, we should be able to carve out a city-state situation here too. Furthermore, anyone who has ever been to Montréal knows this can work. Europeans who live here are quite used to multilinguaism, and they seem to enjoy to live here, for the most part. If Anglos don't like it, there are 49.5 other states they can move to.
In Miami we are the majority. Anglos always tell me that in the States majority rules, well then we need to rule even more intensely than what we already do.
Next fight will be Broward (to liberate our brothers and sisters, of course).[/quote]
Why stop there? Just go right on up the state! It's gonna happen eventually...
Hey Trusses do not use the rantings of a sychopant like this guy Palermo whatever to paint all Hispanics with one stroke of the brush ... none of my Hispanic friends ... I mean NONE would agree with his post .. all his ranting accomplishes is adding more fuel to the fire by pissing off bitter people like you who by your end less posts seems to have issues with all Hispanics ... my wife is Cuban and she would tell Palermo Dude that he is dead wrong as would ALL of my Hispanic friends and colleagues all of who speak excellent English and are well educated professional people and more importantly respect and love the U.S.
While I really don't mind anybody speaking their native language in private situations, I think it is outright RUDE to start speaking a foreign language in a work environment where others cannot understand what you are saying. Are you trying to hide something? That is what it makes me think.
No problem with people speaking their own language either in private situations or even in public .... I mean if a Hispanic family is out at a restaurant for dinner and they chose to speak Spanish among themselves then they are free to do so as we live in a free country ... now in the work place among non speakers of that language ... they should speak English as common courtesy and a means of respect .
Why stop there? Just go right on up the state! It's gonna happen eventually...
If Florida could "relax" its language policy a little further - and on an official scale, many of us would be very very grateful and will probably stay here unconditionally, bringing with us our money, education, and skills that will help make Florida into a more diverse and prosperous economy. I know so many from South America who hesitate because of the language issue, and they are not poor and uneducated. These are people who want to contribute, but do not want to be told what language to speak.
And when I say "staying unconditionally", I mean Florida. I am hopeful that we will make a long-term commitment to this great estado, we will invest, buy homes, consume, pay hurricane insurance, and pay our federal taxes to DC, get involved in the community. It's just a more formalized continuation of what we already do. We will continue to join the military and fight on behalf of the entire nation. I cannot speak for the unlawful ones/cheaters, but many of us want a place where we belong and feel comfortable, and Florida could be that place over the long term. Let's hope the sea levels stay where they are...
Hey Trusses do not use the rantings of a sychopant like this guy Palermo whatever to paint all Hispanics with one stroke of the brush ... none of my Hispanic friends ... I mean NONE would agree with his post .. all his ranting accomplishes is adding more fuel to the fire by pissing off bitter people like you who by your end less posts seems to have issues with all Hispanics ... my wife is Cuban and she would tell Palermo Dude that he is dead wrong as would ALL of my Hispanic friends and colleagues all of who speak excellent English and are well educated professional people and more importantly respect and love the U.S.
How many friends and "educated" coworkers do you have? 2 million? Yeah I thought so. Like you are in position to represent all "Hispanics". I'm glad your wife has an opinion. I disagree with it, just like she disagrees with me. Nobody ever said that all Hispanics agree with me. That's your propaganda, not mine.
Finally, it's pretty stupid of you to make a link between your disagreement of my manifesto to insinuating that you LOVE the US more than me, or that my rant means that I do not love the US. I highly doubt that you LOVE the US more than me - or that you could even compare it the LOVE.
I love the US very much (isn't it clear to you, or are you just a little biased?) But just because I love the US doesn't mean that I have to obey Anglo cultural norms. If you want to do it, be my guest. You are free to do whatever you want, just don't violently assault someone unless you're defending yourself from attack. But acting stupid is perfectly legal and you have that freedom here, obviously.
Me? I enjoy the freedoms we have and will continue to FIGHT for the right to speak Spanish whenever and wherever. If you disagree, it's not really my problem (necessarily). I don't need to soapbox here, I just have to step outside and I get all the support I need.
Finally, your comment about the workplace was rude too. I think it's terribly rude when a coworker complains that he/she cannot understand Spanish, because they refuse to (or cannot) learn at least a little. I think it is so rude to want to take away my right to have freedom of speech to speak Spanish, because your feelings might get hurt, or you feel that it is "courtesy"" as you say - a very subjective defense in my opinion, as Anglos definition of courtesy leaves a lot to be desired.
Its just common sense, common respect for other, common courtesy to speak the language that all can understand. You know what rude is? Its when someone speak in a language that not all can understand, that is rude. Leaving someone out of a conversation just because they don't speak the language, when you can easily speak the language everyone understands, is what is rude. It shows a lack of respect and common courtesy by the ones that don't include everyone in a conversation.
Its just common sense, common respect for other, common courtesy to speak the language that all can understand. You know what rude is? Its when someone speak in a language that not all can understand, that is rude. Leaving someone out of a conversation just because they don't speak the language, when you can easily speak the language everyone understands, is what is rude. It shows a lack of respect and common courtesy by the ones that don't include everyone in a conversation.
And I think it's common courtesy for an Anglo to speak the language of the majority of Miami Dade. If you cannot, at least make an attempt. If you don't make an attempt, you are rude. Like I referred to earlier, I advertise my jobs as bilingual. That way we avoid the freakin' problem altogether, and we can avoid hurting your feelings.
I hope my bilingual job requirements solve the problem of making people feel uncomfortable and relieve me of the subjective burden of having to cater to someone's insecurities or definition of courtesy. GBTUSA for private enterprise.
What usually happens in my neck of the woods, when an Anglo tries to speak Spanish, most of us make a little more effort in speaking English. In the end, we end up making huge compromises for a little effort on your part. But you really should make the first move. Remember, there are some highly qualified professionals that cannot speak English very well - so it works both ways. I teach many of them during business school night classes in a local institution of higher learning, so I know first-hand.
How many friends and "educated" coworkers do you have? 2 million? Yeah I thought so. Like you are in position to represent all "Hispanics". I'm glad your wife has an opinion. I disagree with it, just like she disagrees with me. Nobody ever said that all Hispanics agree with me. That's your propaganda, not mine.
Finally, it's pretty stupid of you to make a link between your disagreement of my manifesto to insinuating that you LOVE the US more than me, or that my rant means that I do not love the US. I highly doubt that you LOVE the US more than me - or that you could even compare it the LOVE.
I love the US very much (isn't it clear to you, or are you just a little biased?) But just because I love the US doesn't mean that I have to obey Anglo cultural norms. If you want to do it, be my guest. You are free to do whatever you want, just don't violently assault someone unless you're defending yourself from attack. But acting stupid is perfectly legal and you have that freedom here, obviously.
Me? I enjoy the freedoms we have and will continue to FIGHT for the right to speak Spanish whenever and wherever. If you disagree, it's not really my problem (necessarily). I don't need to soapbox here, I just have to step outside and I get all the support I need.
Your "manifesto" who are you Karl Marx ..... wow you think real highly of yourself .. do you refer to yourself in the third person as well ?
No I do not have 2 million Hispanic friends , just several from when we lived in Weston and a few here in Parkland .. all wonderful people and also from work ... I work for a division of a Fortune 500 and we have several Hispanic professionals working with us and none would agree with your verbose "manifesto " .
Last edited by Rock Newman; 09-19-2009 at 06:07 PM..
And I think it's common courtesy for an Anglo to speak the language of the majority of Miami Dade. If you cannot, at least make an attempt. If you don't make an attempt, you are rude. Like I referred to earlier, I advertise my jobs as bilingual. That way we avoid the freakin' problem altogether, and we can avoid hurting your feelings.
I hope my bilingual job requirements solve the problem of making people feel uncomfortable and relieve me of the subjective burden of having to cater to someone's insecurities or definition of courtesy. GBTUSA for private enterprise.
What usually happens in my neck of the woods, when an Anglo tries to speak Spanish, most of us make a little more effort in speaking English. In the end, we end up making huge compromises for a little effort on your part. But you really should make the first move. Remember, there are some highly qualified professionals that cannot speak English very well - so it works both ways. I teach many of them during business school night classes in a local institution of higher learning, so I know first-hand.
WRONG .... you are espousing forcing a foreign language on the citizens of a host country , when it is the newcomers who should be learning it and using it ... I do not know what bastion of enlightenment you come from but in my neck of the woods it is called common courtesy . I do acknowledge that most Americans or as you say "Anglos " do not make enough of an effort to learn other languages and it is hurting our competitiveness on a global scale , and can make us look ignorant at times ... but it should be because you want to learn it not because your are forced to do so or want to cater to a group in Miami with an agenda .
Its just common sense, common respect for other, common courtesy to speak the language that all can understand. You know what rude is? Its when someone speak in a language that not all can understand, that is rude. Leaving someone out of a conversation just because they don't speak the language, when you can easily speak the language everyone understands, is what is rude. It shows a lack of respect and common courtesy by the ones that don't include everyone in a conversation.
Respect, courtesy, common sense........ you're speaking about Miami Doggiebus, remember?
Anyhow, people would do that crap to me and start speaking in spanish at work, and I used to hate that. We'd all be talking in Englsih like normal people and then all of a sudden, spanish-spanish-spanish...
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