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I was attending college in a different country from my parents at 17, so that's a moot point for me.
The issue of lying, however, should be addressed. If you don't want to sign a lease for them, then make them find their own accommodation. Can't have it both ways.
I was attending college in a different country from my parents at 17, so that's a moot point for me.
The issue of lying, however, should be addressed. If you don't want to sign a lease for them, then make them find their own accommodation. Can't have it both ways.
That's a very good point. I know this is a whole can of worms, but do you think we don't expect as much of 18 year olds now as was expected of them in the past? It seems like there are constant threads about young adults still living at home and acting like they're 12. Or threads about parents that can't seem to accept that their children are, at least in the eyes of the law, not children anymore. (This is not directed at you, Chessie).
Who cares about the eyes of the law? I know when my kids are adults and when they're still kids. And as long as I'm paying their living expenses, I buy their food, I pay their auto insurance, I provide them health insurance then they're still my kids.
When they move out, pay their own bills, pay their own way, work their own jobs then they're adults.
I also believe in a phase-in period starting somewhere around age 16-17 where they start working for the extras they want but are still not having to support themselves.
Maybe it's because I'm from a different country and a different era. I was out of the house and living in a different city by the time I was 18. It's hard for me to fathom asking permission to go to a friend's for a while at that age.
I understand the anxiety attached to it (letting the kid go), but does financial control have to equate to control over all aspects of an 18 year old's life?
And I also understand that the military has rules. But if we trust 18 year olds to be mature enough to kill people, then we should trust them to go away with their friends for a week. Otherwise, why don't we raise the formal age of adulthood to 21 and stop pretending like 18 year olds have any autonomy at all?
Another question I would have is if there is going to be drinking.
Or drugs. I have no qualms about having rules for an 18 year old living under my roof. Not just my own kids, but when their friends move in which has been the case, they get the same rules and don't seem to mind them.
My kids never seem in any real big hurry to move out so they're apparently okay with the rules.
I think in cases like this the parent has to go with his/her own gut. The parent knows the kid. The parent knows the kid's friends and deep down know why their kid has decided to lie to the parent.
Even the law requires parents to pay child support until the child is 18 or until high school graduation if the child will graduate while 18.
Who cares about the eyes of the law? I know when my kids are adults and when they're still kids. And as long as I'm paying their living expenses, I buy their food, I pay their auto insurance, I provide them health insurance then they're still my kids.
But technically, they aren't. You can barter the material stuff in return for their cooperation, and everybody will likely be happy with that arrangement. That's your prerogative. But that does not make them any less adults in the eyes of the law. You don't have any legal right to make decisions about where they go and what they do outside of your house.
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute
When they move out, pay their own bills, pay their own way, work their own jobs then they're adults.
That is not the legal criteria for adulthood, no matter how much practical sense it makes. You making the decision to support them past 18 does not make them less autonomous as human beings. They can decide to accept that arrangement with you or not. If they accept that you control their actions in return for your support then that's fine, and probably mutually beneficial. It works both ways. You can decide to pull your support for any reason, as after 18 the law does not require you to give it in any form whatsoever.
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute
I also believe in a phase-in period starting somewhere around age 16-17 where they start working for the extras they want but are still not having to support themselves.
I think that's essential for preparing them for the real world.
Chess, I'm sure you've had the same talk I've had with my daughter, which is if she is somewhere she needs to get out of, like a party that's getting out of hand, she can call us no matter what. Drunk, high, with a boy--God forbid, but you know what I mean--she can call home and we will go get her. I couldn't promise not to be mad, but I did promise to deal with whatever is going on calmly and get mad later. I don't ever want her to stay somewhere unsafe (like get a ride with a drunk friend) because she's afraid of telling us.
Will your son call you and tell you if something bad is happening?
Julia, I have in fact had that talk with him, but I will have it again, before this Beach Week thing. Actually, I plan on talking to the entire group, and let them know that I am only a few minutes away...and if they find themselves in trouble, they can call me...no questions asked (at least not then...like you said - that can be dealt with later). I sure do hope that if my son were to find himself in a sticky situation, he would feel that he could call me.
Seems like he had at least 2 opportunities to blow it with regards to your trust - with this underage drinking party and with the whole fraud leasing thing.
I am with the people who say that when he graduates, he might as well BE in college...and he will not be under your supervision at all...he's an adult (18) in the eyes of the law, and while you may want to protect him, you're gonna have to loosen the rules up (with regards to personal liberty)..
I'm not sure where you get the idea that I have NOT "loosened the rules". This isn't about my son's everyday life. This was ONLY a question about the beach week thing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by stan4
However, I WOULD NEVER lie on a leasing contract...if that beach house says someone over 25 is supposed to be there, I would not perpetuate the FRAUD he is asking you to be a part of. Explain to him in no uncertain terms that rules/laws are not flexible and while you love him and support him, you're not going to break the law for him...nor are you going to tolerate his breaking the law (that includes bailing him out for underage drinking, etc).
I'd let him go on this trip provided he can finance it himself AND find some situation himself that does not require you to commit a crime or lie.
I already stated that I am not the one that signed the lease - I told the kids at the start that I would not do so. And yes, he is financing it himself.
Chessie, I'm glad you came to a win-win for you and your son. My son is 17 (will be 18 this year) so I will be faced with the same dilemma this time next year. I read all of the posts and as gut-wrenching as it is to let your child go it's equally as hard to tell them no and dissapoint them. At the end of the day we want them to be safe and they can't always see that.
It was mentioned that a young person can go fight in a war at 18. Yes. But with no draft, any 18-year-old in the military is one who has chosen to take on an adult role. That is not the same as wanting to party.
I would not want to be part of (encourage, approve of, etc.) the dishonesty involved in these kids staying in a house that belongs to someone else and not following the rules (age rule). Technically, the mother who signed the lease is the one breaking the lease by allowing it, but everyone who participates is approving of it.
I don't think the age itself is so important. As someone else said, you don't become wise on your 18th birthday.
Even with parents in attendance, kids will still be kids. When I was in high school, a bunch of us (our confirmation class from church, no less) went for a chaperoned week camping at the beach. We stayed in tents - girls in one, boys in another - and the adults in their camper. There was still some pairing off, a little weed, a lot of booze, etc. This was NJ and at that time (35 years ago) the legal drinking age was 18 and some of us were old enough to visit a liquor store. No one got hopelessly stoned, drunk, hurt or in trouble. I think, though, it was because of the close proximity of the adults.
In this day and age, though, I'd probably say no chaperone, no trip. I know I come off as a hypocrite, but I watch too many true life crime shows.
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It's hard for me to fathom asking permission to go to a friend's for a while at that age. 
This isn't about my son's everyday life. This was ONLY a question about the beach week thing. 
