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Old 12-14-2012, 12:07 PM
 
Location: Palo Alto
12,149 posts, read 8,418,303 times
Reputation: 4190

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Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost View Post
Obama is against increase in tax cuts to incomes below $250K. Republicans are the ones opposed to the idea, unless incomes above $250K are also protected.
The rates simply revert to the Clinton rates. Clinton is a liberal God who balanced the budget. Quit your whining.
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Old 12-14-2012, 12:08 PM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,818,277 times
Reputation: 12341
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrapperJohn View Post
The rates simply revert to the Clinton rates. Clinton is a liberal God who balanced the budget. Quit your whining.
Either you don't understand what IS whining or you've mistakenly responded to my post. But thanks for letting us know that you understand, that if republicans succeed in holding tax cuts for up to $250K hostage to serve those who make more than that, we will see Clinton rates.
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Old 12-14-2012, 12:11 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,026 posts, read 44,824,472 times
Reputation: 13713
Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost View Post
Do you think it is more expensive to buy insurance than to use ER as a clinic?
Depends on whether the care recipient has to pay.
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Old 12-14-2012, 12:13 PM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,818,277 times
Reputation: 12341
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Depends on whether the care recipient has to pay.
Hospitals don't operate on "Has to pay". They deal with the realities of the fraction that is paid. The rest of it is passed down to others.
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Old 12-14-2012, 12:18 PM
 
7,359 posts, read 5,463,530 times
Reputation: 3142
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrapperJohn View Post
The rates simply revert to the Clinton rates. Clinton is a liberal God who balanced the budget. Quit your whining.
If Clinton balanced the budget then why was the national debt 1.5 trillion higher at the end of his administration than it was at the beginning?

The myth that Clinton balanced the budget comes from judging paper instead of reality. Clinton had a piece of paper saying the budget was balanced but in reality the government spent more than it took in. In other words, he wrote a balanced budget but then didn't stick to it. The reality is that the closest to balanced that it got under Clinton was a 23 billion dollar deficit.
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Old 12-14-2012, 12:21 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,026 posts, read 44,824,472 times
Reputation: 13713
Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost View Post
Hospitals don't operate on "Has to pay". They deal with the realities of the fraction that is paid. The rest of it is passed down to others.
The perspective is completely different to the care recipient. Some pay. Some don't. Which case is less expensive to the recipient?
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Old 12-14-2012, 12:27 PM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,818,277 times
Reputation: 12341
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
The perspective is completely different to the care recipient. Some pay. Some don't. Which case is less expensive to the recipient?
Some pay in full, some pay in part, some don't pay at all. Hospitals don't like to write off these losses as "charity". They make up for these costs elsewhere... higher costs of treatment (leading to higher cost of insurance).

Hospitals traditionally tried to recover emergency-room losses in money-earning hospital departments such as surgery, but that option is closing as private surgery centers take a bigger share of the market.

Hospitals have little choice but to pass the unpaid bills on to consumers in higher charges, Wright says.

As hospital costs rise, the price of insurance climbs. Double-digit premium increases in recent years have forced employers to look for ways to hold down health-insurance costs.


Unpaid ER Bills increase costs for paying patients (an article from 2003)

I believe it was Kaiser Family Foundation that did a study a few years ago about wasteful spending in health care system. About $200 Billion/year in wasteful spending was attributed to ER... costs that don't just disappear.
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Old 12-14-2012, 12:28 PM
 
Location: Washington, DC
2,010 posts, read 3,459,112 times
Reputation: 1375
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Now, yes. Under ObamaCare, no. ObamaCare has essentially guaranteed that employers will cast off their employees who will then be forced to purchase mandated health insurance provided by government exchanges. That will ultimately cost employees much more than they currently pay for health insurance.
That's a gross mischaracterization. I explained two scenarios earlier of a type of employer that is relatively unaffected by ACA's employer responsibility provisions (like me), and an employer who would be. It's going to affect businesses differently depending on their employee mix, coverage offered and size of company.
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Old 12-14-2012, 12:31 PM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,818,277 times
Reputation: 12341
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidkaos2 View Post
If Clinton balanced the budget then why was the national debt 1.5 trillion higher at the end of his administration than it was at the beginning?
Well, debt is more than just deficit. If we perfectly balanced the budget next year, debt will still grow. Besides, Clinton was in office for eight years, and I don't recall anybody claiming all eight fiscal years with no budget deficits.
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Old 12-14-2012, 12:33 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,026 posts, read 44,824,472 times
Reputation: 13713
Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost View Post
Some pay in full, some pay in part, some don't pay at all. Hospitals don't like to write off these losses as "charity". They make up for these costs elsewhere... higher costs of treatment (leading to higher cost of insurance).
AND higher ER charges. So we're back to which is least expensive. Obviously, those experiencing the least expense are those who don't pay for the services they receive. Who is that?
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