Do you miss the era before the smoking bans? (ideologies, politician, party)

[Roadking2003]

Originally Posted by Samus Aran

I'm sure it sucks for smokers, but it is nicer for everyone else.

Enjoy for now. Sooner or later Big Government will ban something you like.

[justNancy]

Originally Posted by Nomander

You just let people infringe on each other until their own self interests have restricted the bulk of society. Then you step in, proclaim yourself their dictator (or ruling faction) and kill anyone who objects (which most won't with any veracity as they have conditioned themselves to accept such infringements).

Apparently you don't think your bad habit is an infringement on my rights.

Originally Posted by GuyNTexas

Out of the mouths of liberal Nazi monster babes

Unfortunately, most victims of Nazis didn't have babies, since they were all murdered. When people bring up Nazi Germany and Adolph Hitler in discussions, I can never take anything they write seriously.

In Florida we went to the polls and VOTED for the smoking ban. Only a fool would talk about the government taking away our freedoms when the majority VOTED for a bill, but I hear the same complaint from smokers in Florida. What's funny is when they tell me, "Well, I don't vote!"

In fact, the bill passed by over 70%. It's the same as when I hear someone call Obama a dictator and say he doesn't belong in the White House. One woman said to me "I don't know what he's doing there!" I tried to explain that over 65 million Americans voted for him, but she just didn't get it.

Originally Posted by Roadking2003

Enjoy for now. Sooner or later Big Government will ban something you like.

If what I enjoy doing makes other people sick, then I guess it will be a decision I'll have to accept. Let's say I like driving very fast. There are rules that tell me I can't do that. Funny how that goes, isn't it? I know some people who enjoy sunbathing in the nude, and they're not hurting anyone! However, they can't do that either. We've always had laws that prevented us from doing one thing or another. This isn't anything new.

[GuyNTexas]

Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth

Is anyone alarmed at how callous smokers are toward their own children's health? They have no qualms about forcing their kids to breath clouds of second-hand smoke (the worst is in a car with the windows closed). That seems narcissistic to an extreme.

Me thinks this is just another example of extreme exaggeration that seems to ooze from the pores of leftist self anointed, since I don't know a single soul who smokes in a car with children, or with the windows closed.

In any case, this deep concern for children strikes me as rather phony, coming from the enthusiastically pro-choice liberal crowd, which easily fits into the category of callous narcissism.

[justNancy]

Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth

Is anyone alarmed at how callous smokers are toward their own children's health? They have no qualms about forcing their kids to breath clouds of second-hand smoke (the worst is in a car with the windows closed). That seems narcissistic to an extreme.

What about a pregnant woman smoking? It disgusts me! Sure, someone will always say "My mother smoked and I turned out just fine." I just can't imagine smoking while you're pregnant, knowing it can lead to lower birth weight and other complications.

[GuyNTexas]

Originally Posted by Jaggy001

Having read your various posts (rants?), I can now understand why banning tobacco has become necessary. I hope more reasonable smokers can understand that it is a minority of zealots such as yourself that has caused them to be inconvenienced.

My "rants" are directly attributable to those of your self righteous ilk, who actually feel you have a right to impose your beliefs and choices on everyone else, by force.

The reality is, you have no such right, and you are no more important than a hobo sleeping under a bridge, nor are your wants and desires any more worthy than other's.

[GuyNTexas]

Originally Posted by justNancy

What about a pregnant woman smoking? It disgusts me! Sure, someone will always say "My mother smoked and I turned out just fine." I just can't imagine smoking while you're pregnant, knowing it can lead to lower birth weight and other complications.

Ah yes, but you'll not hesitate to inject them with dozens of poisons moments after birth, because you've been trained to believe such a thing is actually healthy.

Autism is skyrocketing in children from such stupidity, but a cigarette is now a weapon of mass destruction?

Brilliant.

[Chatteress]

Originally Posted by Ceece

Not a bit. I love living in CA where the smoking bans have been in place for a long time. Even smokers don't seem to mind since it makes everything fresher and cleaner and healthier.

Amen

I spent a few days in Las Vegas where smoking was allowed indoors and after two days, I could barely see as my eyes were burning like crazy. Avoiding the smoke was nearly impossible as you were forced to walk through the casinos to get in and out of the hotel Oh, it was so nice to be back in California and have smoke-free air to breathe. So no ... I don't miss the era prior to smoking bans at all

[Chatteress]

Originally Posted by majoun

And obesity isn't?

Before it was proven that cigarettes caused cancer, doctors used to recommend that their patients smoke in order to lose weight.

There is a correlation between the decline in smoking and the rise in obesity.

Yeah but obesity does not pollute the air around others ...

[GuyNTexas]

Originally Posted by justNancy

Unfortunately, most victims of Nazis didn't have babies, since they were all murdered. When people bring up Nazi Germany and Adolph Hitler in discussions, I can never take anything they write seriously.

You know, you lefties are a very frustrating bunch to try to reason with. I use the Nazi reference because it's the most appropriate descriptor for how you all think and behave. Of course you don't think of yourselves as Nazi like, because you all don't really spend much time thinking. And as I said previously, the FIRST anti-smoking campaign ever instituted was done by Hitler in Nazi Germany, and there was a good reason for mentioning that.

Now, do you think Hitler did that because he cared so much about people's health? Or might the thought occur to you, that given what we know about him, suggests that he might have had other reasons .. another agenda ... having nothing to do with public health? Does this concept of underlying agendas even register with you? Since you admit that the mere mention of Nazis causes you to switch off your brain, perhaps nothing can register.

Originally Posted by justNancy

In Florida we went to the polls and VOTED for the smoking ban. Only a fool would talk about the government taking away our freedoms when the majority VOTED for a bill, but I hear the same complaint from smokers in Florida. What's funny is when they tell me, "Well, I don't vote!"

This is a classic case of how delusional and self destructive you on the left really are. The truth is, and I'm sorry to break it to you, but you're all manipulated sheep who are not acting on your own thoughts and beliefs, but on one's given you. You actually think that these politicians care about your desires and your health! I PROMISE YOU .. they don't give a damn about you. To them, you're nothing more than as a potential vote, a source of tax revenue, and you occasionally come in handy when they need a large group of useful idiots to support programs who's real agenda you don't even know exist. Oh, you think you know, but that's the insidious nature of this manipulation, which easily convinces you to believe that such things as smoking bans are in your best interests, when the exact opposite is actually the case.

Originally Posted by justNancy

In fact, the bill passed by over 70%. It's the same as when I hear someone call Obama a dictator and say he doesn't belong in the White House. One woman said to me "I don't know what he's doing there!" I tried to explain that over 65 million Americans voted for him, but she just didn't get it.

No .. you don't get it. After 8 years of Bush Jr., Charles Manson could have won the election ... and what do the republicans do? They dust off that walking talking corpse .. John McCain .... a Bush minion and apologist, who isn't qualified to be a dog catcher. So, we had a dead man going up against a charismatic, slick talking teleprompter reader with a boatload of promises of hope and change, and a lot of people bought this BS, hook, line and sinker. The frightening thing is .... many of them, which apparently includes you, are still buying it, and there is NO EXCUSE for that!

Originally Posted by justNancy

If what I enjoy doing makes other people sick, then I guess it will be a decision I'll have to accept. Let's say I like driving very fast. There are rules that tell me I can't do that. Funny how that goes, isn't it? I know some people who enjoy sunbathing in the nude, and they're not hurting anyone! However, they can't do that either. We've always had laws that prevented us from doing one thing or another. This isn't anything new.

I don't know how old you are, but things are FAR DIFFERENT than they were just 20 years ago, and that was bad compared to times before that. We've got TSA molesting people in the airports, and now on the streets too. We've got thousands of videos showing police brutalizing citizens across the nation. We've got federal thugs SWATT teaming organic farmers while Monsanto is destroying the biosphere with GMO. We've got these green idiots believing that CO2 is a deadly poison ....and each day that passes, we see more evidence (like NDAA) for a total lock down, full blown authoritarian police state unfolding before our very eyes ... and the reason for all this is very simple. There are too many people who think they are thinking, when they really aren't thinking at all ... just like you.

[GuyNTexas]

What I'm about to point out will no doubt be automatically dismissed by many non smokers and smokers too, because neither group is immune to the psychological effects propaganda campaigns have regarding perceptions and what people believe is true, which often includes being totally convinced about certain truths that are in reality, flat out lies. And there are few topics that match the amount of misinformation and deliberate deception as has been presented about the dangers of smoking and particularly, the health risks of second hand smoke.

Before I get into that, it's important for people to think. Stop believing everything you are told, simply because it is repeated over and over again. Such repetition and consistency doesn't make a thing true ... but it often results in convincing many people to believe something that is absolutely untrue. And stop being so attached to current beliefs that it precludes you from considering new information which might challenge those beliefs. Doing this only assures that you have no hope of ever being smarter and better informed tomorrow than you are today, and that is intellectual stagnation. Such behavior is not the mark of intelligence, but of willful ignorance.

Additionally, when assessing the nature of programs and campaigns such as the anti-smoking agenda, one needs to consider motives, and whether the advertised or insinuated motive actually makes sense. If it doesn't make sense, then the likelihood is, there is at least one other objective or unspoken agenda as the real motive, that you may not be aware of.

As advertised, the anti smoking agenda is clear. The campaign has one direct goal of reducing smoking, ostensibly for public health reasons. But that begs the question ... do you believe that government really cares about your health? Do you believe that mainstream medicine really wants to prevent or eliminate that which the industry itself relies on for it's survival and growth? Treating disease is the money tree for the health care industry, not prevention, therefore, it is unlikely that their support of anti smoking campaigns would be related to preventing disease and enhancing health.

For all of the non smokers out there who fear second hand smoke, STOP worrying .... contrary to the outrageous claims of the EPA and FDA and CDC regarding this grave danger, nothing could be further from the truth ... and the truth is, no matter how shocking or unbelievable this might be, there is not one shred of legitimate evidence that second hand tobacco smoke poses any health risks whatsoever ... not a shred. And these facts have been revealed in actual court cases, and acknowledged by Judges.

To better understand this, it's improtant to understand the numbers used to indicate relative health risks, which begin at 1.0 (which means no risk), and that most experts do not consider anything below 3.0 - 4.0 as posing any significant risk.

The actual studies done regarding second hand tobacco smoke show a relative risk factor of 1.19 ... by contrast, drinking whole milk shows the relative risk factor for cancer as 1.3. Neither of these figures indicate a real risk, let alone a significant threat, even though the data shows that whole milk presents a greater risk than does second hand tobacco smoke.

Here are several facts which contradict everything most people believe about smoking and second hand smoke:

Smoke scams: Report on Epidemiological Studies, Court Cases

Now, it's late, and I'm tired, and to adequately cover this topic would take hours and several pages just to cover it half way .... but for now ... the overall point is that what you think you know to be true about smoking is almost certain to be a flat out lie, or a greatly exaggerated distortion.

From the obvious points that should need no expert analysis to understand, like the explosion in incidence rates of respiratory illnesses today, including COPD, while the number of people smoking has been steadily declining ...to the shear idiocy of believing that second hand smoke is actually more dangerous than first hand smoke, as has been suggested, try to think ... such anti-intuitive nonsense shouldn't be allowed to go un-scrutinized ... and reality needs to be checked when such asinine claims are made.

Our government agencies like the FDA and EPA have been caught lying so many times now, it's amazing that people continue to grant them automatic credibility, rather than viewing what they claim with extreme skepticism. Why would people automatically dismiss a claim that they are manipulating the data and the statistics to exaggerate the dangers of smoking for political reasons, when we have so many instances of them doing just that with regard to so many other issues?

Think people! ...use your heads for something other than a storage device for downloading and saving government propaganda!