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West of I77
The River District - Voluntary annexation will happen as roadways need to happen. Developers will want the City to build more on taxpayer dime, and that can only happen with annexation. The same was done with the outlet mall area just down the road. This will give Charlotte a second water front property to Lake Wylie.
West of I77 is were the warehouses, Offices, and manufacturing is. There are some residents west of I77, but that is where Charlotte get hit the most on density. In the Southwest part of Charlotte there more people there.
Center City Charlotte Has the largest office space in the city. Upon completion of all offices that are under construction or planned, Center City will have over 30 million square feet in office space. (From Center City Partners)
Simply adding Raleigh & Cary is also flawed at comparing.
Cary
Raleigh
Charlotte
By combining Raleigh & Cary, you’re cherry picking which areas to include. Everything west of I77 is nothing. The airport, lots of woods and a very little bit of development. Add all that white space before Cary. Charlotte is a larger city. Comes with the territory of being a metro dominated by 1 city
Its also pretty obvious Charlotte is bigger by looking at Meck vs. Wake. Wake is double the size of Meck but still less pop than Wake
I dont think anybody is arguing Charlotte is larger. Wake is a bigger county then Meck in land area like Charlotte is bigger then Raleighs land area. If Raleigh had the same land area of Charlotte it also would make up a much larger portion of Wake county. Doesnt necessarily mean it would change the population figures around as far as the county goes though.
Charlotte has had a huge lead on Raleigh for far too long for Raleigh to ever catch its population. Its aggressive annexation helps its population of course but even without that its been growing long before Raleigh "woke up." But because Raleigh is a part of a larger region, and pretty much everywhere in that region is growing very fast, sooner then later the two metros will be more comparable. And as was stated, by 2040 we may be seeing a shift in population lead between CSAs. And though Raleigh does not dominate its metro like Charlotte does, it will always be the "dominate" city in the Triangle. Theres more of a Minneapolis/St.Paul or Dallas/Ft.Worth dynamic to the Triangle then it being similiar to the Triad where Winston and Gboro are so similiar in size.
I think its great NC can have two metros growing at that rate and yet be different enough to likely sustain their individual growth. Almost being a left and right hand type situation for NC i like to think.
That and the cities obviously are huge allies against what would be a hindrance of rural lawmakers. And NC wouldn't be as great so the status of either city would be diminished without the other.
I think it has leadership to do in each city.
When North Carolina Changed the banking laws Hugh McCall put Charlotte on the map.
There was Also First Union Bank with NCNB in a race. Charlotte grew into a major banking center
For some reason First Citizen Bank in Raleigh took another path.
As we look to day we have BOA a large international bank. Has 15,000 employees in Charlotte
First Union is now Wells Fargo East Coast Head Quarters. Has 23,000 employees in Charlotte
Charlotte area has over 70,000 jobs in the Data/Financial Services
First Citizen Bank in Raleigh has about 5,000 employees company wide.
Financial Service is only one of Charlotte growth industries.
When Piedmont Airline Lines was looking for a hub, Charlotte was the only city to say they would build a hub.
The rest is history.
I find that Charlotte has a more of a can do attitude.
Raleigh is now faced how it wants to rebuild downtown. Let hope cooler heads will make good decisions.
I think it has leadership to do in each city.
When North Carolina Changed the banking laws Hugh McCall put Charlotte on the map.
There was Also First Union Bank with NCNB in a race. Charlotte grew into a major banking center
For some reason First Citizen Bank in Raleigh took another path.
As we look to day we have BOA a large international bank. Has 15,000 employees in Charlotte
First Union is now Wells Fargo East Coast Head Quarters. Has 23,000 employees in Charlotte
Charlotte area has over 70,000 jobs in the Data/Financial Services
First Citizen Bank in Raleigh has about 5,000 employees company wide.
Financial Service is only one of Charlotte growth industries.
When Piedmont Airline Lines was looking for a hub, Charlotte was the only city to say they would build a hub.
The rest is history.
I find that Charlotte has a more of a can do attitude.
Raleigh is now faced how it wants to rebuild downtown. Let hope cooler heads will make good decisions.
??? Kinda confused where this all came from? I’d say lots of luck with good leadership is the reason we are where we are. Same with Raleigh. Right places. Right time.
Here’s a nice pic of uptown that shows some new Dev.
Photo by cj_byers
Simply adding Raleigh & Cary is also flawed at comparing.
Cary
Raleigh
Charlotte
By combining Raleigh & Cary, you’re cherry picking which areas to include. Everything west of I77 is nothing. The airport, lots of woods and a very little bit of development. Add all that white space before Cary. Charlotte is a larger city. Comes with the territory of being a metro dominated by 1 city
Its also pretty obvious Charlotte is bigger by looking at Meck vs. Wake. Wake is double the size of Meck but still less pop than Wake
My only intent was to point out the ridiculousness of the "This is your brain, this is your brain on drugs, any questions?" -reminiscent-esque style of staing just the indisputable, cold hard, facts....
"From 2010-17 100,000 people moved to Charlotte.... same period 60,000 moved to Raleigh" It clear who's growing fastest."
Because it was evident that you were talking about the cities proper or possibly county.
To compare the two cities in such a matter-of-fact tone without mentioning how different the regions are comprised,,
is utterly laughable.
And for the last time, Raleigh and Triangle are not consciously or subconsciously trying to become a big city, nor are they wanting to build tall buildings,
and Raleigh residents do not compare themselves with Charlotte or any other city.
Raleigh residents do not even think about Charlotte which is mentioned maybe once a month on the local news.
The Triangle is so enthralled with it's own accolades and national attention coming in almost monthly since 1994 about everything without any association to big-city elements, that I can assure you,
Raleigh actually is trying to maintain it's low scale as evidenced by all new buildings hovering around 20 floors high.
Between being the capital and the concentration of respected universities and NY and California newcomers in the top 5 of all new residents relocating to Wake,
they're so full of themselves already that they don't even look for other cities to rival
Last edited by architect77; 11-08-2017 at 11:15 PM..
The most recent data shows metro Charlotte adding 50,000 people each year while Raleigh/Durham adds about 43,000 each year. If this trend continues for the next 23 years, metro Charlotte would add 160,000 more people than the Triangle by 2040. Being that Charlotte is the air travel capital, business capital, energy capital, finance capital, etc of NC; any factor that slows down Charlotte's growth would also slow down growth in the Triangle.
Also, metro Charlotte has 600,000 plus more people than metro Raleigh/Durham currently. The Triangle would need to out-grow Charlotte by 20,000 per year for the next 30 years in order to catch up.
Maybe you can help me out. We might actually be looking at two different things. I think i read it in Bizjournals.com somewhere that the Raleigh msa was projected to grow 2.3% or by roughly 31k people by Jan 1 2018. At the same time Durham MSA is expected to grow 1.4% or roughly 7,800 people. So together thats roughly 40k give or take obviously. Yet that doesnt take into account what all is actually considered "The Triangle." So no doubt there are some other growth numbers though obviously more modest in total numbers. Maybe thats where you see the 43k?
Now the Charlotte MSA is expected to grow (couldnt find 2017 projections so i went with 2016) about 1.23% or about 30k.
What i can figure is that maybe the projections and numbers the NCDOT looks at are for strictly only Charlotte metro on the NC side. Which makes sense.
So if thats the case it does probably put Charlottes numbers at 2.48m instead of 2.63m or so of its larger CSA. In that sense, projecting Charlotte out to 2040 would put it roughly at 3,140,000. Now with the Triangles 2.25m, projecting that out would probably put it around 3,196,000. Obviously thats if everything growth wise continues. Again, idk if this is the case but by that math it does seem like theres a chance that lead in population could indeed happen 20+ years in the future. It will be fun to see how it plays out.
But i do have to disagree with one thing you said. Charlotte being the capital of all things economics wise in NC does not guarantee that anything that slows down its growth would slow down the Triangle as well. It definitely could! but its not a given. Look at my home state of Michigan. Detroit has been bleeding for years now. Hurting economically more then any other major city in the US and yet look at Grand Rapids. Its doing great! And there is a much wider gap between Detroit and Grand Rapids, then there is between Charlotte and the Triangle. Im sure there are plenty of other examples of that too. The largest city in each state does not dictate whether or not other areas in the state either suffer or prosper. The Charlotte and Triangle region have plenty that seperate themselves from dependency on eachother.
Maybe you can help me out. We might actually be looking at two different things. I think i read it in Bizjournals.com somewhere that the Raleigh msa was projected to grow 2.3% or by roughly 31k people by Jan 1 2018. At the same time Durham MSA is expected to grow 1.4% or roughly 7,800 people. So together thats roughly 40k give or take obviously. Yet that doesnt take into account what all is actually considered "The Triangle." So no doubt there are some other growth numbers though obviously more modest in total numbers. Maybe thats where you see the 43k?
Now the Charlotte MSA is expected to grow (couldnt find 2017 projections so i went with 2016) about 1.23% or about 30k.
What i can figure is that maybe the projections and numbers the NCDOT looks at are for strictly only Charlotte metro on the NC side. Which makes sense.
So if thats the case it does probably put Charlottes numbers at 2.48m instead of 2.63m or so of its larger CSA. In that sense, projecting Charlotte out to 2040 would put it roughly at 3,140,000. Now with the Triangles 2.25m, projecting that out would probably put it around 3,196,000. Obviously thats if everything growth wise continues. Again, idk if this is the case but by that math it does seem like theres a chance that lead in population could indeed happen 20+ years in the future. It will be fun to see how it plays out.
But i do have to disagree with one thing you said. Charlotte being the capital of all things economics wise in NC does not guarantee that anything that slows down its growth would slow down the Triangle as well. It definitely could! but its not a given. Look at my home state of Michigan. Detroit has been bleeding for years now. Hurting economically more then any other major city in the US and yet look at Grand Rapids. Its doing great! And there is a much wider gap between Detroit and Grand Rapids, then there is between Charlotte and the Triangle. Im sure there are plenty of other examples of that too. The largest city in each state does not dictate whether or not other areas in the state either suffer or prosper. The Charlotte and Triangle region have plenty that seperate themselves from dependency on eachother.
Don't feed these people. I used to, but I realized these people are weird! What's ironic is that the Charlotte area can be pretty laid back, however we wouldn't know that considering the silly comments made on this board. Trolls.
Maybe you can help me out. We might actually be looking at two different things. I think i read it in Bizjournals.com somewhere that the Raleigh msa was projected to grow 2.3% or by roughly 31k people by Jan 1 2018. At the same time Durham MSA is expected to grow 1.4% or roughly 7,800 people. So together thats roughly 40k give or take obviously. Yet that doesnt take into account what all is actually considered "The Triangle." So no doubt there are some other growth numbers though obviously more modest in total numbers. Maybe thats where you see the 43k?
Now the Charlotte MSA is expected to grow (couldnt find 2017 projections so i went with 2016) about 1.23% or about 30k.
What i can figure is that maybe the projections and numbers the NCDOT looks at are for strictly only Charlotte metro on the NC side. Which makes sense.
So if thats the case it does probably put Charlottes numbers at 2.48m instead of 2.63m or so of its larger CSA. In that sense, projecting Charlotte out to 2040 would put it roughly at 3,140,000. Now with the Triangles 2.25m, projecting that out would probably put it around 3,196,000. Obviously thats if everything growth wise continues. Again, idk if this is the case but by that math it does seem like theres a chance that lead in population could indeed happen 20+ years in the future. It will be fun to see how it plays out.
But i do have to disagree with one thing you said. Charlotte being the capital of all things economics wise in NC does not guarantee that anything that slows down its growth would slow down the Triangle as well. It definitely could! but its not a given. Look at my home state of Michigan. Detroit has been bleeding for years now. Hurting economically more then any other major city in the US and yet look at Grand Rapids. Its doing great! And there is a much wider gap between Detroit and Grand Rapids, then there is between Charlotte and the Triangle. Im sure there are plenty of other examples of that too. The largest city in each state does not dictate whether or not other areas in the state either suffer or prosper. The Charlotte and Triangle region have plenty that seperate themselves from dependency on eachother.
I think the percentage growth quoted in these articles for the Charlotte metro are incorrect. Mecklenburg county is estimated to be adding 20,000 or so net residents a year with most of that in Charlotte. Iredell,Union& Cabarrus county add 3-5 thousand each, this doesn't include Gaston,Lincoln,Rowan or the mega growth across the state line in York & Lancaster counties. So 31,000 is way below the actual growth numbers
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