[iamjacobm]

The courts interpret the laws. It doesn't matter what you think is right or wrong or even if the judges make a mistake in your opinion because their decision is always the right one in the eyes of the law.

If judges later decide to change it then their view will be the right view in the eyes of the law. It is only one of the bedrock foundations of this country.

[McBain II]

Originally Posted by Calvinist

Are you suggesting the courts are the one that set the standard?

In the case of Prop 8, yes. Two sides argued their cases to the judge, who has the job of ruling based on the evidenced argued.

[Calvinist]

Originally Posted by DentalFloss

***************, we're going around in circles. I've explained to you over and over again. I've demonstrated how to label some acts as immoral without necessitating resorting to 'god said so'.

I've given 3 simple guidelines that, if universally followed, would result in peace, love, and harmony. Do no harm. Golden rule. Reverse golden rule. I don't need the creator to incarnate, meet (in secret) with some guy on a mountain top, and come down with a list of commandments for me to understand what is and is not moral.

(Incidentally, why wouldn't god have created the medium on which those were written to last and withstand the test of time? For a guy who craves people believing in him, that would have been a grand opportunity to leave behind some actual evidence, dontcha think?)

If you're arguing against gay marriage on theocratic grounds, you are in fact arguing for a theocracy, and thus far those are the only grounds you've offered.

You are begging the question when you try to assume that something is universally right or wrong without submitting to an ultimate authority. I'd like to know how you pretend to be able to tell me what is right and wrong.

[DentalFloss]

Originally Posted by Calvinist

I'd like to know how you pretend to be able to tell me what is right and wrong.

If you need to be instructed (or worse, commanded) to know it's not a good thing to kill other people, you've got issues.

[Calvinist]

Originally Posted by DentalFloss

If you need to be instructed (or worse, commanded) to know it's not a good thing to kill other people, you've got issues.

There are currently people groups today that consider it to be ok. Your argument for morals according to societal standards lead to stuff like that.

[iamjacobm]

Yet how many groups site their belief in a god to kill others as well? Seems like the unfaltering belief in a higher being isn't a model for a moral society either.

[Calvinist]

Originally Posted by iamjacobm

Yet how many groups site their belief in a god to kill others as well? Seems like the unfaltering belief in a higher being isn't a model for a moral society either.

You're right. It depends on the higher being.

[McBain II]

Originally Posted by Calvinist

You're right. It depends on the higher being.

Or you just do like America (among others) have done and found a country on completely removing all religion from the legislative process.

[Calvinist]

Originally Posted by Bosco55David

Or you just do like America (among others) have done and found a country on completely removing all religion from the legislative process.

The founding fathers never intended for that.

[McBain II]

Originally Posted by Calvinist

The founding fathers never intended for that.

History says otherwise.