Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
^ What? Where did the 50% of income in taxes figure come from? Same for needing a late model vehicle to pass inspection.
Also, Upstate NY is more moderate in terms of politics. There are reps from both parties and they range in terms of views.
I also don't know where or when crack was legalized anywhere. Where did that come from? I'm starting to wonder if the OP wants real information or is trying to start something. I find the KKK line interesting given their presence and that of similar groups in PA. I saw a business with a flyer featuring Hitler in Great Bend. I'm also not sure that it is about demand in PA or if it is about the energy companies one way or another.
If you keep trck of where your money goes its fairly simple. If you don't then its a diaperload of math so you'll prolly wanna skip it.
Take your total income, this number can easily be gotten off your W2. Start with this number.
Now it gets messy.
You will need:
Federal taxes paid minus any refunds
NYS taxes paid minus any refunds
Any city income taxes paid if any minus refunds
Total of all property and school taxes paid, this number should already reflect any exemptions.
Total number of gallons of gas used in that year. Just the total number of gallons matters, price payed does not. Now take 50 cents per gallon times the total number.
Total amount payed in sales tax. This number can be found on receipts from stores and online purchases.
This one is a little harder. Figger out how often you keep a car and average out the per year DMV costs. An average is better because NY DMV fee's are brutal but front loaded. For example I put a 10 YO beater on the road yesterday and it cost 566$. I prolly keep it long enough to re-up at a hundred bucks a whack twice for a total of 766$, divide that buy 6 and a beat up wreck costs 127$ per year.
Add in all road and bridge tolls. This number can be a little or alot.
Any "sin taxes". If you have them add them, if not don't.
Add all these numbers together and subtract them from the first number.
For me this basic number puts me right near 50% of my income.
Now is where it gets ugly. The cost of living in NY applies to everything and pinning down the exact number would be like nailing deer snot to the wall. For an example NY pays the highest electric rates in the mainland US. Thats a tax. Depending on the exact area water in NY can be breathtakingly expensive, my water bill would make the eyes pop out of a non-NYers head. And NY loves to tax business's who in turn pass those costs on to us.
Wouldn't surprise me. If you lose 20% to the feds and 10% between state income tax and property tax, you only need to cobble together another 20% between things like gas tax (over 50 cents per gallon between state and feds), sales tax, vehicle registration fees, and probably the largest one of all - the increase in price of just about everything to cover down on the taxes that the business / company has to pay to the state and the feds. 50% seems like a reasonable estimate.
It came because someone got snarky with me and started talking about freedom. Lots of people think that freedom is the ability to do whatever you want to do without it being deemed illegal. Lots of these "freedom" people like to talk about legalization of gay marriage, legalization of marijuana, etc... ideas that, even two generations ago, would have been viewed as outrageous. Right now we all think that something such as legalization of crack is outrageous. How will we feel in another two generations? Is that freedom?
I was trying to make a point.
To settle your mind, go to my original post. Figure out if I was looking for information, or if I said anything about wanting to start a debate. (If you still can't figure it out, I'll make it easy for you. I was looking for information.)
I guarantee that KKK people are everywhere. But you must admit, if a KKK Grand Dragon moved in next door to you, you'd be more than a little perturbed. My point was that there are things that are enough to make even the "live and let live" people abandon that philosophy for what they think is the "greater good". I guarantee you that even the biggest liberal hippie "love everyone" person would draw the line at something severe like a KKK leader living next door... or at least, at a KKK leader who lives next door hosting KKK meetings at his house even if they're entirely peaceful and thus Co
nstitutionally protected. I have never met a "live and let live" person who didn't draw the line somewhere. The reason why I don't like "live and let live" people is because it's hypocrisy... none of them really is entirely "live and let live", though they all believe they are. It's impossible to get along with people who are so unsure of who and what they are. I don't want to live in southern NY if lots of the people are "live and let live" types who don't think they would draw the line in the sand (even if that's just because they've never been faced with a scenario where they'd have to or want to, like a KKK leader
hosting meetings next door).
I wouldn't worry about the last part. For instance, when a handful of skinheads tried to have a rally in Auburn about 20 years ago, let's just say that many people didn't go for it. With that said, such person do not advertise their affiliation with such groups too often. So, you may never know.
Another interesting thing is that even a city like Ithaca has about 4 gun clubs in its metro area. So, even in areas known for being "liberal", you have gun owners and more moderate/conservative folks.
Like anything else, there are people that will work around or disregard laws.
It actually seems like much of what you stated isn't much different from many Upstate NYers. So, I don't think interaction with others will be as big of a deal.
As for income, that estimate still seems high. Vehicle registration is every 2 years at around $70 a Ford Taurus, for an example. We don't have yearly vehicle taxes. If you look at the tax guide I posted, it has a good breakdown of tax rates. Property tax RATES(key word) are high in Upstate NY because average property prices are low on average. You have to be mindful of the STAR rebate and other tax exemptions too: Property tax exemptions
If you keep trck of where your money goes its fairly simple. If you don't then its a diaperload of math so you'll prolly wanna skip it.
Take your total income, this number can easily be gotten off your W2. Start with this number.
Now it gets messy.
You will need:
Federal taxes paid minus any refunds
NYS taxes paid minus any refunds
Any city income taxes paid if any minus refunds
Total of all property and school taxes paid, this number should already reflect any exemptions.
Total number of gallons of gas used in that year. Just the total number of gallons matters, price payed does not. Now take 50 cents per gallon times the total number.
Total amount payed in sales tax. This number can be found on receipts from stores and online purchases.
This one is a little harder. Figger out how often you keep a car and average out the per year DMV costs. An average is better because NY DMV fee's are brutal but front loaded. For example I put a 10 YO beater on the road yesterday and it cost 566$. I prolly keep it long enough to re-up at a hundred bucks a whack twice for a total of 766$, divide that buy 6 and a beat up wreck costs 127$ per year.
Add in all road and bridge tolls. This number can be a little or alot.
Any "sin taxes". If you have them add them, if not don't.
Add all these numbers together and subtract them from the first number.
For me this basic number puts me right near 50% of my income.
Now is where it gets ugly. The cost of living in NY applies to everything and pinning down the exact number would be like nailing deer snot to the wall. For an example NY pays the highest electric rates in the mainland US. Thats a tax. Depending on the exact area water in NY can be breathtakingly expensive, my water bill would make the eyes pop out of a non-NYers head. And NY loves to tax business's who in turn pass those costs on to us.
So, it is basically based on your lifestyle and even where you live in NY. Some of this will vary and why would you leave out refunds, considering that it is just getting your money back?
I don't know what you are driving, but at most, I only pay at most around $90 to the DMV and that is every 2 years for renewing the registration and an inspection.
No need to add tolls if you do not have to use the Thruway often. Plus, if you do, why not get E-Z Pass?
Why add an additional city tax, when only NYC and Yonkers are the only ones I can think of that has that?
Even energy costs will vary on the person and company. For the OP, look into places with using this power company: New York Power Authority: About Us
You also have to be careful of generalizing, as wages in NY are among some of the highest. You have to consider how NYC skews all of these numbers/averages too.
One extra layer of NY gun control that alot of people don't get is that in NY you can't even touch a gun without state approveal.
Many states have laws in place concerning carrying a weapon. Thats not whats on the table in NY. In those states they can still go to the store and check out the different guns. They can buy the one or ones they choose. They can take them home and defend home and family. They can take them to the range and shoot them. The only laws reflect on CC.
In NY you can't even walk into a gun store and handle a weapon without state approval. And since you can't even hold one you certainly can't buy one. You can't have one in your home. You can't borrow one from a friend. Legally you can't even shoot your buddies gun to see if you like it. Depending on county not only do you need a judges approval to own guns in general but each gun you want has to be approved individually by the judge, my county is one of those. To even get that far you have to lie. As home/personal protection is not legal in NY you have to come up with some BS reason like "hiking in bear country".
All this only applies to legit taxpaying citizens. Just in the tiny city of Syracuse in the last 10 years hundreds of people have been gunned down. I would be willing to go waaaaaaaaaaaaaay out on a limb and suggest many of those folks hadn't bothered to fill out all the paperwork.
So, it is basically based on your lifestyle and even where you live in NY. Some of this will vary and why would you leave out refunds, considering that it is just getting your money back?
I don't know what you are driving, but at most, I only pay at most around $90 to the DMV and that is every 2 years for renewing the registration and an inspection.
No need to add tolls if you do not have to use the Thruway often. Plus, if you do, why not get E-Z Pass?
Why add an additional city tax, when only NYC and Yonkers are the only ones I can think of that has that?
Even energy costs will vary on the person and company. For the OP, look into places with using this power company: New York Power Authority: About Us
You also have to be careful of generalizing, as wages in NY are among some of the highest. You have to consider how NYC skews all of these numbers/averages too.
Almost everything is based on lifestyle, everywhere.
You seem to be leaving out the sales tax on the car. Base price on a Ford Taurus is 26,600$. Thats 2128$ in sales taxes right there. If you keep that car for 6 years thats 355$ a year plus your number of 90$ so an average yearly tax burden of 445$ per year.
Thats why I said if you pay road and bridge tolls add them. I do have an EZPass. is your free?? They make me pay on mine. It makes it easier and I think a small discount but I still have to pay. I'd love to know how yours is free.
Considering about half the population of the state live in those places with city tax it seemed fair to mention them.
Personally I live under the boot of National Grid. I would love for me to be able to learn how to avoid there rates. Usage I can control. Rates I cannot. Well I could have my state keep and eye on them. Oh wait wasn't NG the ones that got busted last Month for riding dirty with Albany??
One extra layer of NY gun control that alot of people don't get is that in NY you can't even touch a gun without state approveal.
Many states have laws in place concerning carrying a weapon. Thats not whats on the table in NY. In those states they can still go to the store and check out the different guns. They can buy the one or ones they choose. They can take them home and defend home and family. They can take them to the range and shoot them. The only laws reflect on CC.
In NY you can't even walk into a gun store and handle a weapon without state approval. And since you can't even hold one you certainly can't buy one. You can't have one in your home. You can't borrow one from a friend. Legally you can't even shoot your buddies gun to see if you like it. Depending on county not only do you need a judges approval to own guns in general but each gun you want has to be approved individually by the judge, my county is one of those. To even get that far you have to lie. As home/personal protection is not legal in NY you have to come up with some BS reason like "hiking in bear country".
All this only applies to legit taxpaying citizens. Just in the tiny city of Syracuse in the last 10 years hundreds of people have been gunned down. I would be willing to go waaaaaaaaaaaaaay out on a limb and suggest many of those folks hadn't bothered to fill out all the paperwork.
Umm, you can touch guns at gun shows around here. I also know that many guns are brought into NY from states with lax gun laws and I've even heard and read about guns being stolen or even sold by people in inner city neighborhoods. Not all homicides have been by guns, but too many have been in Syracuse, a city of 145,000 that averages about 15-16 homicides a year. That is actually average by national standards and NY State's rate is actually lower than you may think. https://spreadsheets.google.com/spre...0Uk9DRVE&hl=en
Interesting. I don't go to gun shows so I did not know that.
I do know that if you go to a store that sells handguns, which are super rare, of the big names I think only Gander Mountain sells handguns and the first thing they ask is to see your permit.
Almost everything is based on lifestyle, everywhere.
You seem to be leaving out the sales tax on the car. Base price on a Ford Taurus is 26,600$. Thats 2128$ in sales taxes right there. If you keep that car for 6 years thats 355$ a year plus your number of 90$ so an average yearly tax burden of 445$ per year.
Thats why I said if you pay road and bridge tolls add them. I do have an EZPass. is your free?? They make me pay on mine. It makes it easier and I think a small discount but I still have to pay. I'd love to know how yours is free.
Considering about half the population of the state live in those places with city tax it seemed fair to mention them.
Personally I live under the boot of National Grid. I would love for me to be able to learn how to avoid there rates. Usage I can control. Rates I cannot. Well I could have my state keep and eye on them. Oh wait wasn't NG the ones that got busted last Month for riding dirty with Albany??
Who said anything about a new Ford Taurus? It's a car, which is a terrible investment. So, why should you necessarily get or use a brand new one as an example? Just get a used one for 11k and be done with it. You must be using a fully loaded example and when has NY had a yearly vehicle tax?
I never said E-Z Pass was free, but it is a discount for those that use the Thruway regularly. It is largely moot for the OP, given that they are looking at the Southern Tier. As is the city tax and there are other energy options in NY State.
Interesting. I don't go to gun shows so I did not know that.
I do know that if you go to a store that sells handguns, which are super rare, of the big names I think only Gander Mountain sells handguns and the first thing they ask is to see your permit.
Go to a gun show at the state fair, as I believe that you can touch the guns there. Gander Mountain is national and that may be a company procedure. I believe Ra-Lin may let you touch them too. This is what I've been told anyway.
If you're coming in with that attitude, please stay away.
The least free State in the Country? Tell that to my gay brother.
The 2012 Numbers
Overall Freedom Ranking by State according this report - the report factors in a number of elements, such as gun laws, homeschooling, seatbelt laws, economic freedom, smoking bans, marijuana legislation etc.
1. New Hampshire
2. Colorado
3. South Dakota
4. Idaho
5. Texas
6. Missouri
7. Tennessee
8. Arizona
9. Virginia
10. North Dakota
11. Utah
12. Kansas
13. Indiana
14. Michigan
15. Wyoming
16. Iowa 0
17. Georgia
18. Oklahoma
19. Montana
20. Pennsylvania
21. Alabama
22. Florida
23. North Carolina
24. Nevada
25. Mississippi
26. Delaware
27. Oregon
28. Nebraska
29. Arkansas
30. South Carolina
31. Alaska
32. Kentucky
33. West Virginia
34. Louisiana
35. Minnesota
36. New Mexico
37. Wisconsin
38. Ohio
39. Maine
40. Vermont
41. Connecticut
42. Illinois
43. Massachusetts
44. Washington
45. Hawaii
46. Maryland
47. California
48. Rhode Island
49. New Jersey
50. New York
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
