Thoughts on downtown living... (Pittsburgh, Washington: gated, store, transportation)

[FreightTrainRunning]

The people I know who live or have lived downtown go the to supermarket the same way that I do, by driving.

[Blackbeauty212]

Originally Posted by h_curtis

What about the big Whole Foods in Union Square. That is where I get my Innis and Gunn Beer when I visit! Great! What about the Trader Joes on 6th and 24thish? I have been in there and it is pretty big. I don't like going to these places because the crowds are huge, but I have to have my Innis and Gunn beer! I can't get that in Pittsburgh!

One what does those stores down there do for me if live on 86th and Lex all the way Uptown...Downtown Pittsburgh to Cedar Av GE and the Strip is a quicker trip than going from uptown down to Union Square....

Second your statement said NYC (Im guessing you mean Manhattan)

Originally Posted by h_curtis

.If you go to DC or NYC there are tons of grocery stores to choose from. Really countless. Pittsburgh's downtown? None.

In my book 2 listings of Specialty Groceries Stores thats more inaccessible to Uptown Manhattanites than the Cerdar Av GE is to Downtown Pittsburgh... Hell to behonest you can catch the EBA from downtown and be at the E Liberty Whole Foods quicker than me living Uptown would have to travel via Subway downtown to Union Square.....

And i wouldnt call 2 listings Countless....Whats even more funny is your attempt to equate the size of Manhattan and DC with Downtown Pittsburgh to prove a point....LOL

[I_Like_Spam]

Originally Posted by GeneW

The people I know who live or have lived downtown go the to supermarket the same way that I do, by driving.

When I lived virtually downtown, in Allegheny Center, I usually strolled over to the Cedar Giant Eagle.

I was a lot younger then, too. And if I bought a lot of crap, I paid one of the jitneys to drive me back.

[jay5835]

Originally Posted by ML North

I'm willing to say that many people in DC, NY, or any other city (or Shadyside) have to walk 10 minutes to get to their neighborhood grocery.

They don't have to walk across a bridge, though (except in Shadyside).

[greg42]

Gateway Towers seems to get a lot of deliveries, and I don't mean already prepared foods like pizza and chinese. I think Good Apples went under with the whole Right By Nature thing, right? But they had a stop there. And I see deliveries from Shadyside Market sometimes (which from what I've seen in unloading is usually grocery delivery for residents, not catering for business). And Rite Aid, heh, the guy pushes a shopping cart over from Rite Aid, right through Gateway Plaza. Another common site there is the mobile pet grooming van. Tons of small dogs live in that building; I'm guessing this van (which according to the side of it is based in Beaver County somewhere) has multiple customers when they stop by. A lot of the people up there have lived in there for decades and have dealt with it however over the decades. Most of them have cars in there and drive, I think, although a few likely do not. There is a Zipcar that lives outside; guessing they may have snared a few members in the building.

I can just about guarantee most of the Gateway Towers residents are not walking to the Cedar Ave Giant Eagle. It's the wrong location, since the Giant Eagle is up at the level of walking to 9th Street then over the bridge then under the freeway. But if you already lived up at 9th Street, you'd be about half as far. (There are some residences in the 900 block of Penn for example. Bet some of them walk to Giant Eagle. Also, the Lincoln at North Shore folks, but that doesn't count because there's not a bridge. )

I don't think Gateway Towers is a good representative example, though, since there are so many longtime and elderly residents. What are the people at Encore or the Century Building doing? That would be a better sample.

[I_Like_Spam]

Originally Posted by greg42

I don't think Gateway Towers is a good representative example, though, since there are so many longtime and elderly residents. What are the people at Encore or the Century Building doing? That would be a better sample.

Do you know what the lower income residents of town- like those that live in the Keenan Building, May Building and Roosevelt Arms do for groceries?

Many of these folks are senior citizens or disabled people in subsidized digs and really don't have the cash to pay delivery people.

[gg]

Originally Posted by Blackbeauty212

And i wouldnt call 2 listings Countless....Whats even more funny is your attempt to equate the size of Manhattan and DC with Downtown Pittsburgh to prove a point....LOL

I know Manhattan like the back of my hand. You can't walk two blocks without groceries. Even Aspinwall has a little grocery store. I just find it odd downtown Pittsburgh can't even had a little grocery store like Brilliant Market. I find it amazing to be honest.

When I compare the Downtown Pittsburgh to big cities, I am not comparing them as a whole. I mean, I realize Pittsburgh is much smaller, but there are countless places to get groceries in most cities. Pittsburgh's downtown can't support one. That is the point.

[greg42]

Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam

Do you know what the lower income residents of town- like those that live in the Keenan Building, May Building and Roosevelt Arms do for groceries?

Many of these folks are senior citizens or disabled people in subsidized digs and really don't have the cash to pay delivery people.

It's a good question, and I don't know. I would expect most of those folks to not have cars and thus what would they do? A lot of shopping at CVS and Rite Aid, I suspect, sadly. The larger CVS on Forbes/5th has a bit more of a food section.

ACCESS is probably able to get the seniors and disabled to a grocery store: http://www.portauthority.org/PAAC/Cu...1/Default.aspx Maybe some get a cab or jitney occasionally to go elsewhere, or have someone else who can drive them.

[greg42]

Originally Posted by h_curtis

I know Manhattan like the back of my hand. You can't walk two blocks without groceries. Even Aspinwall has a little grocery store. I just find it odd downtown Pittsburgh can't even had a little grocery store like Brilliant Market. I find it amazing to be honest.

When I compare the Downtown Pittsburgh to big cities, I am not comparing them as a whole. I mean, I realize Pittsburgh is much smaller, but there are countless places to get groceries in most cities. Pittsburgh's downtown can't support one. That is the point.

I think it probably could have a store like Brilliant Market at this point, or very soon. I haven't been inside Brilliant Market, but I've seen it and can roughly picture it. Or something along the lines of T-Bones on Rt 910 by I-79, if you know of that place. That's one I've been in.

To a degree, though, this is kind of what Rosebud tried to do. And that didn't work. Although I think you could blame a lot of that on location, the fact that it was way at the end of 7th Street by the river and not where a ton of people would walk by and know it was there. And I'm not sure their mix of products was right. And probably the rent was too damn high.

People get very set in their same old ways, too. Even though people from the Roosevelt could walk there, I wonder how many would have? They may well react to prices being higher and selection being less and go back to taking ACCESS somewhere instead. Apart from some recent new influx over the last 5-10 years, the rest have mainly been living here for a long time. They won't be the ones to embrace the new ideas.

So the focus for another store should probably be mainly on the newer residents of downtown, not necessarily those who have been there forever. If they get some of those, great. But with more new units coming, this could be the time for a store. 400 units are coming online, add that to Encore, Century Building, Penn Garrison, Market Square Place, the condos on First, some others I've forgotten and smaller places, maybe you have enough now if you can just pick out the right location and inventory mix. These Gateway Towers people above me here, they probably wouldn't walk too far, most of 'em. A lot will stay set in their current ways I would think.

You know what would be a good space, except probably too expensive because it's so visible? The vacated Dollar Bank on Stanwix at Forbes. Even that might be too large of a store to start out with though. Too big of a risk.

[ex-burgher]

Downtown Charlotte has a full size grocery store believe it or not.