Just so sad about what my daughter is going thru....

[FinsterRufus]

Originally Posted by maciesmom

FR - I think we agree more than we disagree. I don't think anyone is saying to ignore the serious stuff. I think what people are responding to is the posters who don't want their children to "have" to change "who they are" -and are insisting that their shy, nonconfrontational children, shouldn't have to learn how to deal with unpleasant people because it isn't fair to make them change in response to other people. Our responsibility as parents is to give our children the tools they need to stand up for themselves and to stand up for them when needed. It's the "when" things go from one situation to the next that is the tough part.

Yes, I totally agree with that. Absolutely, and well put.

However, there a few posters that will always blame the person being targeted for being weak, no matter what the situation.

[NJGOAT]

Originally Posted by FinsterRufus

Yes, thanks - that is indeed the point - I don't regard one off incidents of a taunt or two or fairly innocuous teasing as real bullying. I think where it crosses the line is when more than one person targets another (for whatever reason) and makes a point of making their life hell on a daily basis, for no other reason than to make the other person constantly miserable - that's real bullying.

Gossip and rumors can indeed fall into this category. Gossip and rumors are horrible tools that can be used against someone to ruin their reputation for their whole school career and can also make the recipient's life a dreadful existence and we should discourage our children from engaging in that kind of behavior as well. Especially in the virtual realm. Obviously that's where that kind of bullying has found it's niche.

Even if it's physical threats and or violence, the answer to it according to most of the posts here are that the kid being targeted is responsible for stopping it, because the bully is just being a bully and there are bullies everywhere. I think there are bullies everywhere because as a society we still allow them to get away with it.

We need to explain the devastating consequences this kind of thing has on people and raise kids to be compassionate enough not to engage in it, or if they see it happening, steadfastly refuse to join in, and to stick up for people who are being targeted.

We need to raise kids that are not only strong enough to not become bullies or bullied, but that also will not stand by and just watch it happen to somebody else. We need to make bullies so stigmatized it won't be worth it to them to keep doing it, and there will be no pay off to starting it at all.

I think we're on the same page with that one.

When it comes to gossip that goes to the extreme, I think the hardest part is how to police it. It is incredibly unreasonable to think that parents/teachers/administrators have the ability to control something like that. Which, brings us back to the bolded point.

In terms of physical bullying, there are different levels of that. Some is best handled by the target standing up for themselves and not backing down, per the bolded section. Other times, like when a much older kid is phyiscally going after a younger one or when a group is physically going after an individual it is going to require outside intervention. As way of example I think it's better for one 10 year old being shoved by another 10 year old to defend themselves and take care of the situation on their own. However, one 10 year old being attacked by five 10 year olds or say one 15 year old, needs some outside help/protection.

In terms of this thread, the issue revolves around people who think that the bolded part isn't fair or reasonable. They shouldn't have to raise kids who are strong enough to not get bullied and are willing to stand up for others. They believe that it is societies job to defend their child, so they don't have to learn how to defend themselves. That includes everything from a gang assault to someone picking on them for the clothes they wear.