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Funny thing is,I teach in a school with 1,500 students.Almost all of them have at least 2 or 3 siblings.Most of their families have 1 or 2 cars.All of the kids have computers,I phones and expensive clothes.Most of them live in 3 or 4 br apts or houses.
This is in a neighborhood where the official average household income is around $35,000/yr.
Figure that one out.
Simple. Those who live in houses bought them/inherited from someone who bought them when the property values were cheap. Many of these kids rely on a family network, like a Grandma or an uncle or someone to help raise or pay for expenses relating to the kids.
Most can't actually afford the stuff that they buy, and they send their kids to work ASAP to buy their own stuff. This often includes them buying and paying for their own cellphone plans (with their parents names on the account of course). Since they are a dependent, their family's reported taxes are low, many outright work off the books.
Actually this is why you see so many of them freak out at the cost of college and outright give up on attending because they've come to expect that their parents won't help them. Many of the parents say that they'll throw the kids out of the house when they graduate high school, etc.
That being said, if this family of 7 showed up here and lived in the hood, yes, they could scrape by, but many of the families living in the hood now are moving down south to the Carolinas or Georgia or Texas because everything is so cheap down there. Why someone would follow the opposite flow is a bit of a mystery to me.
Public housing was created for working class and middle class people, actually, so it wouldn't be like this hypothetical family would be leeching.
That said, outside of public housing, housing options are limited for a family of 7, let alone a family of 2-4 people. Not impossible but it probably wouldn't be the best neighborhood, home or apartment either unless they considered living out in NJ/LI/Westchester.
Simply put, I would never move here with 7 kids unless I was making a minimum of 250k per year. It would be so hard to try to replicate the lifestyle had in Texas and I would want my children to be able to live in a good nabe, with good amenities, education etc.
so basically what you all are saying is that there are no families of 7 in the city of New York living a normal lifestyle with less than a six figure income? Not even in Brooklyn or Queens?
so basically what you all are saying is that there are no families of 7 in the city of New York living a normal lifestyle with less than a six figure income? Not even in Brooklyn or Queens?
Its difficult to say none. It was possible in from the 70s till a little after 9/11, but now a family of 7 would have to pull off some serious miracles to live anywhere in the immediate metro area.
so basically what you all are saying is that there are no families of 7 in the city of New York living a normal lifestyle with less than a six figure income? Not even in Brooklyn or Queens?
There are actually plenty...they just got into their housing 10 yrs ago or so. They either pay below market rent through stabilization or they own a home with somewhat decently low taxes (compared to the burbs) that was purchased a long while ago so the mortgage isn't killer.
On a block I am familiar with, three family houses were going for $60k in 1997 or so. During the boom, $450k was typical for them but some of the more zealous ones snapped some up for $650k!! We're still shaking off our RE bubble, so such a house would probably be in the 300's now.
If our hypothetical family had bought one of those three-fams in 1997, they are living pretty damn well. Food and other expenses are not what makes NYC expensive (especially since our hypothetical family should only have one car, if that), its the Moderator cut: language real estate and taxes.
Last edited by Green Irish Eyes; 07-01-2009 at 08:39 PM..
Reason: Language
so basically what you all are saying is that there are no families of 7 in the city of New York living a normal lifestyle with less than a six figure income? Not even in Brooklyn or Queens?
Given that this is a purely hypothetical situation, I really think we've answered as best we can.
Certainly there are large families in the NYC area, and I'm sure they don't all have six-figure incomes. However, I'd wager that the ones who DON'T probably receive public assistance of some kind or, as others have said, they've been in their home for a number of years which means their housing cost is lower-than-normal.
Given that this is a purely hypothetical situation, I really think we've answered as best we can.
Certainly there are large families in the NYC area, and I'm sure they don't all have six-figure incomes. However, I'd wager that the ones who DON'T probably receive public assistance of some kind or, as others have said, they've been in their home for a number of years which means their housing cost is lower-than-normal.
Can we let it go at that?
Sure. and no offense to the city of New York, but after I've received all this info, I can understand why so many folks are moving down South in flocks. A large family living in project housing in NY could likely afford a comfortable lifestyle in an intown suburb somewhere in the HOU/DAL/ATL metros and still have many urban ammenities.
Sure. and no offense to the city of New York, but after I've received all this info, I can understand why so many folks are moving down South in flocks. A large family living in project housing in NY could likely afford a comfortable lifestyle in an intown suburb somewhere in the HOU/DAL/ATL metros and still have many urban ammenities.
Mrmcoy you have to realize that in NYC the housing market is very high. If you go to the outer boroughs you can afford more but a family of 7 is alot by any standards. I dont know what the average family size is but I dont know anyone who has 5 children. Alot of young people today plan for a family and dont start having children until they are in their 30's. They want to be educated and working at good jobs before they have a big family. This wasnt true in the past where the mother stayed at home and the father worked and they were able to afford the mortgage or rent and feed their family and this made it easier to have a larger family.
Most of the 20-30 years olds only have 1-2 children.
Your hypothetical question is not realistic in todays times.
Mrmcoy you have to realize that in NYC the housing market is very high. If you go to the outer boroughs you can afford more but a family of 7 is alot by any standards. I dont know what the average family size is but I dont know anyone who has 5 children. Alot of young people today plan for a family and dont start having children until they are in their 30's. They want to be educated and working at good jobs before they have a big family. This wasnt true in the past where the mother stayed at home and the father worked and they were able to afford the mortgage or rent and feed their family and this made it easier to have a larger family.
Most of the 20-30 years olds only have 1-2 children.
Your hypothetical question is not realistic in todays times.
Unrealistic? What?? Not only did I grow up in a large family but I know dozens of large families. I know one man with 10 kids who supports all of them.
Large households may not be widespread in NYC, but I don't have to live up there to know that you can find them. Especially in the outer boroughs which seem to be dominated by families.
Families of 7 or larger are definitely widespread in the south. And that was the relevance of my post. As I stated, a fam of 7 living on 75K a year in the South would be middle class. I was simply trying to find out how they would be living in the Big Apple.
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