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I wonder if its because people are using the military as a platform for job training, the work world today is more cut throat than it ever has been since WW2 and alot of young people know that. Alot of young people know that if you just do what ever job the military says to fit the needs of the military you could very well end up being a homeless vet (I am being a little dramtic but its not too far off) because you did not get the proper skills while in and are now 4 years behind your peers in the work world. How may of those homeless vets do you think were ex fighter pilots or air traffic controlers or pharmasits? Probably none. Not all military experience is created equal.
I dont think most of these young people are narsassists but they have a little voice in the back of their head saying if you dont get this cert or have this specific experience or a certian level of securtiy clearance, etc when you come out on the other side your going to be in really bad shape in the civilian world.
Everyone pretty much knows now that the GI bill is only a shadow of what it used to be right after WW2, it will offset some costs but by no means will it prevent a student from having to take on loans.
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Originally Posted by ATCPRO
AF veteran, AF wife, and college professor. First, the "truth" about AF life as discussed here is relative because TRUTH based on personal views. It's the military, which can be an awaking for some and they are likely the ones who need it most.
Second, to attack AF "recruiting" and recruiters because it's a sales jobs is silly. ALL recruiting is the act of highlighting the best features to attract potential employees, students, etc. I "recruit" for my department and school and YES, my goal is to attract qualified students to attend our program. I "sell" my program, why wouldn't I it's a great product and so is the AF. However, it is ultimately the individuals' decision and if they don't do any more research on the topic than listening to a recruiter...well whose fault is that.
Lastly, I think it is important for military recruiters to insure recruits understand they are becoming Airman not air traffic controllers, computer techs, etc. When my recruiter told me and I was listening. I think today, more young men and women tend be self involved and have feelings of entitlement. Which is not in-line with the military view and needs. These individuals are likely the ones who feel they have been lied to.
Overall, I don't think AF recruiters are intentionally lying to "sucker" people in. The AF wants people who will be productive. Lying just increases costs and creates an unprepared military force because they don't have the right people or people who are not committed. I would like to do the research on the success of those who feel lied to both in and out the military.
Went to an Air Force recruiter with my Dad today (Retired T.I.) and he ripped the recruiter's assistant (fresh out of tech school) to shreds. Then proceeded to tell the recruiter that if they even attempted to put me in anything admin related he'd raise hell. Long story short I go back in less than a week to finish my paper work and I'll be at MEPS shortly after. There was no kissing ass the entire time I was there and the recruiter was honest about everything. I qualify for almost every enlisted AFSC so as you can imagine I'm very overwhelmed, but the recruiter made a very good point. For the list I'm bringing to MEPS, he said I'm only allowed to put one medical job, because they're always full. I asked about a few other AFSC's and the others that I want are fairly open. So he said make a list of 8 AFSC's you want and two aptitude areas you'd be okay with, which the aptitude area thing kind of chapped me, but I'll live. Making the list definatley helped me center myself though and figure out what I want. So I would suggest making a list and hoping for the best.
Went to an Air Force recruiter with my Dad today (Retired T.I.) and he ripped the recruiter's assistant (fresh out of tech school) to shreds. Then proceeded to tell the recruiter that if they even attempted to put me in anything admin related he'd raise hell. Long story short I go back in less than a week to finish my paper work and I'll be at MEPS shortly after. There was no kissing ass the entire time I was there and the recruiter was honest about everything. I qualify for almost every enlisted AFSC so as you can imagine I'm very overwhelmed, but the recruiter made a very good point. For the list I'm bringing to MEPS, he said I'm only allowed to put one medical job, because they're always full. I asked about a few other AFSC's and the others that I want are fairly open. So he said make a list of 8 AFSC's you want and two aptitude areas you'd be okay with, which the aptitude area thing kind of chapped me, but I'll live. Making the list definatley helped me center myself though and figure out what I want. So I would suggest making a list and hoping for the best.
So your retired father went into a recruiting office and ripped an active duty Airman to shreds? Someone needs to remind him he's retired and needs to sit down and shut up. He has no authority to rip anyone anymore.
Hoping for the best about sums it up...by the time you know what job you're getting it will the last minute and you'll take it because you've been planing on leaving.
Went to an Air Force recruiter with my Dad today (Retired T.I.) and he ripped the recruiter's assistant (fresh out of tech school) to shreds. Then proceeded to tell the recruiter that if they even attempted to put me in anything admin related he'd raise hell. Long story short I go back in less than a week to finish my paper work and I'll be at MEPS shortly after. There was no kissing ass the entire time I was there and the recruiter was honest about everything. I qualify for almost every enlisted AFSC so as you can imagine I'm very overwhelmed, but the recruiter made a very good point. For the list I'm bringing to MEPS, he said I'm only allowed to put one medical job, because they're always full. I asked about a few other AFSC's and the others that I want are fairly open. So he said make a list of 8 AFSC's you want and two aptitude areas you'd be okay with, which the aptitude area thing kind of chapped me, but I'll live. Making the list definatley helped me center myself though and figure out what I want. So I would suggest making a list and hoping for the best.
I want you to be aware that that absolutely most likely scenario is that you'll get an aptitude area, now one of the 6 jobs you list. Just be aware of that. Then, you're very likely to get a top job choice in basic. Most people end up very happy!
My wife just joined the AF and had a contract of being a Signal Analyst before she shipped. We thought thats the job she was going to get. But like all other new recruits, they had to make a list of 9 other jobs just incase something happens. My wife is very involved in IT and has a degree in it so it makes sense that all 10 jobs she picked were IT or intelligence. She was born in Pakistan and Naturalized Citizen in America when she was 14, we got married when she was 21. I was born in America and just served 6 years in the Army and held a secret clearance. Right now she is in her 4th week at BMT and got a phone call that the person handing jobs their is not giving her the job she had in her contract. In fact, he started going down her list and marked a line through each one saying she can't have all 10 jobs she picked. She started crying right there because she dident know what to do. All of this is because she was from Pakistan. The guy there did not even want to risk it because he thought because of her background she would never get a clearance for the job she wanted. I feel that is unfair. Is this really a thing? And if so, why did no one warn us before hand. We would have done another branch.
The Air Force does not determine who gets a security clearance, OPM does, the Office of Personnel Management. If she can't get clearance in the Air Force, she couldn't get one in any other branch. The recruiter does not know whether or not she'll be denied a clearance, all we can do is try. She may have listed a bunch of friends and family connection in Pakistan. Just being from Pakistan would probably not disqualify her from a clearance, but if she still has a lot of connections to Pakistan, and talks fondly about it to the investigator, has a history of visiting the country, or other factors, it could cause a denial of a security clearance. Pakistan is not exactly Canada... there would be grave concerns with allowing a person with ties to Pakistan access to classified info.
The Air Force does not determine who gets a security clearance, OPM does, the Office of Personnel Management. If she can't get clearance in the Air Force, she couldn't get one in any other branch. The recruiter does not know whether or not she'll be denied a clearance, all we can do is try. She may have listed a bunch of friends and family connection in Pakistan. Just being from Pakistan would probably not disqualify her from a clearance, but if she still has a lot of connections to Pakistan, and talks fondly about it to the investigator, has a history of visiting the country, or other factors, it could cause a denial of a security clearance. Pakistan is not exactly Canada... there would be grave concerns with allowing a person with ties to Pakistan access to classified info.
She had most of her contacts as US Citizens who were born here and even had the investigation started on her a year ago. The only connections she has with people from Pakistan are the people who live here now as US Citizens (mostly her family). She's forced into a predicament to pick something she absolutely does not want to do and already over half way done with basic training. I hear what you're saying, but I think at this point, I'm just going to tell her to drop out and get the Early Departure. This was unforeseen and I don't want my wife suffering for the next 4-6 years in a job she does not like. The recruiter did not explain this to us and we did for good measure, pick 10 jobs just in case which all of them got denied. I just wanted to be sure that this was justified and not some ulterior motive. You may be right as well about her getting denied in any branch by OPM, but I know that in the Army, they check this kind of stuff before you go in. Once you have a contract, that is it. There is nothing else. You can't be moved around like you can in the AF.
She signed a 'contract' before leaving to be a Signal Analyst. We waited a year before she can go to take that to avoid the 'general contract'.Her first choice before joining basic already fell through which was to be a Linguistic. But the second choice was just as good to her as any. Then she had other jobs on this list such as IT Operations, Cyber Surety, ect ect. But all of those did not go through. Now they are offering her to be a cook, a mechanic and another job she does not want. These are jobs they offer immigrants. I just don't really understand it completely but I seen worst happen to people in the military.
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