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You do know there are two types of citizens listed in the presidential clause. One a natural born Citizen and one a Citizen. They are clearly different in meaning.
Of course. One is a subset of the other. Insert "Duh" here.
You STILL haven't shown where in Calvin's case it was held or ruled that native-birth sufficed to make a natural born subject.
We both know why don't we Frank?
Of course I have. Again and again and again on just about every website you have chased me to to spread your pap.
I'm happy to do so again:
Quote:
Sherley a Frenchman, being in amity with the King, came into England, and joyned with divers subjects of this realm in treason against the Kingand Queen, and the indictment concluded contra ligeant’ suae debitum; for he owed to the King a local obedience, that is, so long as he was within the King’s protection: which local obedience, being but momentary and incertain, is strong enough to make a natural subject; for if he hath issue here, that issue is a natural born subject:a fortiori he that is born under the natural and absolute ligeance of the King (which as it hath been said, is alta ligeantia) as the plaintiff in the case in question was, ought to be a natural born subject; for localis ligeantia est ligeantia infima et minima, et maxime incerta.
Now... as an aside. What is it suddenly with all the Birthers and Creationists on this forum thinking it makes them look cleaver to (wink, wink, nudge, nudge) hint that they know who I actually am? Since I have identified my real identity several times on this forum and elsewhere in the past, it hardly is a sign of anything beyond middling google skills. And my willingness to reveal it pretty much puts the kabosh on any hope they have of intimidation.
I promise you, if I am not terrified to be called by my first name by my wife, an Aussie birther on the Internet is unlikely to get me to blink.
So what is it? Are they actually some how impressed with themselves that they were able to do something my 8 year old niece could manage?
Cause I gotta tell ya... I'm not.
Last edited by HistorianDude; 03-19-2013 at 04:13 PM..
Since Binney said there was NO difference between citizens born of aliens and citizens born of citizens, as long as both are born on US soil, he wasn't recognizing two distinct types of citizens. If they were distinct, then the quality of their citizenship would be distinct. Only BINNEY says they are the SAME. Per your own quote.
I didn't say there were two types of "citizens".
What I said was that Binney, without any objection from the WKA court, i.e. the court gave favor to the quote which THE COURT INTRODUCED, recognized TWO TYPES OF BORN CITIZENS, who were just as much citizens as each other, just like a naturalized alien is also "just as much a citizen" as both the born types.
Binney was only referring to born citizens and made the clear distinction between the TWO types.
It has nothing to do with two, three, four or whatever types of "citizen".
It has to do with the types of BORN citizens.
The TWO TYPES of BORN citizens that Binney, AND THE SUPREME COURT recognized in the Wong Kim Ark case are:
1) "the child of an alien, if born in the country"
2) "the natural born child of a citizen"
You are in denial of this TRUTH because YOU WISH it was not true, and also because of your bigoted stance aimed at furthering your political agenda.
What I said was that Binney, without any objection from the WKA court, i.e. the court gave favor to the quote which THE COURT INTRODUCED, recognized TWO TYPES OF BORN CITIZENS, who were just as much citizens as each other, just like a naturalized alien is also "just as much a citizen" as both the born types.
This is the perfect example of the type of mental gymnastics that birthers have to do in order to twist a ruling to fit their fantasy. Wong Kim Ark did no such thing. They declared that there were only two types of Citizens. Born a citizen and those who are naturalized. There have always been two types and ONLY two types.
the only one in denial here is, You Michael. Even birther sites don't buy your blather.
Coke never one single time refers to the ligeance of any parent. He speaks only of the two participants in the bilateral reciprocal exchange of ligeance for protection; the subject and the king.
There exists in Calvin's Case not a single reference to any "ligeance of a parent."
Complete garbage............. the following excerpts from Lord Coke's report of Calvin's case prove how WRONG you are.
Quote:
Ligeance is a true and faithful obedience of the subject due to his Sovereign.
Quote:
There is found in the law four kinds of ligeances
Now we get to the PARENT part where it is the alien visitor who has local ligeance.
Quote:
The third is ligeantia localis wrought by the law, and that is when an alien that is in amity cometh into England, because as long as he is within England, he is within the King’s protection; therefore so long as he is there, heoweth unto the King a local obedience or ligeance, for that the one (as it hath been said) draweth the other.
[quote]This word ligeance is well expressed by divers several names or synonymia which we find in our books. Sometime it is called the obedience or obeysance of the subject to the King,
Now the alien visitor in the form of a Frenchman who has local ligeance and is therefore a subject, which is proven by the fact that he was indicted for treason.
Coke gives the alien Frenchman the circumstance of being not only a subject with local LIGEANCE, but alsoa PARENT to a local, native-born child.
Quote:
Concerning the local obedience, it is observable, that as there is a local protection on the King’s part, so there is a local ligeance of the subject’s part. And this appeareth in 4 Mar. Br. 32. and 3 and 4 Ph. and Mar. Dyer 144. Sherley a Frenchman, being in amity with the King, came into England, and joyned with divers subjects of this realm in treason against the Kingand Queen, and the indictment concluded contra ligeant’ suae debitum;51 for he owed to the King a local obedience, that is, so long as he was within the King’s protection: which local obedience, being but momentary and incertain, is strong enough to make a natural subject; for if he hath issue here, that issue is a natural born subject:
51 [Ed.: against the duty of hisallegiance.]
Quote:
There be regulary (unlesse it be in special cases) three incidents to a subject born.
1. That the PARENTS be under the actual obedience of the king.
2. That the place of his birth be within the king’s dominion.
And 3. the time of his birth is chiefly to be considered
So as you can see Frank ................ YOU ARE WRONG!
I know it's difficult for you Frank, to be so wrong after all those thousand of hours and blog posts, all done the gurgler, to find out that all your hard work has been based on lies, either that or you have been a useful idiot, blindly following what someone has told you.
It's not the end of the world, it's only the end of a lie, you'll get over it.
"All of our Presidents have, to date, been born in the 50 states. Notably, President Obama was born in the state of Hawaii, and so is clearly a natural born citizen."
-sandra day o'conner
Yes. If he was born in Hawaii. Anyone physicaly born in the United States is eligible to be president regardless of the citizenship of their parents. If a person is born outside the US, he is not eligible.
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