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I guess for some of the more ignorant members here we need to clear up some things. First of all Corzine isn't a good governor. Nobody said he was. However, he will be MUCH better then Christie. To really decide who to vote for in the upcoming race you need to actually research the issues, something most right wingers refuse to do. I guess it's much easier to keep saying "corslime" and "Carla Katz"
I've already tried to discuss Chris Christie's political views, for example he is pro-amnesty. The only thing the right wingers here say in reply to that is "he isn't corslime." Great to see we have so many educated people in NJ, if anyone could respond to this post using sentences without saying "corslime" and "Carla Katz" i'd consider it a minor miracle.
Christie is also committed to being a one term governor as he explained it. Meaning he will kowtow to no one if it means not getting re-elected. Unlike Corzine, who kowtowed to every union in the state.
You're just echoing partisan talking points. This isn't substantive policy criticism.
It's the nature of investing that you win some, you lose some. The Lehman debacle cost the pension fund about 1% of its assets, during a year when almost any long position in the stock market took double digit losses.
There is a reason that the pension fund needs to buy risky assets -- it is because the employees have been promised substantial retirement packages based on a relatively modest 5% contribution (Corzine raised this to 5.5%) -- this is 1/3 of what you would need to max out a 401k. The pension fund needs to bring in substantial returns to meet this. And to bring in those returns, they need to buy risky investments.
There are plenty of good arguments one can make against the pension system, but complaining about the fact that they buy risky investments, (and trying to manufacture some sort of contrived "scandal" from the investments that lose -- there are bound to be some) is attacking the symptom, not the disease.
btw, what do property tax increases have with Corzine's money management ? It's not his fault that the local governments are even less efficient than NJ's.
since he was the CEO of goldman sachs i would think that he would be MORE likely to know what investments were risky and which investments were not. the fact that they lost millions since corzine was elected is not defensible.
it is his fault that government did not cut their spending enough to avoid a 1 MILLION DOLLAR TAX INCREASE THIS YEAR.
I guess for some of the more ignorant members here we need to clear up some things. First of all Corzine isn't a good governor. Nobody said he was. However, he will be MUCH better then Christie. To really decide who to vote for in the upcoming race you need to actually research the issues, something most right wingers refuse to do. I guess it's much easier to keep saying "corslime" and "Carla Katz"
I've already tried to discuss Chris Christie's political views, for example he is pro-amnesty. The only thing the right wingers here say in reply to that is "he isn't corslime." Great to see we have so many educated people in NJ, if anyone could respond to this post using sentences without saying "corslime" and "Carla Katz" i'd consider it a minor miracle.
if you are talking about amnesty for illegal immigrants, here is corzine's position:
Corzine's panel backs moratorium on raids on illegal immigrants
by Jeff Diamant/The Star-Ledger
Monday March 30, 2009, 9:37 PM
New Jersey's illegal immigrants should be allowed to pay in-state college tuition and obtain drivers licenses, a panel appointed by Gov. Jon Corzine recommended today.
The 35-member commission, convened in 2007 to consider ways New Jersey can better integrate immigrants into society, also called for improving how government social service providers interact with non-English-speaking immigrants and instituting a moratorium on raids by Immigration and Customs Enforcement.
basically we have more spending / but less revenue (especially in light of the pension losses) which is not a winning combination.
See, this is the kind of thing I'm referring to. Besides the usage of "Corslime" (get it ? It rhymes with Corzine, but it has "slime" in it) and some lame fishing expedition, you haven't offered any criticism. In particular, the above includes no substantive policy criticism.
It certainly does. Corslime abused the Open Public Records Act by with holding the emails between him and Katz a powerful union official. He bought the Supreme Court ensuring his win-win and we won't (unless you want to ) discuss AG Milgram ..Corslime's pick for AG who's record has been pathetic (hello Juicy Campus?? How embarrasing for NJ to have our AG wasting taxpayer $$ on that). Her office represented Corslime (along with his team of high priced private attorneys). We taxpayers footed the bill for Milgram's defense of Corslime's fight to keep his emails between him and Katz private. Policy criticism?? Yes..abuse of public moneys for his defense in a private matter and manipulation of OPRA (Open Public Records Act) to shield private conversations between him and his former girlfriend from the public (discussing union matters and maybe that multi million $$$ settlement he gave her when they "broke up"?)
If it does include substantive policy criticism, then what is the policy that you are criticizing, and what is your substantive criticism of it ?
I should add -- it seems that what you have is not a criticism of policy, it is an ethics complaint.
While ethical conduct is a serious issue, it (a) is a separate issue from policy, and (b) in my opinion, it tends to be used opportunistically for partisan reasons (that is, supporters of a given political party are generally more prone to complaining about the ethics of members of the other party).
Last edited by elflord1973; 07-12-2009 at 01:28 PM..
since he was the CEO of goldman sachs i would think that he would be MORE likely to know what investments were risky and which investments were not.
Sure, he knows which investments are risky. Stocks are risky. Treasury bonds and other high grade fixed income investments are not risky.
But what does one do with that knowledge ? The pension system is funded based on the assumption of something like 8% returns (more than the historical average of the stock market). They can't get that without buying risky investments, and they WILL lose money on some of those (especially in a major market downturn).
If you expected Corzine (who doesn't oversee the individual investment decisions of the pension plan) to rescue the pension plan by brilliantly making some insightful stock picks, you have it completely wrong. First, the evidence that anyone can beat the market by picking stocks is very weak. Second, the way to save the pension system is to insist on it being funded properly (by employee contributions) instead of relying on brilliant investment decisions.
Quote:
the fact that they lost millions since corzine was elected is not defensible.
The market downturn has very little to do with Corzine.
There is a reason that the pension fund needs to buy risky assets -- it is because the employees have been promised substantial retirement packages based on a relatively modest 5% contribution (Corzine raised this to 5.5%) -- this is 1/3 of what you would need to max out a 401k. The pension fund needs to bring in substantial returns to meet this. And to bring in those returns, they need to buy risky investments.
Well put. As is illustrated by the GOP love affair with that ditz Sarah Palin, Republicans thrive on meaningless talking points, cliches and fear-induced rants. That is what energizes their base.
Thanks for injecting a few facts into the argument. This Democrat appreciates it
You want a substantive argument against Corzine? His whole term can be summed up by his own words.
Quote:
"I didn't run for public office to be a number cruncher or play Scrooge." -Jon Corzine 2007
We are in a ton of debt that we cant afford to pay back. Everyone is maxed out on taxes in this state. The only option left is to cut spending, but instead of cutting spending, he gives the unions everything they want and then says, "I didn't run for public office to be a number cruncher or play Scrooge." In other words, he is taxing us to the hilt and not being a "scrooge" with OUR money. Well isn't that nice of him.
The platform Christie runs from should appeal to those who are fed up with the cost/size of government and the anti-business nature of the state.
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clarify, not property tax rebates
. Corslime abused the Open Public Records Act by with holding the emails between him and Katz a powerful union official. He bought the Supreme Court ensuring his win-win and we won't (unless you want to ) discuss AG Milgram ..Corslime's pick for AG who's record has been pathetic (hello Juicy Campus?? How embarrasing for NJ to have our AG wasting taxpayer $$ on that). Her office represented Corslime (along with his team of high priced private attorneys). We taxpayers footed the bill for Milgram's defense of Corslime's fight to keep his emails between him and Katz private. Policy criticism?? Yes..abuse of public moneys for his defense in a private matter and manipulation of OPRA (Open Public Records Act) to shield private conversations between him and his former girlfriend from the public (discussing union matters and maybe that multi million $$$ settlement he gave her when they "broke up"?)
