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My husband and I are considering a move to the Phoenix area. He lived there for a while many, many years ago and we have vacationed in Arizona half a dozen times in the last fifteen years. Areas have changed since our first visit to friends (who have since moved out of Arizona) in 1993. They did not live in an area with an HOA and we felt perfectly safe. Today, we would not consider living in that area. So, with all that being said, are there any areas in the Valley (specifically North Peoria, Surprise) that are safe with no HOA's? We are not against HOA's but would just like more information such as: what are you getting for your dues, are these gated areas, and have your dues been raised and if so by how much and how often. I realize all HOA's will be different so just tell me your experience. I've been looking at real estate listings on ziprealty and some of those dues can be quite hefty. You might be able to afford the mortgage in this market but add in the monthly dues and taxes and suddenly the house has become unaffordable. Thanks for any replies!
In my experience, most HOA committees are run by power-hungry losers with little-to-no control over any other aspect of their life and therefore run their neighborhood associations like fiefdoms.
I don't personally think the neighborhood I currently live in would be any less safe if the HOA disbanded, and I suspect it'd be that way for most communities citywide.
I currently live in far North Peoria in a nice subdivision with no HOA. It's very safe here and I'm so glad to be rid of my previous HOA. The homes in our area are right around 10 years old. There are a few subdivisions that are non-HOA and they're mostly owner-occupied homes and well kept. Lots of room for "toys" (rv's, boats, etc.) in the backyards because you have an RV gate and slightly bigger lots.
Don't be afraid of non-HOA subdivisions/neighborhoods. Make sure you check out the areas you like during the day, weekday evenings and weekends. Sometimes the streets get very crowded with parked cars, etc. If that doesn't bother you, just check out how the yards are maintained. You can easily tell when people care and that's a lot more helpful (and safe) than an intrusive HOA.
All I got for my dues was a letter when my trash can wasn't moved behind the gate by dark on trash day.
I'm sorry I can't offer you any advice on the Surprise area. It'd be my guess though, that there are few options of newer subdivisions without HOAs there. A lot of homes were built there beginning in 2000, which seems to be the "heyday" of HOAs.
Lastly, I'd be leery of an HOA these days with all the bank-owned and vacant homes. I don't know if the banks pay the HOA dues and maybe the remaining homeowners are making up the difference for the money they're losing.
Whatever you choose and wherever your path leads, good luck.
Lastly, I'd be leery of an HOA these days with all the bank-owned and vacant homes. I don't know if the banks pay the HOA dues and maybe the remaining homeowners are making up the difference for the money they're losing.
Whatever you choose and wherever your path leads, good luck.
In most cases, the HOA does not recoup the lost dues from the time the homeowner stopped paying, up until the bank takes the deed. They may have had a lien on the property, but that is a junior lien that is wiped out when a senior lien holder forecloses.
In some cases the bank will pay the delinquent dues, but they are not legally required to do that because they were not the owner of record when the dues were delinquent.
The banks become responsible to pay the HOA dues from the date they take the deed. They must, and they do, pay them. If they didn't pay, the HOA could put a lien on the property and the bank couldn't sell it until they clear the lien.
The banks also have the responsibility to maintain the yard just as any other homeowner does. In 2007 they were very slow in realizing that they had to maintain the yards. Now they've been educated and they do keep the yards up.
The realtors who have the bank-owned listings are given the responsibility of paying the HOA dues and having the trash cleaned out of the house and yard, and pay for a landscaper to maintain the yard. They are reimbursed for their out of pocket expenses.
For the bank owned listings that I have, I'm required to have all the initial work done, and then have a gardener service the yard every two weeks.
Ideally, an HOA's will use your dues to take care of common areas, such as landscaping, community pool's, pick nick areas, tot lots, etc., since the city does not want this expense or responsibility. They also are supposed to ensure the community follows a certain level of guidelines, such as what color you can paint your house, what type of landscaping you can have and how you should maintain it. However, they are not responsible for the upkeep of individual houses (bank owned, empty, etc.) when the owners fail to do so.
I personally believe we would be much better off without HOA's -- but it is very difficult to find a newer community in the greater Phoenix area that is 10 years old or less without an HOA.
Now, in my personal experiences (as well as what I have seen posted by many other people here), most HOA's are managed by some far away management company who does very little -- other than send out HOA dues bills and occasionally (1-2 times per year) might monitor the area and send out compliance letters. They often times will pay exorbitant amounts to companies for maintenance and upkeep (without allowing any official bids -- why pay $1,000,000/year to cut the grass when it could easily be done for $10,000 per month!), or contract with companies for undisclosed kickbacks (such as forcing residents to pay monthly charges to their cable company, regardless if the residents use it or not?).
As I had posted in another thread about HOAs, these entities don't genuinely serve the purpose of the home owner, but to the developer. As a sub division is pending completion, it allows the developer to retain unchallenged powers over the sub division in order to assure the developer conditions that are beneficial to their sales.
Fear mongering later is the sole excuse used to preserve an HOA. About how your neighbor will paint his house rainbow colored, or run a farm, or house 30 people and park abandoned cars on the front yard. And how secure the sub division will be from unwanted outsiders.
Rarely do any of these conditions happen. If the property value of a given area is sustained, and the owners are gainfully employed, no such nonsense happens. If bad times hit, no HOA can prevent a downturn in the sub division.
Many HOAs in sub divisions have no justification for their existence. The fees simply rise each year as dictated by management companies which find ways to drain the HOA reserves. It's just another middle-man scheme to shake down the property owner.
Many HOAs are reluctant to put amendments into the CC&Rs which were passed over the years, in hopes to re-instate lost powers and clauses. Often, owner apathy allows them to get away with many things.
Many clauses have been proven to be unlawful. Parking on the street, satellite dish installation, size and type of private vehicle, RV gates and what's allowed behind them...landscaping.
Many clauses are actually hurting the property values and identities of communities. The clauses preventing you from painting your property other than HOA approved colors, are causing the valley to be populated with cookie-cutter clone sub divisions. No identity, nothing discerns one place from another.
You drive from neighborhood to neighborhood, and most of the homes have the same fencing, roofs, siding color, lot sizing and dimensions, and landscaping!
Unless you have a property which includes community amenities like pools, spas, lakes, golf courses, gates, game rooms, baby sitting/child care, etc....HOA fees aren't returning anything worthwhile for your troubles.
ie. My HOA fee is $50/month. We have no community amenities or expenses. Val Vista Lakes' fee is $90/ month. Just look at the list of amenities!
Our HOA is voting on whether to install solar powered lighting systems around the sub division, which is currently lit fine by street lighting and utility feed. Our reserve is empty, but they feel justified to impose a special assessment on the home owners for this. Why? To give them something to do and justify their existence. And sadly too many owners act like lame sheep and don't challenge them. We forget they only exist to serve the owners.
HOAs have an expiration renewal date. (~15-20 yrs) Owners should be made aware of these things and VOTE!! Or HOAs will renew for another 25 years usually.
HOAs......the solution to a problem that never existed.
I don't think safety and having an HOA are necessarily directly connected. I live in an area of south Tempe with NO HOA, and that is one of the selling points used by rlealtors for the houses in the area.
Our HOA is voting on whether to install solar powered lighting systems around the sub division, which is currently lit fine by street lighting and utility feed. Our reserve is empty, but they feel justified to impose a special assessment on the home owners for this. Why? To give them something to do and justify their existence. And sadly too many owners act like lame sheep and don't challenge them. We forget they only exist to serve the owners.
HOAs have an expiration renewal date. (~15-20 yrs) Owners should be made aware of these things and VOTE!! Or HOAs will renew for another 25 years usually.
HOAs......the solution to a problem that never existed.
HOA's are run by the homeowners through their elected board of directors.
The directors are homeowners who are willing to volunteer their time to work for the community. The directors hire a management company to run the day to day business, under the direction of the board of directors.
Some HOA's are badly run because of the people who have been elected.
Some are well run because of the directors.
If an HOA is being run badly then more homeowners should get involved and volunteer their time.
I live in Val Vista Lakes and have served on the master board. That board is well run, and VVL has an excellent in-house full time manager and staff. The manager is hired by the board, and the manager manages the staff of about 60 people.
Lakeside is one of the sub-communities in Val Vista Lakes and I've been on that board for 4 years. We've always had good board members who work to better the community. When people have complaints they come to us. When they don't, we don't hear from them. We don't hear from them much, but when we do, we listen.
The big problem is owner apathy, with owners not wanting to do any volunteering for the community, and most not even taking the time to read the newsletters, and not voting. Usually it's a struggle to get enough votes at an annual meeting to constitute a quorum.
The CC&R's require about 75% vote of the community to change. That is very difficult to get. Then there is also an attorney fee for researching and rewriting the covenant and getting it recorded.
If the HOA that one lives in is being run badly, then the solution is for one to become active, run for the board and make a positive change.
Unfortunately, most people just complain and don't volunteer.
My husband and I are considering a move to the Phoenix area. He lived there for a while many, many years ago and we have vacationed in Arizona half a dozen times in the last fifteen years. Areas have changed since our first visit to friends (who have since moved out of Arizona) in 1993. They did not live in an area with an HOA and we felt perfectly safe. Today, we would not consider living in that area. So, with all that being said, are there any areas in the Valley (specifically North Peoria, Surprise) that are safe with no HOA's? We are not against HOA's but would just like more information such as: what are you getting for your dues, are these gated areas, and have your dues been raised and if so by how much and how often. I realize all HOA's will be different so just tell me your experience. I've been looking at real estate listings on ziprealty and some of those dues can be quite hefty. You might be able to afford the mortgage in this market but add in the monthly dues and taxes and suddenly the house has become unaffordable. Thanks for any replies!
Home owner associations are basically above the law what you agree to when you move in does not stay the same, take it from someone who knows, I do live in a different state but all associations are basically ran the same, rules change regularly with out your knowledg or approval, they can basically do what they want with your money. this is a little advice from some one who wishes I was told in detail what I was up against.
I pay my dues on time and never bounced a check, but have encountered complete and total harrassment.
The problem is the government does not oversee HOA's
Quote:
Originally Posted by wng
As I had posted in another thread about HOAs, these entities don't genuinely serve the purpose of the home owner, but to the developer. As a sub division is pending completion, it allows the developer to retain unchallenged powers over the sub division in order to assure the developer conditions that are beneficial to their sales.
Fear mongering later is the sole excuse used to preserve an HOA. About how your neighbor will paint his house rainbow colored, or run a farm, or house 30 people and park abandoned cars on the front yard. And how secure the sub division will be from unwanted outsiders.
Rarely do any of these conditions happen. If the property value of a given area is sustained, and the owners are gainfully employed, no such nonsense happens. If bad times hit, no HOA can prevent a downturn in the sub division.
Many HOAs in sub divisions have no justification for their existence. The fees simply rise each year as dictated by management companies which find ways to drain the HOA reserves. It's just another middle-man scheme to shake down the property owner.
Many HOAs are reluctant to put amendments into the CC&Rs which were passed over the years, in hopes to re-instate lost powers and clauses. Often, owner apathy allows them to get away with many things.
Many clauses have been proven to be unlawful. Parking on the street, satellite dish installation, size and type of private vehicle, RV gates and what's allowed behind them...landscaping.
Many clauses are actually hurting the property values and identities of communities. The clauses preventing you from painting your property other than HOA approved colors, are causing the valley to be populated with cookie-cutter clone sub divisions. No identity, nothing discerns one place from another.
You drive from neighborhood to neighborhood, and most of the homes have the same fencing, roofs, siding color, lot sizing and dimensions, and landscaping!
Unless you have a property which includes community amenities like pools, spas, lakes, golf courses, gates, game rooms, baby sitting/child care, etc....HOA fees aren't returning anything worthwhile for your troubles.
ie. My HOA fee is $50/month. We have no community amenities or expenses. Val Vista Lakes' fee is $90/ month. Just look at the list of amenities!
Our HOA is voting on whether to install solar powered lighting systems around the sub division, which is currently lit fine by street lighting and utility feed. Our reserve is empty, but they feel justified to impose a special assessment on the home owners for this. Why? To give them something to do and justify their existence. And sadly too many owners act like lame sheep and don't challenge them. We forget they only exist to serve the owners.
HOAs have an expiration renewal date. (~15-20 yrs) Owners should be made aware of these things and VOTE!! Or HOAs will renew for another 25 years usually.
HOAs......the solution to a problem that never existed.
I have found out they are above the law pay for high priced attorneys and insurance, they will spend homeowners money instead of figuring out the problem. The statues they are governed by are issued by the state and or county but then they are able to create whatever rules they want even though it may infringe on your civil liberties.
start a homeowners rights group go to meetings in numbers.
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HOA stay away
