Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I was a liberal Democrat when I graduated college.
Then I got jobs in Local and Federal Government, and got to see who benefits from government giveaways. And I and my spouse spent 30 years working far too many hours, working our way up from the bottom of the economic heap, losing a fortune to taxes, but never being eligible for any of the "programs" we funded. Similarly, we had elderly poor relatives who paid a fortune in taxes but never got any assistance, other than the minimal Social Security benefits they had paid for, despite being below the poverty line. And we had extended-family relatives who have no work ethic, but are linked into the systems of workers comp, work a bit then go on unemployment, or have a tons of children with no adult in the family willing to work.
I see a system set up to penalize those who work, to pay for those who won't work and who choose to be irresponsible. I see that this system is exactly what politicians want, since they LOVE power and the more "needy" the bigger the budget. I also see the government that has grown to consume a large percentage of the economy creating so many laws and regulations for everything that the average citizen is prevented from doing many of the things that would benefit everyone, such as fixing up your home and hiring people to help you.
In general, I have watched the labor force do nothing but lose ground over my lifetime, while Government grew and Big Business funneled wealth to the very top. I have watched citizens for 35 years try to control the waste and corruption of government, thinking that this were possible in an organization that gets to charge the citizenry anything it wants. I watched the Feds refuse to control immigration and sue to stop the States from trying to keep themselves out of bankruptcy due to educating, jailing and providing health care to illegals.
I think if government were brought back to sane levels, financed only by tarrifs and trade barriers that protect American businesses (like China protects their businesses), we would see massive prosperity and the rebound of the job market. However, if we continue the idea of taxing the few productive people left to pay for a government that supports everyone else, we'll soon end up with nobody working and everyone signing up for free government money.
On my family's level, we could take the money we lost to taxes just last year and buy two new cars to replace the 100,000 mile 10-year old junks we have now. We would hire workers to fix up the yard and paint the house and do a million other things. We would save more for retirement and retirement would be actually possible. And our spending would be multiplied by all the others out there.
Instead, we sent the money to the Town of Exeter and Washington. And the economy is still doomed to stasis until something drastic changes. And the unemployment rate is still 10% and doesn't account for the millions who are unemployed but not counted. And the foreign wars continue to incite terrorism.
The younger you are, the more you have a stake in seeing that America not continue to decline by following the path of Big Government, as all the politicians and extremely-well compensated public employees will try and convince you to do. If you believe that the truly disadvantaged should be taken care of, then you should support a free market economy that maximizes freedom, reduces the burden of taxation, and allows the citizen to keep their own wages and therefore be able to give to charities that specifically service the truly disadvantaged groups like the disabled.
I believe that the government should stay out of peoples personal lives. Its not conservative to legislate morals. If adults aren't hurting anyone with their habits, then I believe they should be left alone to do as they want.
I believe that we should only go to war when congress declares war on a country. Its conservative to follow the constitution, and "military actions" may be loosely tied to the constitution, but its not what our founders had in mind.
I believe that the government shouldn't bail out private financial institutions. I do believe that the government should prevent any company from becoming so large, that if it fails it would disrupt the economy, but that would only be to prevent bailouts as we've seen before.
I believe that we shouldn't have federally mandatory care for anyone. Ronald Reagan was a moron for mandating that ER's have to take care of anyone, regardless of their ability to pay. Then he did the extremely stupid thing of mandating it, without paying for it. This did nothing but create a black market in the healthcare industry that has driven prices to ridiculous levels. If you don't want insurance, then don't pay for it. But don't expect me to pay for your care when you get sick. Choices have consequences.
I don't believe that any private institution should be exempt from paying taxes. That means religious institutions should pay taxes, unless the money they have earned is only used for charity.
These things make me "conservative" to a specific point. But the term conservative has been tied to "Christian" to make the new "Christian conservative", which is now what the Republican party is.
Don't buy into this. Conservative does not mean republican, they have stolen the real meaning.
My conservative friend tells me that the conservatives want a flat tax, cut government jobs across the board federal, state, and local cut the pension for the government and cut social security cut most social programs that support the poor. Pay debt down from 12 trillion to 500 billion use extra revenue for military expansion and conquer more markets with it. Continue social darwinsim and let the weak die and unintellegent people to death because they are burden to this society because of their entitlement programs they use. Is this true with most conservative views? He support Ron Paul all the way. He thinks Pat Buchanan is a hero.
I don't know why he supports Ron Paul, because their views aren't consistent. I know only a few conservatives who support a flat tax, the Fair Tax is more consistent with real conservative principles. No one, other than the handicapped, is so weak that they would die without help. Why do you continue to equate private charity with "social darwinism"?
From FDR to the 1970's Keynesian economics built this country into a super power. It was when trickle down Reaganonmics starting taking hold that the U.S.A. really started sliding backwards.
Thats a problem liberals have they aren't fiscally conservative they keep taxing people not looking at the consequences. I hate that they favor more government workers with outrageous pensions. I like how liberals fight for equality though and look out for the poor unlike the conservatives who promote this social darwinism society.
All of these are 8 years stretches under different administrations
Under George Bush:
During the Bush 43 Administration in 2001 total federal expenditures were 1.8629 trillion dollars. In 2009 total federal expenditures were 3.5177 trillion dollar. So total federal expenditures increased by 88.8%.
Under Ronald Reagan:
During the Ronald Reagan Administration in 1981 total federal expenditures were 678.2 billion dollars. In 1989 total federal expenditures were 1.143trillion dollar. So total federal expenditures increased by 68.53%
Under Richard Nixon - Gerald R. Ford:
During the Nixon and Ford Administrations in 1969 total federal expenditures were 183.6 billion dollars. In 1977 total federal expenditures were 409.2 billion dollar. So total federal expenditures increased by 122.87%
Under Dwight D. Eisenhower
During the Eisenhower Administration in 1953 total federal expenditures were 76.1 billion dollars. In 1961 total federal expenditures were 97.7 billion dollar. So total federal expenditures increased by 28.38%.
Under Bill Clinton:
During the Clinton Administrations in 1993 total federal expenditures were 1.409 trillion dollars. In 2001 total federal expenditures were 1.8629 trillion dollar. So total federal expenditures increased by 32%.
Now all these guys with the exception of Bill Clinton were Conservatives and an argument could be made that President Dwight D. Eisenhower was the least conservative of these Presidents yet he did the best job controlling federal spending.
Since the last Conservative President to control federal spending was President Eistenhower why do you think any modern day Conservative can control government spending?
Last edited by JazzyTallGuy; 10-30-2010 at 05:24 PM..
I believe that the government should stay out of peoples personal lives. Its not conservative to legislate morals. If adults aren't hurting anyone with their habits, then I believe they should be left alone to do as they want.
You would seem to be in the minority when it comes to your Conservative compatriots. The original focus of the Tea Party was on lower government spending and lower taxes. It didn't take long for Social Conservatives to inject themselves into the Tea Party and become very outspoken about abortion, same-sex marriage, and according to some there should be no separation between church and state provided of course it’s a Christian church.
I was a liberal Democrat when I graduated college.
Then I got jobs in Local and Federal Government, and got to see who benefits from government giveaways. And I and my spouse spent 30 years working far too many hours, working our way up from the bottom of the economic heap, losing a fortune to taxes, but never being eligible for any of the "programs" we funded. Similarly, we had elderly poor relatives who paid a fortune in taxes but never got any assistance, other than the minimal Social Security benefits they had paid for, despite being below the poverty line. And we had extended-family relatives who have no work ethic, but are linked into the systems of workers comp, work a bit then go on unemployment, or have a tons of children with no adult in the family willing to work.
I see a system set up to penalize those who work, to pay for those who won't work and who choose to be irresponsible. I see that this system is exactly what politicians want, since they LOVE power and the more "needy" the bigger the budget. I also see the government that has grown to consume a large percentage of the economy creating so many laws and regulations for everything that the average citizen is prevented from doing many of the things that would benefit everyone, such as fixing up your home and hiring people to help you.
In general, I have watched the labor force do nothing but lose ground over my lifetime, while Government grew and Big Business funneled wealth to the very top. I have watched citizens for 35 years try to control the waste and corruption of government, thinking that this were possible in an organization that gets to charge the citizenry anything it wants. I watched the Feds refuse to control immigration and sue to stop the States from trying to keep themselves out of bankruptcy due to educating, jailing and providing health care to illegals.
I think if government were brought back to sane levels, financed only by tarrifs and trade barriers that protect American businesses (like China protects their businesses), we would see massive prosperity and the rebound of the job market. However, if we continue the idea of taxing the few productive people left to pay for a government that supports everyone else, we'll soon end up with nobody working and everyone signing up for free government money.
On my family's level, we could take the money we lost to taxes just last year and buy two new cars to replace the 100,000 mile 10-year old junks we have now. We would hire workers to fix up the yard and paint the house and do a million other things. We would save more for retirement and retirement would be actually possible. And our spending would be multiplied by all the others out there.
Instead, we sent the money to the Town of Exeter and Washington. And the economy is still doomed to stasis until something drastic changes. And the unemployment rate is still 10% and doesn't account for the millions who are unemployed but not counted. And the foreign wars continue to incite terrorism.
The younger you are, the more you have a stake in seeing that America not continue to decline by following the path of Big Government, as all the politicians and extremely-well compensated public employees will try and convince you to do. If you believe that the truly disadvantaged should be taken care of, then you should support a free market economy that maximizes freedom, reduces the burden of taxation, and allows the citizen to keep their own wages and therefore be able to give to charities that specifically service the truly disadvantaged groups like the disabled.
You say you were a Liberal Democrat when you got out of college. From 1968 to 2008 Republican Presidents have been in office for 28 out of those 40 years. Here is the spending record for every two term President in that time span:
Under George Bush:
During the Bush 43 Administration in 2001 total federal expenditures were 1.8629 trillion dollars. In 2009 total federal expenditures were 3.5177 trillion dollar. So total federal expenditures increased by 88.8%.
Under Ronald Reagan:
During the Ronald Reagan Administration in 1981 total federal expenditures were 678.2 billion dollars. In 1989 total federal expenditures were 1.143trillion dollar. So total federal expenditures increased by 68.53%
Under Richard Nixon - Gerald R. Ford:
During the Nixon and Ford Administrations in 1969 total federal expenditures were 183.6 billion dollars. In 1977 total federal expenditures were 409.2 billion dollar. So total federal expenditures increased by 122.87%
Under Bill Clinton:
During the Clinton Administrations in 1993 total federal expenditures were 1.409 trillion dollars. In 2001 total federal expenditures were 1.8629 trillion dollar. So total federal expenditures increased by 32%.
The irony here in the President that did most to control spending during his two terms in office was in fact a Demcrat, President Bill Clinton.
So tell me again why you are supporting Conservatives it certainly hasn't got a damn thing to with their track record.
For example: You want smaller government, and point to the desire to cut taxes and benefits to people, thinking that free market economy takes care of people better, and can point to examples where that's true.
I'm attempting to understand the mindset of the conservative mindset in the USA, as all I've seen in the ads and literature is hate and vitriol, which to be honest, is getting tiresome.
I'd like to know too.
I'd like to know how a "people can take care of people" mindset works when many conservative whites pretend that racial discrimination no longer occurs to the detriment of black people, while continuing to practice such discrimination.
I'd like to know why Conservatives think it is OK for the government to SPEND when there's a Republican president and the spending is for warmongering and nation-building in other parts of the world where we don't belong.
I'd like to know how any Conservative man could be so pompous to think that he can tell a woman what to do with her body (abortion).
I'd like to know why the Conservative party attracts the most racist and bigoted people in this country. These are people who believe for instance that all blacks are inherently lazy and intellectually inferior to whites. These are people who see welfare as a place where only black people reside, people who prefer this system instead of working.
I'd like to know why Conservtives tolerate sharing an ideology with the KKK.
I'd like to know why Conservatives continue to perpetuate low taxes, when Bush showed over 8 years that this approach can turn a surplus into a record deficit.
I'd like to know why Conservatives oppose illegal immigation, when 8 years of Bush's acquiescence of the problem was a clear indication that Conservatives privately utilize the cheaper labor for economic advantage.
I'd like to know if "trickle-down" economics is the best economic theory that Conservatives can come up with. This system has been an utter failure. Can't you Conservatives do better?
I'd like to know why the Conservative Tea Party did not exist during Bush's era. Seems racially-motivated their existence now, and therefore racist.
I'd like to know why Conservatives prefer deregulation, when this leads undersirable results such as predatory lending, racial discrimination across the board, oil spill disasters, food and product recalls, price gauging by oil, gas, electric, cable, and telephone companies.
I'd like to know why Conservatives prefer to be so negative, slamming the other side, without offering ANY workable solutions of their own. Workable and effective Conservatives solutions have been non-existent for at least 18 years going back to Bush's father.
I'd like to know why Conservatives chose to be obstructionists rather than part of the solution just because the man at the helm was not a Republican. Can't you Conservatives ever take the high road?
I'd like to know how an airhead you betcha dingbat advances the credibility and substance of the Conservative party. It appears like McCain's desperate move has caused your party to regress mightily. Her continued presence sets you back a couple centuries. Why aren't you capable of acknowledging this?
I'd like to know where was the outrage when you found out that your leader, Dubya, lied to gain Congressional approval to attack a sovereign nation. Iraq posed no imminent threat to this country and did not provoke this nation. Yet Bush lied and you acquiesced. You then didn't protest when you found out that he lied also about the progress of the war so he could get reelected. You sat quietly and supported him when he said that he needed to be reelected to "finish the job." He didn't finish the job, but nearly finished off THIS country. What is wrong with you Conservatives?
These are some of the questions some of you Conservatives can address in answering the OP's question.
You would seem to be in the minority when it comes to your Conservative compatriots. The original focus of the Tea Party was on lower government spending and lower taxes. It didn't take long for Social Conservatives to inject themselves into the Tea Party and become very outspoken about abortion, same-sex marriage, and according to some there should be no separation between church and state provided of course it’s a Christian church.
Dude I've been a minority conservative for 31 years.
Ronald Reagan stole the name conservative from people who were really small government conservatives in 1978/9. Ever since then, its been like gay people calling themselves heterosexuals.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Excellent question
